Morality and LSD

so this forum has really kinda been boring me lately... so lets see if maybe i can get a few interesting topics going.

so i guess ultimatly lsd leads a person to revelations which might lead to a better way of living one's life. but is one way of living life really any better than any other? it is all really just a difference in biases an prejudices. is one prejudice really any better than any other?

does lsd lead to a more positive morailty?

 

In a word no. Think of some of the class acts that we see pass through the forums, Peter Popper comes to mind.
It is what the person takes into it that will largely dictate what they get out of it. For some it does lead to a life changing event for the moral better. For others it's just a party.
Also the pre-trip education a person has regarding LSD has a lot to do with it.
If a person is knowledgeable and interested in spiritual/moral aspects of life they are going to have a different experience than someone who just views LSD as a way to see pretty patterns and hallucinate.
I found mescaline to be less visual than LSD or mushrooms, yet I feel it is the best psychedelic experience I have encountered to date because of the frame of mind it put me in.

Then of course you have the whole quagmire of who's definition of morality are you talking about? I dont even want to touch that steaming pile at this time.

 

No, it just has the LSD effect on you.

This is far from being always "beneficial" to the average joe's eyes. Think of all the people who flirted with acid and completely dropped out and tuned out of society.

Your answer is dependent on who you're asking to assess quality of life.

It's a neutral chemical tool, it doesn't care about your life or your plans and it doesn't have a plan for you. It can just change your mind. that's it.

 

i think it's a similar question to asking if education is beneficial- it most definitely can be, but in reality, isn't always.

the way i think of it is: there are some people who can have something happen in their life and not learn from it. we don't always learn from the things that you would think should teach us something, you know? we don't always look closely at those things that are important. LSD is just another experience that, when it's over, we can either choose to learn form it, or not.

LSD is education because education is exposure to something new, but with that exposure you also need some sort of structure and guidance if it's going to mean anything in the long run. LSD is exposure to a way of thinking that we really can't find anywhere else.

as far as what's "right", that's true that there really isn't a universal "one way" of doing things... the best we can do as people is to know ourselves intimately and honestly enough to trust that we are able to do the right thing as we see it (what other choice do we have?), but most importantly that we actually DO it. being able is easy, actually doing it is what's important.

 

i think it's a similar question to asking if education is beneficial- it most definitely can be, but in reality, isn't always.

the way i think of it is: there are some people who can have something happen in their life and not learn from it. we don't always learn from the things that you would think should teach us something, you know? we don't always look closely at those things that are important. LSD is just another experience that, when it's over, we can either choose to learn form it, or not.

LSD is education because education is exposure to something new, but with that exposure you also need some sort of structure and guidance if it's going to mean anything in the long run. LSD is exposure to a way of thinking that we really can't find anywhere else. but it's not going to "give" you education, the "learning" part is all up to you.

as far as what's "right", that's true that there really isn't a universal "one way" of doing things... the best we can do as people is to know ourselves intimately and honestly enough to trust that we are able to do the right thing as we see it (what other choice do we have?), but most importantly that we actually DO it. being able is easy, actually doing it is what's important.

 

no, not necessarily..

the guy who abducted that girl for like 18 years and kept her in his backyard would drop acid and rape her... charles manson is another example that comes to mind...

it depends who takes it, and how they handle/interpret it... i dont think there is a real answer to this question..

 

mostly a great party for me---had a life changing experience when my friend gave me a massive ammt of mescaline----saw the white light blissed out and learned that humans were like a cancer cell an out of control growth on the planet that didnt benefit the organism---quit working for a few years cas of that trip iwas doing construction which is destruction--waste of resources and actually scarring the earth----became 100% pot acid mescaline dealer for years----then degenerated into speed dealing which totally went against what i learned---so yeah had a life change good at first then just hedonism--sex drugs and rock and roll----and the spirituality faded--sigh what a waste

 

well keep in mind that for ANY rule, theres an exception... anecdotes of one or two or twenty people who arent moral and also take acid doesnt mean that acid doesnt lead to a positive morality... everything anyone says has that "goes without saying" element of "as far as we know currently, and as far as i can tell you, this is what ive determined..." followed by our statements. nothing is absolute but there are tendencies. it is hard to get a poll though of what exactly makes "better" morality, and whether its attributable to acid.

i just wanted to add also that LSD is an experience like others are not... reading a book, going on a date, these are experiences within our own mind but the LSD experience actually changes the foundation from which we see everything else. it is literally like experiencing THE experience

 

not neccessarily. LSD doesn't always lead to revelations. and in the cases that it does, those revelations do not always lead to a "better life"

of course not. you can't say that any way that someone lives thier life is "better" than another way of living life. It IS just a difference of prejudices, becasue if you say your life is better than someone elses you have to use some sort of standard, and stardards always present biases.

NO. LSD can cause revelations; revelations which in some cases can cause people to seek a different life than many others may choose, but does LSD necessarily lead to a better life? no

lol, why you raggin Peeter Popper

 

I was gonna take a shit on PP too but changed my mind

 

LOL@peterpopper

when i see a thread of his in the LSD forum, i cant resist opening it

 

Because he's an asshole.
But he also is someone everyone here is aware of and he definitly proves that just taking LSD doesn't lead to a moral type of life. I think we are all in agreement about sexually assualting some drunk out of her mind girl and laughing and bragging about it isn't the highest moral behavior regardless of your belief system.
End of story.

 

but you cant deny that hes an entertaining dude sometimes.

 

No, I just think he is low life scum and hope he ends up in jail getting raped by someone twice his size with a 10" cock.

 

Hmm, I don't know this Peeter Popper guy, and it seems like this topic may get de-railed into that direction, but regardless I agree with what everybody else is saying. No acid does not definitely cause or deter better morality. Acid is just a chemical that changes our way of thinking, it's always up to the person to change their morality. Of course acid could be a catalyst for cleaning up a person's act but, it could also just be something a person does just for the high. And there is the case of Charles Manson who used it as a mind control device very effectively, I'd say that's morally bad. It's all in the person.

But I can maybe understand people being that way with acid; just taking it to get high, because in my experience, it's always been way more euphoric than mushrooms. I know this kid that just eats mushrooms as a party drug though, which I can't understand at all. In the two times I've eaten mushrooms, I had an amazing feeling of being one with the everything and everyone, and a feelings of absolute dread, paranoia, and panic. But I think if he keeps eating mushrooms just for the fun, he may end up getting a little more than he bargained for one of these days!

 

No LSD definetely does not lead to a better or more moral life. It can though. Everybody has their own interpretations of whats right and whats wrong. But I think most peoples interpretations of whats right and whats wrong is something learned from society and its rules. LSD can help you think for yourself and follow your heart to know what is right and wrong instead of following what society says is right or wrong.

 

What psychedelics do is they don't really do anything in regards to social mores and morality. When used with the intention of personal exploration and growth they present the user with their own personal moralistic barometer and we end up judging and weighing our own behavior by a more altruistic and selfless perspective and are often able to see how our behavior and interactions with others may be self serving and selfish. I feel that is the main way in which they can facilitate positive changes in a persons life.

The positive changes resulting from a psychedelic experience don't come about because the trip was all puppy dogs and daisy's with beautiful rainbows thrown in. Usually it is the result of some really harsh and thorough self assessment and getting slapped upside the head with your own shortcomings as a human creature.
Bad trips are often the most transformational. That harsh mirror of LSD is why it was so successful in treating alcoholism and other addictions. Often the person was oblivious to the way their actions were adversely effecting those around them, and LSD forced that realization upon them.

 

Thisx2.

 

"Have compassion for all beings, rich and poor alike, each has their suffering. Some suffer too much, others too litttle."

don't be so quick to deal out judgement, because even the wise cannot see all ends.

so the first quote is from buddha, and the second gandalf says something to the effect of in lotr, lol. i hate to quote lotr, but it's true. you shouldnt be so quick to judge, if at all. some people live fates that they don't deserve, others live a fate that they are not deserving of. do you really have the authority to give it to them?

which i guess brings us back to the issue of subjective morality. is there really an objective standard to go against? or is it all just subjective. is it really wrong to judge a man, or is it even wrong the way that someone that has different prejudices than you leads their life -- like you two and peter popper? i mean i'm sure that we can all agree that it is better to live one's life by love rather than fear and hate, better to help rather than to judge and kill, better to be selfless, and a series of other positive traits that are stressed by most religions.

 

No ones suffering is special and there are no magic bullets, not excluding LSD. We deal in energy systems which are governed by chemistry and joules. All tales of morality and special significance are myths about the nature of human beings.
Some will suggest that this statement is without humanity or "moral compass".
The truth is that a mind without anxiety is wholly kind. The accusations of moral conscience are unnecessarily brutal.