Jesus is for everyone.

Some people can't even read.

I am not saying fuck the bible, but cmon folks. The Jman dont hate!

 

The Jman most likely never existed in order to hate or love for that matter. There aren't any 3rd party records of his existence, there aren't any of his contemporaries who wrote about him, and the gospels were not written by their namesakes according to most scholars. So without the bible, there is no other evidence of his existence and therefore no reason to believe he ever did.

Lets do a comparison here.....
Q. If there were no bibles in existence, what could you use to justify the existence of any christian god?

A. Nothing. You would have no way of re-creating the same bible we have today.

Q. If all science books were to disappear, what could we use to recreate the science books?

A. The same things we used to create them in the first place, evidence for everything we know so far.

So without the language of the bible or any other holy book, there is no evidence available for the existence of any god. About the best one can do is say that the existence of everything is evidence of some creator type being. But that is nothing more than "God of the gaps" reasoning, which is fallacious and intellectually dishonest. Without the language of the bible in particular, there certainly isn't any evidence for the Christian god. Just because the bible contains some historical facts that can be verified, it doesn't mean the whole book is full of truth. Oddly, most of the things that can't be verified are the things that contradict what we know about nature. We know that people who have been truly dead for 3 days can't come back to life, walk around for 40 days then defy the laws of gravity and ascend upward on their own to some place we can't see and further defy the laws of physics by being able to breath much higher than 20000 feet up. Or contradicting fluid dynamics by walking on water or parting entire seas.

Jesus is for no one and I say read the bible for the history, but don't take miracles as literal events. Remember, even the book "Escape From New York" has some historical accuracy and places that still exist, but that doesn't mean Snake Pliskin was an actual person.

Some people CAN read, but it doesn't mean they comprehend, think critically, or question authority.

You can't use "personal experience" as reliable evidence either in light of the fact that people of other faiths and other gods have "personal experiences" with their gods. Without mental masturbation, how can one honestly reconcile the existence of his own god through someone elses experience with their god?

 

I find your lack of faith disturbing.

*pinches fingers together*

they don't call it a leap for nothing.

Happy landings!

"We know something you don't know, and if we don't share then we don't grow."

I believe in everything with a positive message, because I am a positive person. Positively charged, spiritually enhanced, mentally advanced, and quite charismatic- which apparently is called "the divine favor" by some.

The greatest intellectuals of our time have basically logically regurgitated the christian religion back to us, what do you think of that?

p.s. I believe in God and his children, not a book or institution.

 

What do you mean by Third Party Sources? Do you mean testimony outside the Christian community. There was Tacitus, Seutonius, Pliny the Younger, and of course, Josephus Flavius. Of course, the three former sources may just be repeating what Chrisitans told them, and the Testimonium Flavianium is generally believe to have been doctored by Christians, but Josehphus' Antiquities speaks of James, the brother of Jesus. The source appears to be credible, and James was the acknowledged leader of the Jerusalem Church. Paul was in direct contact with both James and Cephas (Peter),and various other eyewitnesses. Paul wrote as early as twenty-five years after Jesus'death, when there would be original eyewitnesses around to correct them. I think there's as much evidence for Jesus as for my other heroes, Socrates and the Buddha. Of course there remains the question what he said and did. Members of the Jesus Society think Jesus didn't say 82% of the things attributed to Him, but they also say that Jesus said 18% of the things attributed to Him. To me, it doesn't matter a lot. I go by ideas attributed to Him that make Him out to be a good Hippie--just a good Ol'boy, never meanin' no harm.

 

actually I am talking about Nietzsche who said God is Dead. Then went on to spout his message through rational thought. Not so much in his early work , but more so in his good stuff.

Thus Spoke Zarathustra shares multiple strong parallels with the christian faith... One of the versions actually has them outlined at the end.

 

First; Itsdarts, since you are not a Christian, you are not supposed to be in Sanctuary. Please leave.

Second, the argument of yours that I quoted is fallacious.

Your argument assumes the non-existence of God and implies that the Bible was authored by men and thus men would have no way to recreate it.

But if God exists and the Bible was authored by God as is claimed, then God could easily re-create it or as it seems to be the case, not allow it to go out of existence in the first place.

 

I'd say jesus is for no one.
Religion does nothing but hold us back as a society.
I pity you if you are still unable to see that.

 

OlderWaterBrother you have no idea what the fuck you are talking about.
The bible was authored by man, and saying otherwise isn't faith it's stupidity.
Faith is simply not wanting to accept the reality....shocked you guys are even on here.
I might sound hateful, but in the end all religion does is spread hate.

 

Religion does nothing but hold us back as a society?

There are some who would say the exact opposite; I pity you if you are still unable to see that.


PS To you I say the same thing as I said to Itsdarts, if you are not a Christian, you are not supposed to be in Sanctuary. Please leave.

 

since you are not a Christian, you are not supposed to be in Sanctuary

hmm ... now maybe I'm not suppose to be here either..

Forum Description: For Christians ONLY!

I surely don't mean this in a disrespectful way but I'm puzzled

wouldn't you be excluding someone.. a certain jew??

 

Well for one thing, I didn't make up the forum guidelines.

Also if you mean Jesus by your reference to “a certain Jew”; personally, I don’t think so. As I’ve said before, although Jesus was of Jewish descent, he was not follower of the Jewish religion of his time nor would he be a follower of Judaism today.

In his day Jesus was a true worshiper of God, which means he worshiped God in the way the God wants to be worshiped and since being Christian means following Jesus way of worshiping God, we also should be worshiping God the way he wants to be worshiped. So if Jesus returned today, he would worship like a true Christian.

As for whether you should be in Sanctuary or not, the guidelines do say Christians only but some exceptions have been made for those who can behave themselves, although that same restriction has been placed on the Christians in this forum…hmmm.

 

I don't know but like you said youself; you sound like the hateful one to me. Seems like a poor way to get someone to change sides.

 

You are a biased bastard
Open your mind

 

Sheesh, there goes the idea of religion not being important.

It's a bit strange to react that way.

Whenever I am being a bit upset, I just ask myself whether or not I am projecting my own attitudes onto others and revealing my true nature in the process.

It's ok, though... we all lose our cool sometimes. Happens to everyone.

 

I've spent years trying to reason with so many people like that.
I guess sometimes it makes a difference, but yea...in a bad mood, and probably shouldn't have said anything.
Just wish people would wake up a little.
I mean when your religion conflicts with itself?...come on

 

It's ok. We all try to reason. But what I noticed is that conflicts like this arise when we make it more than a debate. I'm guilty of it too.

Just enjoy the debate for the debate and things will run a lot more smoothly. It's either that or always feeling the need to prove something, either to yourself or others.

For me, I enjoy thinking of strange things and hearing others out. A lot of good follows from this intention.

 

You’ve spent years trying to reason with so many people like that?

What 19 years?

I’ve spent 40 years longer trying to reason with so many people like you.

Still I try to get people like you to wake up without using hateful speech.

As for my religion conflicting with it self, I’ve yet for anyone to show me that.

 

Well if you can't see that you haven't paid enough attention reading the bible.
We can carry this conversation on somewhere else, but I'll respect the guidelines here, and stay the hell out of "sanctuary", even though i think it's bullshit.

 

Please meet me in the Christianity forum in the new thread: "The Bible contradicts it self?" and we can discuss it.

 

The point of the Sanctuary was to be a place where the X'ians on the site could gather (along with non-X'ians) with the idea that this would be a place where:
1) Bible quotes could be posted. Technically they are not aloud in the Christianity parent forum (but are tolerated in moderation); and,
2) Persecution, or perceived persecution, in various forms would not be tolerated.
You can read all about it in the thread about the Sanctuary thread in the Sanctuary sub-forum.

These came out of a few former members (a father and son who would post essay long replies consisting of solely bible quotes) and others who would post 15 new threads a day that basically amounted to "Hitler was a Christian. Christians are assholes. et cetera". There was a lobby to Skip, and he created it.

That being said, OWB, I don't think you handled this with much tact. Non-X'ians I would welcome you into the Sanctuary, but posts like Smitty25's and Itsdarts are what the Sanctuary is trying to prevent.

I am not asking us to all agree, but can we at least be civil on all sides (no calling people biased bastards or telling people to "get out")...[A side note on biases: We all have them. If you think you do no, you are truely deluded].


I've found the ultimate function of the sanctuary is to hammer out theological issues, or to aviod responses like "The bible is all bullshit--open your eyes!!! I am sooo enlightened" to honest, knowledge seeking questions.