Anybody participating in a tea party today?

Don't give me that teenage angst stuff, i probably know more about whats going on then over half of the people who voted for Obama in the first place.

I do agree with you and discussed about how people who are rich but didn't do anything to get that rich, like Paris Hilton, she did nothing for all the amounts of money she has, but her grandfather or whomever started a huge hotel empire, you don't think he had to work his ass off, do you not think that he had his time of hard times, of debt?

I understand that a lot of "poor" people don't like where they are, but that doesn't mean that can't get out of it, but who would want to work to get themselves into a better place financially, when the current government is offering that if you lose your job or whatever it may be, to not worry because they will pay for EVERYTHING!

Obama basically runs General Motors now, but guess what, if you lose your job, don't worry, go buy a car and he'll pay for it for the next 9 months.

If you honestly think the government buying corporations, and controlling everything will solve this countries financial problems, you only need to look at Europe. That's what they did, and now they are screwed, no money, no one is happy, gas is over 7 dollars, buying a pack of cigarettes is 8 dollars. Just the other day at Maverick i saw a sign saying that the federal tax on cigarettes is about to go up in July or June, i forget which. I'm not a smoker, but if that isn't a sign of things to come, then i don't know what is.

It's only getting worse from here on out, and if you can't see that, then you are blind as a bat.

 

The kind of welfare system you're talking about ended during the Clinton Administration. Your arguments are tired.

 

Indeed, even though I'm actually playing devil's advocate right now the US welfare system is one of the most unkind in the western world, seriously, have you ever been poor enough to be on welfare? You get enough to basically eat. And despite how glamorous it seems on the surface, going into a store and having to use food stamps is horribly embarrassing. Combined with the fact a lot of business is luck, hence why 4 out of 5 businesses will fail in their 1st year

 

You are sooo out of touch. Did you know that Denmark is the happiest country in the world?

http://www.worldamazingrecords.com/2008/07/denmark-happiest-country-in-world.html

How about that? They're in Europe! They're socialist!

 

Governments create poverty in the first place. When you have a private bank running the country, devaluing the currency and creating inflation, while at the same time sending jobs off to China, you're going to have people who become dependent on the system. The welfare state is perpetuated by the system itself. More government and more socialism has always been proven to create more poverty and more people dependent on big brother for their survival.

 

Haha, okay i'll agree with you on that, I did some reading that Denmark is indeed one of the happiest countries. My fault for encompassing all of Europe, lets just keep it simple and say, look at the U.K.

And also if i may, i take back the statement "happy". I was upset and caught up in the middle of the debate, i should have just said about how bad of an economic state a lot of Europe is, because of socialism.

And i'm not arguing socialism, my family was immigrated to the States quite a few years ago, around 13 years ago, the reason for the move is because my parents were sick of the governments controlling everything and of course because of the 60% tax rate on most married couples.

I'm mostly upset about Obama, he is going to ruin the country if somebody doesn't act. We WILL turn out like the U.K. Plain and simple.

 

I think Obama is doing a brilliant job. Really.

 

What exactly is it that's so wrong with the UK exactly?

 

I agree every single elected official and government appointee and their entire staffs should automatically be audited as a matter of practice. And all their investments and financial holdings should be public record.

 

The UK is much worse off than the US in a lot of ways, not only economically, but politically and socially as well. Obviously the British economy is also on the brink of collapse, even more so than the US, but in terms of an Orwellian police state, I think the UK has the US beat by quite a stretch... at least for the time being. Everyday I am reading stories out of the UK that leave even me in a state of disbelief (well, somewhat).

 

I was asking Skewed Rat. I know what your answers will be. But he's all hot and bothered about ending up like the UK at the hands of Obama. I'd like him to explain what he's so afraid of. I don't like the lack of civil liberties the Brits are experiencing right now, but I am not up on how that state was accomplished, were these issues legislated with public input? I don't know. I realize economically they are in trouble but I think that's a result of following our finacial and economic model over the past decades.

 

You'd really like to believe people are poor from choice wouldn't you.

http://www.alabamapoverty.org/myths.html

And actually all Obama's plan is is to discontinue the tax break Bush enacted, so in essence it's not an increase just an end to the free lunch they have been enjoying.

 

There is nothing wrong with our civil liberties at the moment.
If there is, could you explain what is wrong?
Maybe, Rat, can tell us there is 4 million CCTV cameras in London...and we are watched at every turn. lol.

Personally, I think finance is a global issue, therefore a global problem. God only knows who was the first person to say: "Mmmm, I think packaging crap morgages together and selling them to banks, is a good idea" really needs there head looking at (with hindsight.) But I also fear it worked very well for every one. Then the crash came. Brown, blames you guys for this, I suspect he has a point. What I don't think, however, is that we followed your: "finacial and economic model over the past decades".
The whole financial world followed each other, that is borderless and none country specific.

 

There is nothing wrong with your civil liberties at the moment? Well I am sure that no matter where you go you will find people who agree and disagree with you.

Now as far as the cameras, really it does not matter how many cameras there are in London, because it is still, by far, the most surveilled city in the world. Yes, you are watched at every turn.

As far as the 4 million number, I do believe that applies to the UK as a whole. Still, it is a staggering number.

Finance as a global issue

Well, yeah, because national sovereignty over time has been eroded in favor of internationalism. This has long been pushed via economics and the "global ecomony." As far as blaming individual countries for this orchestrated mess, I agree, indeed it makes no sense because the bankers hold no allegiance to any one country. However, the US, as usual, is being made out to be the bad guy in all of this.

 

You don't say. People disagreeing with each other...what ever next.

Statistically speaking, you could be right. I do think you will find a few cities in China that are worse, though. The trouble with relying on the No. of CCTV cameras to dictate how you feel our liberties are being infringed, is how those cameras operate and how they are governed. A large proportion of those cameras are not viewd by anybody but spotty work experience staff, who are looking to see if a handbag is being stolen.
Even defenders of liberty, Liberty, have - I would imagine - CCTV out side their HQ...why do you think that is? http://www.liberty-human-rights.org.uk/

They (CCTV cameras) are not being watched by crack operatives, attempting to follow our every move.
Life is tedious, Rat. Not some James bond spy thriller.

Yeah, it does and it is (on the face of it).

I was joking. You said, till you were nearly blue in the face, this applied to just London. Why? I do believe you believed your crap pot websites...and what Infowars told you to think. This is ofcourse a little rude of me...but, you DID, IMO, think this to be true because of news stories, that you read WRONG or crack pot websites you read, right.
I told you this when you spouted that claim a few months ago.

I agree with you, apart from: "...this orchestrated mess."
Also, with the US having the bigger and more influential economy, who else is there to blame? (I might regret asking that .)

 

Yeah, at least a quarter of installed cameras don't actually keep a tape.

 

I work as a security officer, the ones I should be looking at, don't actually work...lol.

 

Yeah, I know. My work building and the properties downtown in my neighbourhood have cameras in quite a number of areas. But when my co-worker had his motorcycle stolen from our underground and gated parking lot, there wasn't a tape for the cameras. No tapes in the public street cameras that would have seen the bike leave. No tape from the YMCA when I was with my two friends when their bikes got stolen.

There weren't any tapes in my high school either, or hardly any of the ones downtown. The ones that are, are all aimed at the tills anyway.

 

Actually, it's interesting. Because there is a way to remotely hack into a person's unsecured webcam connection and record people without their awareness.

I wonder what the country under the most surveillance really is.

 

In my case, it is just a question of money. They did work.
They decided to refurb' the office...In the process they messed up the cameras.
Been that way since xmas.
Doesn't bother me...I don't need to work that much, now.
I can, instead, post here more often...which is nice

I would say, even with the best will in the world, CCTV can't see everything.
The tills would be more of a priority than anything or anybody, sorry to say...in the retail sector, anyway.
No tapes is a massive FAIL...lol.
That is probaly for financial reasons, too.