Regulation anyone?

There still seem to be many on the right who still seem to believe in deregulation (on this forum Rat definitely and I believe also Motion)

Although it seems the one time freemarketeer McCain has discovered his inner Marx and wants to now protect the workers from the dangers of the greedy capitalist system. It seems the downtrodden masses have been “betrayed by a casino on Wall Street of greed, corruption and excess that has damaged them and their futures”

This is a road to Damascus type conversion (if true) since in the past he has repeatedly called for deregulation and said that the way to deal with the US’s financial system was not through “big-government intervention” or “increasing government regulation” but by “unleashing the forces of the free market and capitalism”

So is this the end of those right wing neo-liberal and libertarian economic philosophies or…?

 

Regulation of whom/what and by whom/what? and for who's or what interest?

 

Sorry Smot

Oh I thought it was obvious

Regulation of whom/what

Of the financial systems

Regulation… by whom/what

By the government

Regulation… for who's or what interest?

In the best interests of the common people.

 

1) For the umpteenth time, I am not a "Right" winger (nor am I a Left winger). I have made it clear that I do not believe in the dialectical Left vs. Right, my-side-is-better-than-your-side scam called politics. Those with eyes to see and brains to think understand that both "wings" belong to the same bird.

2) I never claimed to "support" or "not support" regulations. Unlike you, I am not political and I do not vote in meaningless elections. I simply call the shots as I see them.

I have already explained this to you before, but you choose to instead play your silly little games and claim that I ignored your questions as you regurgitate the same nonsense over and over like a little troll. I was going to say you sound an awful lot like McCain, but I guess you already admit that. It makes sense that a Rothschild puppet of the banking cartels is calling for regulations, which always benefit the banks and corporations. That is part of the reason we are in the predicament we are in right now. Because when you have the government and the banks working so closely together, you are going to have the government regulating only in favor of the banks. If you are foolish enough to believe that the government, which is controlled by the money cartels, is going to rule in favor of the people's best interests, then you are beyond trying to explain anything.

The fact is, this has been planned to happen.

You have absolutely no clue how the power structure works.

While people like McCain are blabbing about regulations, nobody talks about the private banks of the Federal Reserve that are responsible for the mess we're in to begin with.

What we are seeing here is mass-criminality from the banks and the government alike. The two are one and the same. There is no distinction between the two, because the money cartels run this country! This government has been controlled by the banks for a very, very long time.

Perhaps some of you need to re-read this quote from Mayer Amschel Rothschild:

"Give me control of a nation's money and I care not who makes her laws."

McCain Backed by Rothschilds - Washington Post

 

I still support deregulation.

McCain has not discovered socialism, he has discovered populism. He's giving people what they want to hear.

 

Its too bad that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac did not receive more oversight. These Companies were able to buy off serious regulation by pulling the right strings in Washington.

 

I believe the role of government is regulation in the interest of society. If that isn't their role what is their role? Congress passes laws, the executive branch has approval and veto power, the judiciary passes on whether or not it meets the Constitutional test...that's my understanding of our government.

Or is it just the common citizens that need to be regulated?

 

I have no problem with regulations ment to prevent abuses or shady business practices.

Anyway,as far as Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac weren't both backed by the U.S government regardless of what problems they ran into? Does that sound like companies whoes decisions were being influenced by the free market?

http://blogs.usatoday.com/oped/2008/07/crisis-at-fanni.html

 

And as long as you and many others feel like your vote doesn't count the money interests will continue to load the polls and ballot boxes with the votes they can buy. So by not voting what do you accomplish? You like John McCain can say well I didn't vote for it and by that token are not responsible for the outcome?

 

That makes no sense. They are going to put who THEY want in, regardless of who votes or how many people vote.

 

Doesn't to me, but I don't think anyone wants to talk about that.

 

1) For the umpteenth time, I am not a "Right" winger (nor am I a Left winger). I have made it clear that I do not believe in the dialectical Left vs. Right, my-side-is-better-than-your-side scam called politics. Those with eyes to see and brains to think understand that both "wings" belong to the same bird.

No Rat you are right wing and I’ve explained why at length and you still have not refuted the charge just as you’ve never refuted the other things I’ve charged you with such as pushing a pro-wealth agenda.

All you ever do is say it isn’t true but not why it isn’t true, (when every indication it is true), you seem unwilling or unable to explain.

I could give hundreds of examples but lets take a couple of resent ones –

How is it that a rising market raises all boats when most corporations pay no taxes?
http://www.hipforums.com/newforums/showthread.php?t=318597

‘One World Government’ http://www.hipforums.com/newforums/showthread.php?p=4575889#post4575889

Did you refute what I’d said in them?

Did you hell!

As I said and I quote -

“But the thing is you’ve been promoting the same shit for years and time and again I’ve asked you to explain why you promote things that you seem unable to defend and that would only help the wealthy elites but you refuse and instead just keep promoting the pro-wealth line under the ludicrous disguise of being anti-wealth”

Yep you just ran away and begin another thread to spread the same pro-wealth agendas.

**

2) I never claimed to "support" or "not support" regulations. Unlike you, I am not political and I do not vote in meaningless elections. I simply call the shots as I see them.

No Rat, you just claim you don’t vote, back when you were openly a right wing libertarian you were proud to say you voted libertarian. You only stopped been openly libertarian when you found you couldn’t defend libertarian ideas it only then that you began loudly proclaiming that you were neither of the right or left which is clearly just a ruse since you still seem to be pushing many of the same pro-wealth ideas you couldn’t defend before and still can’t defend.

Oh you are very much in favour of the people not voting, well that is the people that come and read post on a forum that isn’t in general pro-right wing or pro-wealth.

As I’ve pointed out before that is an old trick – if you can’t get your opponents to vote for you then the next best thing is to try and stop them voting at all.

**

I have already explained this to you before, but you choose to instead play your silly little games and claim that I ignored your questions as you regurgitate the same nonsense over and over like a little troll. I was going to say you sound an awful lot like McCain, but I guess you already admit that. It makes sense that a Rothschild puppet of the banking cartels is calling for regulations, which always benefit the banks and corporations. That is part of the reason we are in the predicament we are in right now. Because when you have the government and the banks working so closely together, you are going to have the government regulating only in favor of the banks. If you are foolish enough to believe that the government, which is controlled by the money cartels, is going to rule in favor of the people's best interests, then you are beyond trying to explain anything.

Bla, bla, bla – government bad – bla, bla, bla – regulating the wealthy is bad - bla, bla, bla – democracy is a sham - bla, bla, bla – don’t vote for anything that might upset the wealthy- bla, bla, bla - it’s a conspiracy - bla, bla, bla….

Yes Rat, we know Rat, I think we’ve all heard your agenda’s bullet points by now.

But why do you never answer the charges levelled at you, oh you claim you have but we’ve been through that dance before you claim you have but when asked you are unable to actually shown where you have or to recollect what you said.

**

What we are seeing here is mass-criminality from the banks and the government alike. The two are one and the same. There is no distinction between the two, because the money cartels run this country! This government has been controlled by the banks for a very, very long time.

Bla, bla, bla – government bad – bla, bla, bla – regulating the wealthy is bad - bla, bla, bla – democracy is a sham - bla, bla, bla – it’s a conspiracy - bla, bla, bla….

Heard it already…

But the problem is your solution to this crazy situation would be to hand even more power and influence over to the wealth based elites and corporations.

How is making a bad situation into a worse one any improvement?

 

Here are a few musings on what I’d want some serious some based more in anger and frustration –

A windfall tax on all the boards and CEO’s involved, they’ve been reaping the benefits for years now it’s time to pay some of it back.

Bring back all the regulations that the neo-liberals got rid, such things as the Glass-Steagall law in the US and similar regulations that Thatcherism removed in the UK. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glass-Steagall_Act

Bring in the Tobin tax

The capping of CEO’s pay to around 50 times that of an average worker. I mean supposedly in the 1950-60’s the top executives of large US companies were earning about 40-50 times more than the average worker, but by the 2000’s this was up to around 400 times. http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Investing/CompanyFocus/IsACEOWorth364TimesAnAverageJoe.aspx

Cap bonuses and stop all yearly bonuses and definitely stop any bonuses that are awarded irrespective of a company’s actual performance.

An independent inquiry into the financial system with the ability to call witnesses and hand out punishments where due.

The closing down and fining of any think tank or lobbyists that advocated or promoted neo-liberal ideas such as deregulation.

I might think of more later, anyone else got any ideas?

 

I can't support any of that, but i don't want to just criticize so here's what i think needs to change:

1. Banks, insurers, and broker dealers should all be regulated by the same entity, a new SEC modeled on the FSA. All these institutions are going to the Fed for money now, its clear they should all be regulated by the same entity. A single regulator would also help prevent regulatory arbitrage.

2. Mark to market accounting must continue and should be expanded. Nobody benefits from opacity.

3. Basel II needs to be implemented and expanded beyond the top tier banks. Its flawed but its still a big improvement on existing capital adequacy calculation.

4. Increase reporting requirements for banks. Investors should be able to seem greater detail on asset quality and capital adequacy calculation.

5. Break down barriers to interstate banking. The ridiculously fragmented banking system in the US is archaic and would benefit from consolidation.

6. The CDS market needs to get modernised - electronic settlement should be mandatory. I'm not sure about a central counterparty - given that the great CDS meltdown has not happened, the need may not be there.

7. Bond markets need to get more transparent - pricing should be as transparent and it is for shares.

 

that is what u.s.a. treasury secretary henry paulson told an emergency meeting of both the house and senate last night. paulson called it 'the president's plan.' now, bush has an mba and, how many more, god damn mother fucking fools with mbas' got almost all of planet earth into this mess? mbas are "the smartest guys in the room." well, i just loved what senate majory leader henery reid said after the meeting when he was interviewed by a bbc reporter; here is what he said between the lines: 'WE'RE ALL FUCKED NOW!' thank you very, very, very, much, peter drucker and milton friedman for, giving us a bunch of "educated" fools and crooks with mbas!

 

George Bush is hiding in the closet. Paulson is on his own.

 

#5 is a good idea in some respects, Hiptastic, but the USA won't have it. Remember the commies in Cuba? They just aren't going to open their banking borders. It's easier to charge people for needless transactions and tack on fees for profit. There are too many localized interests banks in certain States and the bankers can't handle the risk of opening the floodgates to competition. I don't see that changing anytime soon.

 

This isn't going to be solved until we address Hedge Funds and derivatives.

And this whole new carbon offset trading designed by Gore in the name of Global Warming is just another potential bubble, that will burst down the road. Think about it. What exactly is being traded, and does it have any actual worth? If emission levels are legislated then you either meet those standards or you pay a fine and/or are closed down, it shouldn't open up a whole new ponzi scam.

 

And why is that??

 

Because those two instruments have lead to this mess.

http://money.cnn.com/2005/09/23/markets/high_finance/index.htm

It's just more of the same sort of crap Enron pulled.

http://www.baltimorechronicle.com/2008/051908Leopold.shtml