God & Drugs?

I have studied the bible a bit and I can't find anything that indicates that drugs are looked down upon. The only reason I can find is that we are disobeying the govt., but people will eventually HAVE to resist the govt in the end times so does God really care? Does he look down upon me when I drink or smoke or alter my state of mind? What do you think?

 

Jesus drank wine, it isn't forbidden. There are some (dubious) references to cannabis, and the manna could be mushrooms. But at any rate, there is no prohibition to my knowledge of the stuff. The important thing is moderation. Like I said, Jesus drank his wine, but I somehow doubt that he got roaring drunk every night.

We think of the Puritains as repressive, conservative, ultrareligious people. Yet even they did not outlaw drinking, and any laws they enacted were to stop drunkenness (which is biblically disapproved of). It's drinking often and to excess that is a drain on society, and until the late 19th, early 20th century, this is what the temperance movement was all about.

So it seems that it's letting the alcohol (or anything really) get in the way of a relationship with God that is frowned upon. Occasional use, as far as I know, isn't discouraged. Since there isn't any direct reference to drugs in the bible that I'm aware of, I use the same rule for them too.

 

If you are using drugs or alcohol to alter your state of mind, you are not using them in moderation, by definition. It's possible to drink without getting drunk, but I've never known anyone to use any other recreational drugs without becoming intoxicated.

Here's a thoughtful Christian perspective on psychedelics:

http://www.cornerstonemag.com/pages/show_page.asp?188

 

I would imagine that canibas and mushrooms should be okay as they are part of gods creations, and all that god creates is good. As far as man made and processed drugs, I have no idea.

Then again, maybe pot was the tree of knowledge...

Otherwise I'm under the impression that as long as you are nice and live a good life that God wouldn't mind you smoking and such.

 

the link you posted HuckFinn was pretty informative but only so with opinions. I have heard every opinion there is. I was looking more in the terms of facts such as bible verses that I have not come across yet. The article on LSD seemed to focus on taking it to reach God. I don't do that. I do it to have fun. I don't need anything but prayer to reach God. But thanks for your opinion.. I'll keep it in mind!

 

The Bible doesn't specifically address psychedelics per se, but I think its clear teachings on sobriety would apply. See 1 Cor. 6:12; Eph. 5:18; 1 Pt. 4:7.

 

thanks.. I'll check those out

 

Here's MY opinion:

I believe that some drugs taken in moderation are ok. I am still trying to figure out if I believe this applies to all recreational drugs, or just the ones that are "natural" (weed, shrooms, etc). While I know that "everything is natural", you know what I mean. I am rather uncomfortable with the manmade rec drugs, such as meth and that kinda thing... Those seem to be a lot more powerful and tend to get you addicted from what I've read. Maybe I'm wrong, but if this is true, I would feel like it is wrong to take those knowing that you could so easily get addicted, because the addiction itself would be wrong.

But for the sake of the argument let's just say that as of right now, I am pretty sure that the "natural" rec drugs are ok, but like I said, in moderation. This is the key, but it is also a stumbling block for a lot of people.

The problem is, I agree with HuckFinn that it is usually not common for someone to use drugs without becoming intoxicated. I do know that some people can manage to only take a puff or two of a joint, or just a tiny bit of a shroom, and still are mostly functional. But then the argument for whether or not altering your state of mind is a sin comes in to play here.

So even if you were to use drugs in moderation, it would still alter your state of mind a least a little bit. Is this wrong? In MY personal opinion, I feel it depends on the situation, really. If you have no responsibilities for the time period in which your mind would be altered, and you know for sure that nothing important will depend on you and your mind, then no, I don't believe altering your state of mind (but not getting intoxicated!) is wrong. However, if you have children that need your care and there is no other "sober" adult to take care of them, you shouldn't do it. If two parents both want to get high, then I believe that only one should do it at a time, and the other should wait until that spouse is "sober" again before taking their turn. Or if you are going to go to work, and your job depends on your ability to do things a certain way, you shouldn't do it.

In other words, if you ARE going to get high, do it in moderation, and do it responsibly. If one is able to manage these two things, then I don't feel there would be anything wrong with that, and I don't think God would be unhappy about it. That has been my conclusion so far.

 

how about this, I didnt even read anyones post except yours.

ignore what everyone has to say, and ask yourself.
Do you feel convicted when your using drugs or alchohol?
if you do then you may have a problem, and God is talking to you.

In moderation is obviously the best, Dont become slave to it, as in thinking about it all the time. Ask your own heart, its the best way to find real answers. Oh and Prayign about it might help If your convicted about it.

 

Remember that most drugs have, even in moderation, an adverse affect on the body.

Remember that the body is a temple of the holy spirit and to damage that is definitely frowned upon.

Blessings

Sebbi

 

So do many perscription drugs. Anti-depressents, ADD medicine, even painkillers. Many foods we eat do as well.

I think moderation is the key.

 

Well, there's no reason to ingest drugs or alcohol except to alter your state of mind. A little ingestion = a little alteration; a large ingestion = a large alteration.

The way I see it, Jesus drank wine during feasts and celebrations. He likely got a bit drunk like anyone would at such a joyous occasion like a Jewish wedding. The degree of his drunkenness would be conjecture, but lets just assume that like anyone who drinks wine, it affected him. Clearly this didn't seem to be a problem for him. He used it responsibly, at celebrations; he wasn't getting drunk every night.

Thus I suggest moderation (temperance) in use. Enjoy your wine/cannabis/whatever as long as you can control yourself enough that you don't get addicted. This is why I think poorly of coke and heroin and other synthetic drugs; it's far too easy to get hooked, so I suggest steering clear of it altogether. So you can get totally stoned and it's ok, but don't do it every day. You can get drunk and it's ok, but don't do it every day. Use is responsibly, for occasional celebration, fun, and relaxation. I can't imagine any God being against such a method of use.

By the way, saying "altered state of mind" is a bit misleading. It assumes there is a standard state and anything else is a deviation (and thus bad). It is more likely that what we have is one construct of reality, one of many that could be chosen. I also don't think it is ever wrong to want another perspective on things. Drugs can do this, as can meditation, prayer, etc. And when the construct of reality is one that so often includes war, hate, and other badness, finding a different perspective, even if only temporarily, can make all the difference.

 

Except that's not what the Bible says; it clearly condemns drunkenness. It's possible to drink without getting drunk. A couple of drinks might make someone feel a bit relaxed, but that's hardly comprable to getting "totally stoned" or drunk, let alone tripping. I've heard some say that they can smoke pot in moderation without getting high, but I have trouble believing this. It's much easier to "pace oneself" with alcohol than with pot. It's also possible to enjoy a fine liquor, wine, or beer just for the flavor.

Intoxication is cheap substitute for contemplative prayer or meditation; it clouds the mind rather than focusing it on God. Like any other idol, drug use ultimately enslaves and deceives people.

 

Regarding this topic, I'm always reminded of these words from Christ: "What goes into the mouth does not make one unclean; it is what comes out of the mouth that makes someone unclean." Matthew 15:11

 

I don't think God wanted us to do drugs. Our body's are his temple.

 

Sure, one can justify almost anything by taking isolated verses out of context and ignoring other plain teachings of Scripture . . .

 

I think it's important to understand the reason for biblical laws. Drunkenness often leads to violent, idiotic action. You sleep with your brothers wife, stab someone, whatever. I think responsibility is the key; and it's much harder to be responsible when youre drunk than when you're stoned. There is also addiction to factor in, and alcohol is more addictive than weed.

I view it this way: if what I'm doing does not hurt me or my spiritual growth, and as long as it doesn't cause me to do stupid things to others, then there is no reason not to do it. Don't just listen to some old text, listen to your heart. If something is bad for you and you know it deep down, then it's time to stop doing that thing.

Heh, tell that to someone on LSD, lol

By the way, your view of "drugs" is pretty uninformed, they do not all ultimately enslave and deceive. These substances can be useful tools (like the mind itself can be) but we shouldn't be ruled by them, and that only happens if we let them. Of course, some like heroin are much easier to be "enslaved" by as compared to others, like marijuana. It's a matter of personal mindfullness and knowledge. In todays world we are not taught responsible drug use because we don't talk about drugs but to say "don't do it." But there will always be experimentation, the problem is experimentation without knowledge or supervision by someone who knows what their doing.

 

I was heavily into psychedelics for several years before becoming a Christian. After coming to know Christ, I began to realize that my psychedelic spirituality was counterfeit. The Cornerstone article I cited here earlier might help explain why.

 

Huck, you are one of the more insightful and intellingent folks here... did you ever think that your heavy use of psychelics may have nurtured your process of becoming that? i think it did and without them, you would just be another one of those stupid dumb christians here

 

Occasionally, when I'm in a really good mood, I will smoke one small hit of marijuana. I definitely do not get 'stoned'. My mood is simply elevated further, while I gain more energy and concentration. I don't get stoned because I feel like it drains me. This I do not encounter with small amounts. I feel no 'comedown', the transition back to a 'normal' state of mind is not even noticed. And I do have to say that I find the taste/smell of marijuana smoke to be enjoyable.