questions!

Hi, i'm new to the hip forums but was hoping it would be okay to ask some questions. Im actually really surprised to see that somebody else in my position has already posted questions. I am writing my dissertation on how transgender people are represented in the media, and whether this shapes societies attitudes towards these people. (Ie; our level of understanding of other peoples genders or any offensive treatment etc..) If anybody would like to give me some feedback then i would really appreciate it! Thanks a lot! xx

1.) On the GLAAD website it says that the term 'transsexual' can be offensive, and that many people experiencing gender dysphoria prefer to be known as 'transgender' is this how you feel?

2.) Judith Butler writes a chapter on 'undiagnosing gender' explaining that many transgender people are happy to be disgnosed as having a 'condition' which enables them to get financial aid with gender reassignment surgery, whilst many others feel strongly the opposite. They see themselves as being somebody who has chosen their own gender. Again, how do you feel about this?

3.) Lastly, how do you feel transgender people are reflected in the media? For example the new programme in the UK 'Mrs. Inbetweeny' sounds to me like quite an offensive title, then again perhaps im taking it too seriously. What are your views on modern day media that deals with transgender topics?

Thanks so much to anybody who takes the time to answer these questions!! You're a star! xx

 

Well I don't know how to answer the first two, as I'm not transgender but to me the third question strikes an interest.
The title of the UK show sounds to me, like something that is both healthy and needed. It seems to me that it's suggesting that you can be a gender that is inbetween, you don't have to be a man or a woman, there's something inbetween both of them. That seems very liberating to me. I do understand that the other way of taking it is that it means your transitioning and I can understand how that can be offensive.
Also, in regards to Judith Butler I think (not positive) that she rrefers to it as sex reassignement surgery as she argues that gender is a social construct that can be manipulated. Also do you know what book that chapter is in, i'd love to read it.

 

Hey! Thankyou for your reply. I think Judith Butler has some good theories, she talks about how from birth we are instantly thrust into a gender and a performance based upon our genitals, and that it is also expected to determine our sexuality. For example 'Born male = typically masculine behaviour = attracted to women' She argues that this shouldnt be the case and that we should be given more social freedom-which i totally agree with. Ha, sorry im rambling, can you tell ive been writing my dissertation? Anyway, yes the book that contains the chapter Undiagnosing Gender is called 'Undoing Gender' I havent read it all as shes quite a complex writer! xx

 

I know tell me about it I bought the Gender Trouble a while and still haven't finished it. It's certainly not one of those lets read this before I go to bed books haha

 

1.) On the GLAAD website it says that the term 'transsexual' can be offensive, and that many people experiencing gender dysphoria prefer to be known as 'transgender' is this how you feel?

To be quite honest, i loath both terms. I feel they are just labels "normal" people slap on people trapped in the wrong body, because they dont understand it. Genuine people with gender dysphoria, (females trapped in male bodies) basically have a female brain inside a male body. Or a brain which at least internally resembles the female brain. (Vice versa for males in women's bodies). If i had to be called either, id prefer Transexual, as you are changing your physical sexual appearance. I would hate to be called Transgender, because that implies i am changing my gender. Which im not. Just wishing to make my body more inline with my true gender. Gender is determined by your brain, not your genitals. The simple fact is, men and women have different brain structures. So to base someone's gender identity purely on their genetalia is just ignorant.

But really, i class myself as neither transexual, or transgender. Those are labels other people would place on me. Im a female that was cursed to be born with a male body. That's how i see myself, simple as that.

2.) Judith Butler writes a chapter on 'undiagnosing gender' explaining that many transgender people are happy to be disgnosed as having a 'condition' which enables them to get financial aid with gender reassignment surgery, whilst many others feel strongly the opposite. They see themselves as being somebody who has chosen their own gender. Again, how do you feel about this?

As far as i am concerned, people who "choose" their own gender DO NOT have gender dysphoria, and shouldn't be classed in the same category as people that do suffer from it. Gay men, for instance who feminise their bodies for sexual kicks, are not trapped in the wrong body, they have just chosen to make themselves appear female as a means of sexual gratification. Same thing for transvestites.

I see my male body as simply a birth defect that needs to be corrected.

3.) Lastly, how do you feel transgender people are reflected in the media? For example the new programme in the UK 'Mrs. Inbetweeny' sounds to me like quite an offensive title, then again perhaps im taking it too seriously. What are your views on modern day media that deals with transgender topics?

I think it is getting better, but by and large, people like me are not treated very well by the media. More often than not, we are depicted as freaks who choose to be the way we are. There are people that feel they are "inbetween" genders, so i dont find that title too offensive. The problem is, of course, is that people who dont understand gender issues will just think all people that suffer with gender problems are the same way. Basically, i think a lot of people's views on people trapped in the wrong body, are based on myths and media fabrications. The truth is, all ive ever wanted to be, is a normal everyday person that goes about my daily routine the same way most other people do. Unfortunately, having a female brain inside a male body makes that an impossibility.

 

Hey, thanks so much for answering my questions. I dont suffer from gender dysphoria but have very strong views on the way in which our society is so hung up on appearance and gender conformity. I mean, i dont question peoples gender based on their appearance but if you are born into the wrong body, like you say, most people will instantly label you based upon your appeared gender. Thats what my dissertation talks about, apart from i got really hung up on the narrow-mindedness of society that i had to try and tame it down! I think its sad that we've all become so obssessed with labelling and that we base everything upon appearance. And i know what you mean, why should you be labelled 'transgender' or 'transsexual' it instantly makes it sound like you're something different to the 'norm', which you're not. In order for my dissertation to make sense i need to use terms like that but it feels wrong to be constantly labelling a group of people. I hope i make sense! Ive been on the computer far too long! Anyway, thankyou for your feedback! xx

 

"I know tell me about it I bought the Gender Trouble a while and still haven't finished it. It's certainly not one of those lets read this before I go to bed books haha"

Exactly! Ive been reading that book too! Have a look at David Gauntlett's book 'Media, Gender and Identity' he explains some of Judith Butlers theories in a much simpler way, he also comments on how complex her writing style is! Haha xx

 

Transwomen in the media, movies, tv, etc. should be shown as beautiful, feminine, ordinary women. Because that is how most of us live, and what most of us look like.
Transwomen are women, just a different type of lady from genetic women.
_________________
These days, with female hormones, facial feminization surgery, breast implants, etc., transwomen can be made into women as beautiful and feminine as some of the most beautiful and feminine genetic women. Many of them you would never guess were once men.
The transwomen who are not only feminized but also get sexual reassignment surgery and are given a vagina, can get their legal status changed to female in most American states, and in most modern democratic societies, and are then allowed to legally marry men, adopt children with their husbands, etc.
So many transwomen work jobs, are professional women, get married to men, are moms to children, etc..
I am a beautiful, feminine pre-op translady, a housewife, and a mom to my children that I had with a genetic woman before I transitioned, a stepmom to my man's son that he had from a previous marriage, and I live, dress, look, and act as a lady, and I am with a handsome masculine man who is my husband. No one assumes I am a transwoman unless they know I was once a male. They assume I am a lady. I am on estrogen and anti-androgens, have had facial feminization surgery, and breast implants. I have had alot of feminization done. And I love being a beautiful, feminine lady.

 

We'll, seeing as I'm not GLBT, my opinions might not be what you're looking for but here you go.

1. Transsexual, to me, means that the physical sex organs have been changed from your birth sexual organs. Transgender means you feel that you identify as a boy or girl(note, not male and female) when that is not the gender assigned to you at birth based on your sex organs.

You can be transsexual without being transgender, vice versa, or both. I don't know if I find either term offensive seeing as I don't personally identify as either. However, I know they're commonly confused, misused, and used to justify abuse.

2. I feel that it should be up to the individual whether or not to go through "treatment" for being transgender or transsexual. I feel that if you have gender dysphoria, you have it. Whether you view it as something needing treatment is a personal value.

The utility of having a label is that it allows people to seek treatment if they so desire. I think that publicly provided medical assistance for the condition should be purely based on therapy rather than surgical options. Gender dysphoria is mental, not medical(physiologic). Although I support the choice to surgically alter yourself, I don't feel its something that should be funded by the public. It is similiar to the issue of elective plastic surgery(rather than fixing injury or birth defect) in my eyes. Both come from real and legitimate disatifaction with your body; but I don't think many could argue that boob jobs should be tax payer funded.

3. This is so complicated, I'm not even going to try to tackle it in text. Suffice to say that I think the media marginalizes the GLBT community like it does to other minorities.

Cheers

 

It shouldnt be treated the same as elective plastic surgery, because for people trapped in the wrong body, it is not a choice. Having the surgery is a choice, but being born in the wrong body certainly isnt a choice. And it is a birth defect, for people like me who were born in the wrong body.

 

^^^People getting elective plastic surgery don't feel they're in the "right body" either.

Its not an issue of whether or not you should have a choice. Its a matter of who should fund it. People who are dissatisfied with the size of their breast or lips or nose go through very real angst about the body they are trapped in just like you apparently do.

I understand this is a personal issue for you, and support your right to pursue happiness through whatever surgical/non-surgical means you desire. However, from a taxpayer funded perspective where do you suppose we draw the line on who gets surgery from body indentification issues?

 

No, its not the same at all. Elective plastic surgery is done purely for vanity reasons. Its not a necessary thing those people need to function in their lives. For people like me, who are genuinely born in the wrong body (And remember, this is a recognised medical condition. Unlike people who have elective plastic surgery who have nothing medically wrong with them whatsoever), going on living your whole life living in the wrong body is not really a viable option. You'll either end up just spending your whole life very unhappy (and probably ruIning other people's lives in the process if you wait till you're much older to admit who you are), or committing suicide. (Which a high number of people suffering this condition do end up doing if their condition isnt treated). The 2 things (being born in the wrong body and elective plastic surgery) shouldnt be treated as the same thing as they are not. True gender dysphoria is something you're born with, general dissatisfaction with your body is not.

And lots of people suffering with gender dysphoria (myself included) are taxpayers as well, and i know lots of that money is wasted in far "worse" ways than supporting me and other people with the same condition. I could make a huge list of things that tax payers money is wasted on, but i wont do that right now. The core of your arguement is that people in the wrong body shouldnt be helped by taxpayers as its the same as elective plastic surgery. But the fact is, the 2 things are not even close to being the same thing. Plus, most porcedures involved in the process of changing your body are not publicly funded, and i have had to spend a lot of my own money, money i cant really afford on making my skin just a bit more bearable to live in. You make it sound as if we get everything free, certainly in my experience, that is far from the case. If it were, id have had surgery years ago. But i still havent because of the procedures, and the costs.

You need to get your facts right.

 

Well, apparently our opinions differ. Please respect mine like I do yours. Since my "facts" are my opinions, they are already correct, just like yours

People who have body dissatisfaction issues they want to fix with plastic surgery have anguish that is just as real as yours. Please, don't marginalize these people in defense of your own perspective.

Anyway, I'm sure you pay taxes. Yes, I know the government misappropriates many more dollars on other issues; I don't support this either. No, I don't think everybody looking into sex change operations is leaching the system. I just don't think that non-physiologically necesary operations should be publicly funded, which was at the center of the second question posed by the original poster on whether or not gender dysphoria should be diagnosed.

Anyway, you obviously have passionate and personal feelings about this issue. If you want to carry this debate on, PM rather than turning this forum into a personal boxing arena. I'm happy to have a respectful discussion with you; you'd probably find that I'm more educated and progressively minded that you give me credit for in your original assement.

All the best

 

I do respect your opinion, even though i dont agree with it. I can only go by how ive felt, how ive always felt about who i know i am inside. And also the research that has been done to prove a biological (IE natural) cause for gender dysphoria.

Im not marginalising people who opt for "elective" plastic surgery, as im sure some do have legitimate reasons for wanting it done. (Though some clearly do not.) Im just saying it cant be compared with Gender Dysphoria, as that is a recognised medical condition, with a biological cause. Most people who have elective plastic surgery are not in that category.

I guess where our opinions really clash is that you obviously think people suffering with gender dysphoria have operations that are "Non-physiologically necessary", whereas i know for people suffering from genuine gender dysphoria (not males who feminise their bodies for other frivilous, or purely sexual gratifaction reasons), the surgery and procedures are pysiologically necessary for them to be able to lead any kind of worthwhile life at all.

I dont see this as a "personal boxing match" at all. We just have differing views on this subject, and both have every right to air them, even though we disagree about it. I am respectful of you and your views, even though i think they're wrong. If you thought i was disrepecting you at any point, i can only apologise, as i didnt mean for it to come across like that.

I'd be quite happy to continue this discussion through PM's, if you'd like that.

And same to you