pain and its nature and relevance in life

at any rate, it would definatly be a very rare and special individual that would be able to handle the circumstances we are discussing.

 

True, I guess there is no way to know, he may very well have been numb!

 

on that i agree..

i personally feel that with age comes a higher tolerance for pain as it becomes a fact of life.. what a elderly person deals with on a daily basis im sure would send the average 20 year old to the doctor wondering what the hell was wrong with them..

same would apply for someone with a debilitating ailment.. you learn to accept what you cannot change..

i say this from experience as i aint no spring chicken anymore myself and i deal with aches and pains permanently at this point and im sure they will just get worse with age..

but ive accepted this as a fact of my life and i dont let it bother me,,...

that is the kind of acceptance i can agree that we should all learn to do..
however once again what started my initial rant was not what i just stated...

 

nope, im implying that with the correct thinking, pain can be turned into something akin to pleasure


just look at the bdsm community, theyve learned a variation on this, but basically, pain and pleasure, when you remove all stigma of good and bad, are just that, neural responses
its only when you attach abstract concepts like good and bad to themt hat they become somethign to seek or avoid

you say that it hurts, but why is this a bad thing??you say something feels nice, but why is this a good thing?

are you saying its better for us to feel pleasure than pain, if so, why?

 

well actually, im saying that through the correct thinking and forcing oneself to step back from preconcieved notions, it is possible to turn pain into nothing other than just another feeling, such as the wind on your skin, or the blood flowing through your veins

 

I totally agree with you.

But you must admit, most people are not capable of that in their present state. At least not right now.

 

no im not saying that at all but i also dont think one finds pleasure in pain..

at least no one in there right mind..
i do however feel that one learns to accept a certain amount of discomfort as a fact of life and just deals with it.. therefore they dont let there discomfort affect there life but i in know way see them "akin" accept that they are both inevitable facts of life..

and the buddhist monks as i stated before are somewhat known for there opiate use,.. that is hardly embracing pain akin to pleasure..

once again the reason i went off on a rant was because you suggested these cultures deal with pain on strictly a mental basis and that is simply not true...

its said that at least 10% of buddhist monks in thailand are addicts.. not just occasional users...

 

ill admit that most people arent capable of it, tbh, i posted this here to share this revalation ive had, one i considered rather beautiful and liberating

i wasnt suggesting that these cultures do specifically, i was talking about a way in which one could look at something in a certain way and make it something else

for example:
some people believe that a certain tree is a person, they may reach out and touch that tree, and it will feeel like a person, they can talk to it, and it will talk back to them, fo us it is but a tree, bt for them , it is not

now imagine if we could train ourselves to look at pain the same way, so that for all intents and purposes it functions as a sensation akin to pleasure, and does it still hurt?


anyway, this has been really engaging for me, im glad theres still people i can have an intelligent and creative conversation with

i guess we'll have to agree to disagree

 

well when you can chop your hand off and smile about it i personally will believe you have some serious mental issues but im sure you will feel otherwise..
but i dont see that happening so yes,, we will just have to agree to disagree...

 

Pain is still pain. Yes it would still hurt. However, if we can accept that Pleasure has no greater value than pain, ie not attributing 'good' or 'bad' to either of them. We would not seek pleasure (thus no longer feeling pain when we cannot find it.) And we would not try to avoid pain ( pain is increased when we try to reject it by bringing it to attention) They just are.

 

to the person tlakign to the tree, the person that tree represents only that person


and the trick is to take away only the 'bad' connotations

 

now your speaking of emotional pain and on that i agree 100%.

once again there is a huge difference in ones ability to control emotional pain and ones ability to control physical pain...

 

Yes, exactly. However, the emotional pain often stems from physical pain when we attach value to the physical pain and so the pain persists yet only inside our minds.

 

i assume your speaking of the physical pain persisting only in there minds???
if so,,,l i dunno i guess in some minds that may be true.. the whole psychosomatic thing..

however your speaking of a very small percentile of people in that respect..

 

I apologise, i'm being pretty vague.