The re-branding of the right

Some time ago I wrote something on the fall of the neo-conservative faction on the right and speculated on what might grow to take it’s place.

Neo-cons fall, who’ll rise on the right?
http://www.hipforums.com/newforums/showthread.php?t=333692&f=36

My view was that right wing libertarianism might be the way might be a way of right wingers distancing themselves from the failed policies of their Republican predecessors.

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Now it is very interesting to me that people are coming to the forums with right wing views and a right wing philosophical outlook but who are claiming they are not right wingers – oh no – they’re libertarians.

I wonder how much this phenomena is spreading in the US?

 

The "libertarian" aspect of right wing politics has always been strong. It was only 20-25 years ago that the evangelical wing began to take over and then the neo-con wing.

The right took a hard stance on things like the bailouts and such, but when looking at the big picture, especially with Michael Steele being elected RNC chairmen, the right is going more towards the center, that's where the states are going.

Britain however is going to the right, your buddies the torries are going to win the next election no doubt. And 2 BNP members elected as MEP, wtf. See now that's right wing politics

 

DEFINE YOUR IDEA OF RIGHT WING.

DEFINE YOUR IDEA OF LIBERTARIAN.

DEFINE "RIGHT WING LIBERTARIAN" and be PRECISE.

Otherwise no one will know how to answer your question.

 

I hope you're right. I also hope libertarians KEEP trying to distance themselves from the theocrat hypocrites who have been running Washington for the last eight years.

PS: Bob Barr sucks.

 

You sound like Balbus.

 

If you believe that same sex couples should be able to form partnerships, with the same legal rights as heterosexuals, you are right wing.

If you believe in a woman's right to abortion, you are right wing.

If you believe prostitution should be legal, you are right wing.

If you believe marijauna should be legal, you are right wing.

If you believe the state has no business promoting religion, you are right wing.

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If any of this confuses you, please report to your nearest socialist reeducation center.

 

Stop thinking!!!



Freedom is slavery!!!

 

Well I think Balbus secretly desires to live on Airstrip One, so freedom is slavery

And this is all true. I think it comes down to negative vs positive rights, we see it as something that a person should naturally have to begin with, government interference is not needed because it's born right that the government doesn't need to tweak with to begin with. Balbus wants some kind of awesome government granted rights where your rights are given to you and regulated by the government

 

Wait...




Isn't that exactly what those Lucifer-worshiping Illuminati want?!?

 

Fight fire with fire.

 

A little something from Wikkipedia:

The Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy states "libertarianism holds that agents initially fully own themselves and have moral powers to acquire property rights in external things under certain conditions." It notes that libertarianism is not a “right-wing” doctrine because of its opposition to laws restricting adult consensual sexual relationships and drug use, and its opposition to imposing religious views or practices and compulsory military service. However, it notes that there is a version known as “left-libertarianism” which also endorses full self-ownership, but "differs on unappropriated natural resources (land, air, water, etc.)." "Right-libertarianism" holds that such resources may be appropriated by individuals. "Left-libertarianism" holds that they belong to everyone and must be distributed in some egalitarian manner.[1]

 

Copycat!

http://www.hipforums.com/newforums/showpost.php?p=5659514&postcount=53

 

And this from the Glossary of Political Economy Terms:
Right-wing, rightist A general descriptive term for any of several otherwise rather different, conservative, reactionary or fascist political ideologies, the common denominator of which is their qualified or enthusiastic support for the main features of the current social and economic order, accepting all (or nearly all) of its inequalities of wealth, status and privilege (or even in some cases support for a return to an earlier, even more inegalitarian and hierarchical political-economic order). Right wing ideologies tend to emphasize the values of order, patriotism, social cohesion, and a personal sense of duty that makes the individual citizen who “knows his place” responsive to discipline from his political and social superiors. In America, the term has a somewhat more derogatory flavor than in Europe.

 

Ok

Again – what we seem to be having a problem with is that many people seem to associate right wing with conservative, the problem is that you can be right wing and not conservative.

Which means someone might believe in gay marriage, abortion, legalised prostitution, legislation of drugs and be an atheist and still be of the right.

It’s the reasons for holding those views that are important the philosophical viewpoint for believing or accepting them.

To put it simply the three pillars of right wing libertarianism are personal rights, the free market, and limited government.

And the reasons for believing in or accepting something is based on them.

The problem is that the other sides of this is people paying for mistakes no matter the circumstances, an acceptance of inequality and weak democratic forces that cannot counter the power of wealth.

This is why it is a philosophy of the right (and of wealth) and not of the left.

I believe in personal rights but I also believe in protection from exploitation and reduced circumstances that can come about due to inequality.

 

This is almost entirely copied and pasted from another thread.

 

like i said in your other thread, libertarians are a combination of left and right wing. they have liberal stances on social issues and conservative stances on economic issues. essentially, they believe in very small government. people/business can do whatever the fuck they want.

and that's kinda cool that there's right wingers coming through here. discussions get boring when everyone says "i agree" "i agree" all the time.

 

deranged

Deranged

As I’ve set out on a number of occasions now my argument is that actually right wing libertarian ideas are based within a right wing philosophy and that there stance on social issues are not of the left as some claim.

Could you possibly read those posts first before giving a reply so I don’t have to repeat myself again?

Cheers Balbus

I agree.

 

like i said, i'm talking about the political stance "libertarian." not the party. i honestly have no idea what "right wing libertarian" means. i reread the first post and it sounds like you're talking about the party, which i know nothing about. my mistake.

 

I think the problem is that you insist that everyone accept your interpretation of "right wing" and nobody is buying it.

No you can't. You can still have what are typically considered 'right wing' views on things such as taxes and regulation. It makes you libertarian, not right wing.

Yet the vast majority of the people you are calling right here are quite low income. You conclude that they just don't know what's best for themselves, but you do.

We are all talking about the stance, nobody is talking about the party. You haven't made any mistake.

Neither does anyone else here, although Balbus is trying to tell us all libertarians are 'right wing' by definition.

I have never seen any evidence that you believe in personal rights. They seem to be the crumbs left on the table after you have taken control of every aspect of human existence. "That which is not expressly permitted is forbidden".

Balbus I think you have tried and failed to force your definition on us enough times already. Clearly you have failed to convince anybody and haven't provided anything to back up this definition besides your own say so. At this point all you are doing is reinforcing negative stereotypes of the dogmatic old school socialist.

 

Deranged

I’m not talking about a political party, I’m talking about people that express right wing views or ideas based on right leaning ideology that claim to be libertarian seemingly in a way to disguise the fact that there views are in fact virtually (if not all) right wing.

A way for a right winger to claim they’re not a right winger by claiming they’re ‘libertarian’.