despite what we know of christianitys beginnings, it still lives... how? why?

i am just interested to know why christianity is still taken seriously, despite what we have learned of its corrupt history/beginnings... council of nicea etc...

 

You must understand, mon cher, Christianity is different for it's mental invention of changes and beginnings and Ends that are in most cases only projects of the ministry, and the souls of it's people which never knows it's beginning for the end of the subject of man failing OR succeeding. The people may come and pass for the ideal object of, at the same time, a correspondingly False World.

 

i wish i could understand what you just said b'cos it sounds interesting...

 

The thing is the beginnings of Christianity started in the first century with Jesus and his disciples. Then the Bible says that Apostates would come and mislead many. So much of what you describe are the workings of those Apostates. Whereas True Christianity unaffected by that Apostasy, still exists today.

 

cats in modern society want something to believe in man, mundane life in all of it's ecentricities is just too cruel and painful for most to deal with. They need an escape and thats what Christianity in all of it's cunning and glory offers. Ehh well thats the first type of reason, the second is something called hereditary ingraining, which can simply be explained like this. Mom and Pa are christians + young naive child = Future Christian adult. Now take note this second senario isn't always true but in many cases if you ask a christian or other religious person why the dig what they dig, thats got something to do with it.

 

thanks OWB can you, or anyone, tell me if that was written in the New Testament or the Old? (about the Apostates misleading many)... how were the misleading Apostates identified and who were they?

 

Not to start an arguement or anything but I'd like to point out some interesting facts man, first off the 4 gospels that are in the new testement as we now know it were all written at least 40-80 years after Jesus' death. There are actually well over 40 gospels (persay) including the apostalic gospels. But the other 36 some odd gospels say nothing of Jesus being the messiah or even the son of god. I would also like to point out that even in the Apostalic gospels Jesus himself never says he is God nor the son of God, Peter is the first to say that. These other 36 some gospels are known collectivly as the Dead Sea Scrolls and the Gnostic Gospels.

Second is the fact that the only NT gospels that were written by someone who knew Jesus were John and Matthew. And there's no proof that John or Matt actually wrote those gospels. Matthew was a tax collector who was recruited by Jesus, and John was supposdly his brother John the Beloved. Luke was Paul's personal physician and Mark was one of Paul's followers. So half the NT gospels were written by people who got second hand knowledge of Jesus

 

Jesus is not God but he did say he was the Son of God.(John 10:36)

If you do not believe in God and that the Bible is the word of God, what difference does it make what was written, by who or why but if you do believe in God and believe that the Bible is God's word don't think that God could control what is in the Bible and what is not in the Bible?

 

Here are some NT Scriptures that indicate that there would be Apostates also in Matthew it indicates how to recognize them.

“Be on the watch for the false prophets that come to YOU in sheep’s covering, but inside they are ravenous wolves. By their fruits YOU will recognize them. Never do people gather grapes from thorns or figs from thistles, do they? Likewise every good tree produces fine fruit, but every rotten tree produces worthless fruit; a good tree cannot bear worthless fruit, neither can a rotten tree produce fine fruit. Every tree not producing fine fruit gets cut down and thrown into the fire. Really, then, by their fruits YOU will recognize those [men]. (Matthew 7:15-20)

I know that after my going away oppressive wolves will enter in among YOU and will not treat the flock with tenderness, and from among YOU yourselves men will rise and speak twisted things to draw away the disciples after themselves. (Acts 20:29-30)

However, there also came to be false prophets among the people, as there will also be false teachers among YOU. These very ones will quietly bring in destructive sects and will disown even the owner that bought them, bringing speedy destruction upon themselves. (2 Peter 2:1)

 

ok... thanks OWB ... i can see how people would make sense of it like that... i am confused by what you said about Christianitys' beginnings in the first cent. AD though... if that is the case, why does the Old Testament still hold sway, as it was written way back? Surely Christianitys' beginnings were proto-Christian... ie Gnostic?

 

Quite simply, it tells people what they want to hear.

 

In my experience, it tells people what they don't want to hear so people end up changing its message around to something more desirable. I would say that this is a reason why so many divisions have propped up over the centuries; this need to change what was said by their spiritual leader to something they would rather hear

 

Did you think I was talking about the Bible? I was not. It's the edited message that defines Christianity today.

 

The credulous mind is where religion calls home.

 

I guess it depends on how you view the Bible.

If you view it as man's writings, then I could see the viewpoint of the Hebrew Scriptures being old and outdated but if you view the Bible as God's Word then much can be learned from what God had to say to his people before Christ came.

Even Jesus said that none of what was written would pass away until it was all fulfilled.

I not that familiar with all the the terminology and how it applies, so I'm not really sure what you're asking here.

 

people follow cults---cult mentality---book has been written rewritten edited--abridged censored and peeps still think its the word of god--id like to get my hands on gosple written b4 the council of nicea--watered it down so it wouldn be so offensive as Romes new state religion---Christmas is a pagan holiday winter solstice or some shit christianity has coopted every religion it ever came across---almost every saint day or christian holy day is derived from some sort of pagan worship----believe on believers--the white man goes to his "house " and talks about god the Native American goes into his teepee and talks to god---which is more valid? u know what i think

 

Actually you are quite right about the "holidays" that's why those Christians that follow the example of the 1st century Christians don't celebrate them.

 

Then why aren't you religious?

 

A few things:

1) The Dead Sea Scrolls are not gospels but writings of the Hebrew Scriptures.

2) So what is the gospels we consider canonical were written that far after Jesus' death and resurrection if the teachings are still apostolic.

3)Yes there were other "gospels" but they were not used and believed like the 4 we have. They did not reflect true apostolic teaching (some were written well into the 200's) and present a disjuncture withttp://www.hipforums.com/newforums/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=6035409h the Hebrew Scriptures. They did not reflect the Tradition of faith handed down from the apostles.

4) Mark is believed to have been written by a disciple of Peter, not Paul. Mark may also have been the "naked man" in the garden that is only presented in Mark's gospel. It is just so odd that why else would it have been included unless it was the author.

5) Gnosticism was a esoteric religious culture that developed in and after the second century. It was not "Christian". there was gnosticism in other religions and cultures as well.

6) Jesus didn't have brothers as we understand the term. Otherwise he would not have to give his mother to the beloved disciple. If it was her own son, it would have been assumed (I hope!) John 19:25-27.

7) I am curious how the beginnings of Christianity were corrupt.

8) I am curious how "Christianity" is corrupt, and not just people. It seems to me that people conflate the sinful people (whom are almost destined to be corrupt) with the Teachings, Sacraments, and Faith of the Church.

9) Re "so people end up changing its message around to something more desirable":...and who do you think were the originators of the novelties and division within the universal Church?

 

I was going to touch on some of the others but it's getting late and we've already touched on them a bit before.

But here, I do believe that Jesus had half brothers and sisters, as we understand them.(Matthew 13:55-56) (Matthew 12:46-50)

As for why Jesus asked his beloved disciple to take care of his mother, perhaps Jesus' fleshly brothers were not yet his spiritual bothers and so assigned a spiritual brother to take care of his mother.