Any Athiest LSD Users?

I really feel the OM right now. I feel at one with everything and I feel that logic goes around in circles. You really just have to relax and enjoy the ride sometimes or you might just find that your thoughts are smaller than you ever could have imagined. Perhaps just an illusion, but a very pleasant illusion with a nice relaxing pace.
Sometimes I feel as though the slow meaningless life I live should have more significance or that I should escape to another time and space where things are greater and different. I then find that it is uncomfortable and edgy unless I just let perception flow into this one existence.
All you have to decide is what to do with the time that was given to you.

 

The following is a good synopsis of what I feel psychedelics have shown me:

In the cosmic scheme of things, planet Earth is a mere blip - a tiny planet in one of the thousands or millions of solar systems. That the Creator, the Absolute One (or whatever you call it) who has created this infinite universe should actually care about life on a pimple of a planet is a delusion.

Life on earth is a cosmic accident - a fortuitous thing which happned without any rhyme or reason. Human life on earth has no more significance or purpose than those of plants or animals. But of course Humans cannot accept this. We are highly evolved apes with the power to think, reason, imagine and have the unique ability to blush.

We cannot accept that our lives should have no purpose or meaning just like our unfortunate and "unevolved" cousins - the apes.

Our fear of the unknown and our sense of superiority over other forms of life, have led us to spin this intricate web of theology and religion to give ourselves an illusion of higher purpose. We have created God after our own image, made him a receptacle of all our fears and guilt and turned him into a despot of our inner universe.

Ironically, inspite of God, humans have brought the natural world to the brink of ruin with their greed and scientific arrogance and religious hubris. Given all our power of reason and intellect, we are still morally and instinctually imbeciles.

But all that the humans do is not bad. We also have the capacity for love, to create beauty - as in the arts and music - to endure, struggle and surmount the odds.

Now since we are born and have to spend our tenure here, we do have a purpose in this limited context of life on earth. If human intellect and superiority is of any consequence, then the chief task before us is to live in peace amongst ourselves and with other living beings with whom we share the planet. But all we have done so far is just the opposite. We have visited unspeakable violence not only on our own kind but on the rest of the planet as well.

The key to understanding our purpose is to understand that we are part of Nature, intimately bound to its laws and its whims. Humans will live as long as earth is able to live and breathe with us. Destruction of the earth – which we are relentlessly working towards - will mean the end of all life – with all the elaborate doctrines of heaven and hell flushed down the cosmic tube. And there will no God at the other end.

Peace is the key and the way to achieve is to make universal principles of love, justice and equality core values of human conduct. Beyond this there is no hope.

To conclude, human life may have a purpose but I'm not really sure about its meaning.

 

Im a giant concoction. Some would call me an athiest; I don't believe in God in any traditional means.

My belief is that God and orginized religion in general is a pathetic excuse for humans to explain the unexplainable. It's a crutch: an opiate if you will. Human's do not have the ability to comprehend a higher power, it's beyond our scope of reasoning. Every culture or civilization in history has believed that their religion was valid and correct. So how is Christianity or any modern religion more correct than, lets say, Greek mythology? Scientifically, it just doesn't make sense to me. I've gone to a Christian school from kindergarden to 12th grade, I've read the Bible straight through at least 5 times. After rigorous studies of the religion, I've come to the unassailable conclusions that it's totally bunk. There are way too many inconsistencies. Jesus had a very simple message, he never put himself above anyone. He said that he was the son of God, and that we are all God's children as well...It's my view that he never wanted to be immortalized as some divine being, and after he died the apostles created these stories about all these "miracles" to help solidify the Church and give people a reason to follow them.

In the name of "God"...we have slaughtered thousands. Whether it be Manifest Destiny, The crusades, Terrorism, on down the line; we have takin billions of lives in the name of this spector. And It's bullshit. Poeple need to learn to empower themselves and be their own divinty.

I think that "God" is merely the force that started the big bang. He's not created in the image of humans, that's just some stupid self absorbed human construct we created because we love ourselves so fucking much. God is pure energy...that's the way i see it at least

And this whole afterlife hogwash......

When the body dies, there is a 12-15 minute period where your brain is still firing, nuerons (serotonin + dopamine, etc) are still being release in your brain. Then think about thisss...when you dream, you can be asleep for 5 minutes and have a dream that lasts for days and days; dream world essentially has no constrictions in regards to time. So pair that 12-15 minutes with the most massive dose of DMT being naturally released into your brain...a higher dose than you could ever smoke. You could live an entire life within that 12 minutes. That is my belief on the afterlife...it's a scientific theory that something along these lines does actually occur, obviously no one knows what happens exactly because you have to die first...but something DOES happen. That would explain why people "go to heaven" and back when their heart stops and they are revived.

If i had to label myself, I would probably say i am a humanist/nihilist/athiest...My main principal is that human life is sacred...we need to live eternally in our own minds as our own divinity and follow our own path of rightousness. Not live subjugated in a world of shackles in fear of some big bad ghost high above the heavens.

"Tempted the devil with my song; and got what I wanted all along."

By the way: Well said LiquidL

Our purpose is simple: breed. Just like all other animals. It's my view that we need to use our mental sueriority and create a better Earth by the time we die than it was in generations past. That's not neccissarily our inherent purpose of living, it just seems like that's what we are best suited for. Creativity is another trait that seperates us from beasts. Creativity in art, music, tchnology, wisdom, etc etc etc...we must utilize these things. It's what makes us individual; if we do nothing but watch T.V. and smoke weed, zoning out into some omnicolored fantasy world for our entire lives...we have lived no differently than a squirrel.

 

Adding on to what LiquidL said...you are so right on dude.

Our solar system is one out of billions of other solar systems in our galaxy, "the Milky Way". Our Unvierse is composed of billions and billions of other galaxies, some exponentially larger than our own. People go through their entire lives without realizing how incredibly vast our universe is. Our Earth is like a single grain out of all the grains of sand in all the deserts on the planet: fucking huge. Each one of these solar systems (trillion and trillions and trillions) has just enough potential to support some form of life. Mathematically speaking, it doesnt make sense to think that there isnt intelligent life SOMEWHERE out there.

The idea that a single God exists watching over the human species DOESNT WORK. It's ignorant bollucks. Humans have a certian lobe in their brain which activates the need to believe in a higher power (this is science btw not a point of view) We don't have the capabilites to fathom these types of things naturally so people created these religions and deities in a more primitive time when they thought that the Earth was the center of the universe...and they have been simply passed the, down through generations. There will be a time (in the not to distant future IMO) where athiests and humanists and agnostics will largely outnumber ANY orginized faith. Solely because we have enough information to realize that God, in the way that orginized relgions portrays 'him' doesnt make sense...they are out dated and blind.


Jst a fun brain teaser...what is beyond the universe itself? It's something that we cant even come up with a logical theory for...but i can almost guarentee that there is some other form of "being" or energy that transcends the boarder of the universe that we live in. Also, there could be an entirely new microscopic world within the atom that is too small for us to see with even the strongest microscope. But we dont know, we cant fathom these things. It's in the same way that we cant fully comprehend relgion so we fill in the gaps with stories and lies passed off as fact. It gives us that sense of security, so that we feel comfortable, living our entire lives with this concept of a reward system after we die(heaven and immortality). The Vikings killed and pillaged for hundreds of years with reason because they thought that they would be rewarded eternally in Valhalla. If you were to ask a Christian what they thought of this, they would say that all Vikings are going to burn in hell, but whos right? No one is right...they are both human constructs. If the world ended and there we two more people left on Earth, one being me and one being a girl. We could rebuild the world and its population and i could make a brand new relgion that everyone would believe...and when population was back up in the billions, Mikeonolgy would be as prominent as Islam and people would lay other humans to waste in my name: fucked up...but true.

I'm smrter than 90% of the population that lived 2000-10000 years ago when most of the orginized religions are formed...and so are all of you. We are educated. We know about the cosmos, and we know that humans (in the larger scheme of things) are obsolete compared to the awesome power of the Universe. We have the internet at our disposal...a vast network of knowledge greater than any sultan or king's library that lived thousands of years go.

So...who am i going to trust...the fairy tales created by the irrational, undeveloped and uneducated minds of primordial era's; people who believed their small piece of middle eastern country side was the center of the galaxy? Or am i going to believe my own, educated, rational view; backed by scientic, unbaised reasoning. The answer is obvious, to me anyway.



Im sorry if anyone sees my views as pompous. I dont mean to sound arrogant, and by no means am i calling anyone wrong ragardless of what your beliefs are. These are my own views, im just putting them out there for everyone to see

 

Good post PsychMyke.

Here's another conundrum about the omniscient (all-knowing) God that fails the consistency check:

Free will vs. omniscience:
God is all-knowing? Yes.
God knows your past? Yes.
God knows your present? Yes.
God knows your future? Yes.
God know what you will do in 10 years time exactly from now? Yes.
God must know your destination is in life? Yes.
Then where is your free-will? Seems to me that God already knows everything about you. Your every single atom. You every single electron. Why will such a loving God then punish you for doing something bad in your life which, by the way, he knew you were going to do even before you were ever born (he knows the future - remember?) ??

Ok so lets back up. I have free will. I can make good/bad/neutral choices. Ok. Then God cannot know what you will do 6 seconds from now because it is not predestined. But then God cannot be omniscient because he doesn't know your future. In that case, God is not really God but a super-powerful being that is bound by the laws of this Universe, namely, the inability to know the future. Maybe God is a superhuman alien from Alpha Centauri who knows every second of each person's life but he still doesn't know what a person is about to do! Superhuman? Yes. Impressive? Definitely! Omniscient God? Hardly.

Psychedelics have opened my eyes to this existence. The one I can experience with my senses. Literally the "Be here now" mantra. Why would I distrust my senses in favor of an old mythological book like the Bible? Makes no sense.

 

well since my spirituality is getting bashed in here, guess it's time i do a post.

liquidL, you are refering to calvinism, a concept that many christians think of as utter bullshit. how can someone know the future, when the future doesn't even really exist?

I think it is very obvious that there is a creator. i dont see how all of this could be an accident. it is more logical to accept that there is a creator, than think there is an infintisimal chance of perfect order and beauty being created by accident out of impossible nothingness.

you have to admit that humans are a very unique creature on this planet. there is nothing that acts like us at all. so if you claim we evolved from apes, then i am going to assume that you accept darwins theory of natural selection and survival of the fittest. if this is true, then where do our morals and empathy come from? why would one human risk his/her own DNA, to save the life of another? what purpose would that serve in a universe without God?

im not a fundamentalist by any means, but i do think that God definatly exist, and that we are children of that God.

 

No need for mental masturbation, dudes.

 

^hahaha

it's all a matter of opinion. I was a christian for a LONG time. I know more about the christian faith than most on this forum (trust me i wish i didnt) solely because of being schooled in the Catholic education system my whole life. Im not bragging I'm just saying, I know the Bible in and out and there are alot of inconsistencies. God as the Christians portray him just doesn't make sense to me. There is obviously some higher power, some natural energy which started the big bang and spurred our universe into existence. But almost all of the Christian religion was founded by the mind and pen of man...and no i dont mean Jesus. Men are corrupt, men kill, men lust for power, men lust for fame. I dont trust it. We are products of our environment, and i have yet to see concrete proof that God as he's portrayed in the good book exists. But that's just me, im not forcing my views on anyone, im not saying you're wrong. Obviously you COULD be right, just as much as I COULD be right. But that's the main reason why i dont like religion, because when i ask "Where's the proof" the only answer i get in response is..."have faith.."

It's just not for me, maybe someday my view will change. But the way the world looks to me now, i see far to much evil EVERYWHERE to believe we were created by the divine. And if there is a God, until he purges the world on iniquity...I want nothing to do with him. People are dying everywhere of brutal and unnessicary causes, and we are helpess to change it...God suppossidly can, but he wont...i dont like the smell of it.

And there is obviously going to mental masturbation in an LSD forum about Athiesm...

Thats like throwing a mouse in a pit full of snakes and expecting them not to fight, lol

 

well first of all let me just say that i am not here to get into some nasty arguement. i just like talking to people who disagree with me on this. i think it expands the mind and forces me to think about things and question my faith (which, believe it or not, I consider a good thing)


that being said, i dont trust the bible either mike. if it was the infalliable word of God, then why all the denominations and interpretations and bickering, right? but i dont think it is meant to be an absolute all anyways. to each their own.

as for this...


"It's just not for me, maybe someday my view will change. But the way the world looks to me now, i see far to much evil EVERYWHERE to believe we were created by the divine. And if there is a God, until he purges the world on iniquity...I want nothing to do with him. People are dying everywhere of brutal and unnessicary causes, and we are helpess to change it...God suppossidly can, but he wont...i dont like the smell of it."


this used to get me. but then i realized, why would God come down here and fix things? im sure you have wrongs in your life, as do I, but who would I be if my life was perfect? also, if i was God, im not sure i would change everything either. there is so much sin and evil, and yet we still latch onto it all. there are very few spiritual people left in the world. i dont see why God would just magically fix everything for a bunch of evil fuckers that don't give a shit about him. "Let the suffering commence" is what I would say.

i think it's for our own good.

 

I completely dismiss the God of the Bible, Koran, Talmud.

That's never the God that I am talking about when I say God.

Just felt like clearing that up.

 

I've more or less grown out of my desire to discuss with people wether or not God is reality because the fragile mind alone need's to project it's insecurities on other's in order to grow faith as if it were a plant in a garden. This sort of need many religious type feed off of is the reason why Myke and Liquid are claiming that divine literature is caused by man's inability to come to terms with being insignificant in the eyes of the macrocosmic mirror, as well as being birthed and weened on fear and control. This state of mind is the aftermath of corruption and is more than likely not at all the intention with which the scripture was written.
First I'd like to ask you def, have you actually read the Qu'ran? Because if you had you would know that not only is there no more than one attribute applied to Allah which is mercy, but also that men have been killed by the extremists for even attempting to give description to the Absolute. Allah is very close to us but very distant in attainment according to Al-Islam and the actions said to be dictated by Allah are more attributed to Mother Nature without giving Her a name out of fear of having more than one God. Try reading up on some scripture under Sufism and you will see what I mean.
Anyway, the point Im trying to make in any post I write about God other than just loving Her, is that coming to terms with the nature of existance only can be brought on by trascending the limitation of human consciousness. No matter how one goes about doing this, if you can break out of the simple minded cage of seeing humanity as the only life form, the universe as the only universe, and consciousness as being limited to a few gross material hosts, ditributed amongst on us, you will begin to see that nothing is as it seems. The very structure of subatomic particles is so misunderstood right now, but science is just barely scratching the surface by poking and prodding at the String Theory, which if one were to actually look, one would realise that ancient Hindu rishi's have already clearly layed out the foundation of vibrational existance and explained God as the cosmic Conductor of this massive symphony known as everything. It is not about looking for God outside in the external world, because while She can be found there, She is within you and your only direct knowledge of Her, not blind faith, comes from actually looking. If you dont expect to find Her and never try, well what can one expect?
And it's sad how we have to post things like "by the way this is just my opinion not trying to bash anyone" I do it all the time. It's sad really how offended people might get by our posts!
Namaste -

 

Well it's not really Islam which causes violence as much as many would like to believe. It is more social conditioning, poverty, opression, and less evolved moral values. The insecurity seems to be more towards possesion over woman rather than God. If anything, muslims generally have more strength in their faith than anything else. The Qu'ran teaches peace, but the violence written in the Book gets taken out of context and used by some as an excuse to get their message across to others. They have a voice that sadly no one listens to until stuff starts blowing up, and then everybody suffers.

 

And if people actually looked, they would see that the battles were forced on the muslims in an attempt to convert or root them out! Not the other way around :tongue:

 

i totally agree..but

wrongs in my life are insignificant

Genocide is never good for anyone, hindsight or otherwise.

 

Lol i know

really nice post btw

I just feel the need to say things like that because alot of times my views make me sound portentious in the way that i express them. I just like to let people know that I am open minded and accept the possiblity of everything.

If someone were to say my views were wrong i would get upset...not because i think my views are right, just because of the ignorance such a statement can convey. If there was a right or wrong answer in regards to religion than this post wouldnt exist.

 

Underlining the religion of Islam has some truths to it, but it is full of Dogma, and nothing of the Koran was a direct recitation of God down to Gabriel, down to Mohammad.

Also, yes, I actually once thought that I would become a muslim, so I bought 2 Korans, and a book describing the origins and the meanings. One book was an oxford publishing, and the other was by someone else - I forgot his name... anyway. I haven't exactly read the koran front to back, but probably read about 50% of it, and I'll point this out:

1) Mohammad was a political leader, and used his religion to order people around and it worked beautifully. He went to tribes and got many of them killed - I don't know many true prophets that do this.

2) The Koran itself is said to be the direct word from God, right? The logic that Islamic people have is that even if a certain verse sounds evil to you; it doesn't matter - you do it, because there is a supremely more intelligent being than yourself, so going against this being would be dangerous and not to mention very foolhardy. For example, there is a verse in the Koran that states that if someone cheats on their wife/husband, than they should be stoned to death. But there are some rules, some guidelines before you are allowed to do this. One of these guidelines is that about 5, or whatever amount of people (I forgot) had to witness the actually act. When I read this verse, I scurried down to a muslim forum, asking if what I am reading is right. All of the muslims told me that it was right, and that doing that wouldn't be wrong, even if I feel that it is wrong... even if my gut is telling me that you just don't stone people to death, for whatever reason... They pretty much told me what I just explained. If God is almighty, and merciful, then you should listen to him, even if what he is asking of you sounds sick... because it is God... After that, I just dropped whatever idea I had about turning into a muslim.

Islam would be ok if 1) It didn't have any political motivations 2) Didn't say crazy things like stoning someone to death.

I am sorry, but if that's how it is, then yes... the religion is pretty evil, even if you can pick at it and find all of the good stuff - You can't mix hate and love into the same mix. You can't say God is merciful and then say it's ok to kill - That just doesn't work.

Good muslims are good, despite of their belief. Good people will pick out the good, while the bad people will just pick out the bad. You can't be a true muslim without being contradictory... you have to ignore a lot of it.

I don't know how translatable these verses are, but a lot of it is pretty clear with it's message - I think people are just really digging deep... and like I said, the good people will dig deep and find something, even if where they found it from didn't come from the Koran, but rather, from themselves, and from their hearts.


The true religion is personalized - It all comes from within.


And, honestly, Replayer, I think you can get a good sense of the type of person that I am. I don't like to judge people, or their beliefs, and I hate feeling superior to anyone, and I really don't, ever. It is more about being a tad frustrated than anything else. Whenever I read some hardcore atheistic beliefs, I just read it, and I go "oh boy, not this again - I wish they can see what many of us are seeing. I wish they understand what they're missing." But like you have said, everyone has their time that they're ready, and I'll just leave it at that. But at the same time, I won't apologize for my beliefs, and I don't feel it neccessary to 'flower-up' my replies.

On a side note, thanks for teaching me some things, replayer. I think you have helped me to see more of the true nature of reality - I think that I am really starting to understand the effects of ego on man... it can make you delusional - Science has a way of turning everything into objects, and I think this really misses the point.

 

Ok I hear you def. Im not saying that the Qu'ran does not contain violence, Im just saying what you essentially said, it has truth to it as well as peace. However I dont agree that you cant be a muslim just becase you dont accept the Qu'ran as other men do, this is the kind of Arabic social conditioning that is simply absurd and sadly associated with all muslims, when in fact only 30% of the worlds Islamic population live in Arabia. The Qu'ran says that anyone who utters ašhadu an lā ilāha illā-llāh, wa ašhadu anna muhammadan rasūlu-llāh is considered a Muslim, even if they have never read the Qu'ran itself.
Honestly the way I see Muhammad as a prophet is that God gave him messages, Gabriel represents the soul or the means with which one communicates with God. If you follow any Hadith you would find that when revelation came to Muhammad, he would react in several different ways but just about every instance, he claimed that he heard the revelation in a manner no one else could perceive around him, this is why I attribute his meditative efforts at communing with the Absolute form to the Holy Spirit, or Om. The Qu'ran is riddled with both love and violence, but its core message is that humanity is one, we are all God's children, that all religions of the world are to be respected as divine only that they were tampered with by evil men. Islam became the same way but the idea that one man heard something like Om and wiped out an entire nation of violent oppresors is pretty amazing if you ask me. Nevermind what it has become, it was based on good intentions and united millions upon millions of people in peace save for some bad apples which exist in any and every part of the world.

 

By the way I was raised as a muslim for more than half of my life so you will have to excuse me for standing up for a religion that I do not exclusivley associate myself with.

 

I really dont want to fight, but this statement was a little mean. That is cool if you dont want to talk to people about faith, but to say that my mind is fragile and insecure because i like to talk about one of the most profound things in my life is totally not cool. There is nothing wrong with me hearing other people's opinions. Im 18 years old John, and I have no problem admitting that I dont have it all figured out. Not what i would expect from you...


theguitarman, i really gotta go with def zep on this one.

"You can't say God is merciful and then say it's ok to kill"

The mercy they are referring to at some times, is mercy in the afterlife.

Why can't they be merciful now? Why would they stone someone for their sins? Do thy forget that they are sinners even as they are stoning someone?

"So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses."

 

I really dont want to fight, but this statement was a little mean. That is cool if you dont want to talk to people about faith, but to say that my mind is fragile and insecure because i like to talk about one of the most profound things in my life is totally not cool. There is nothing wrong with me hearing other people's opinions. Im 18 years old John, and I have no problem admitting that I dont have it all figured out. Not what i would expect from you...


theguitarman, i really gotta go with def zep on this one.

"You can't say God is merciful and then say it's ok to kill"

The mercy they are referring to at some times, is mercy in the afterlife.

Why can't they be merciful now? Why would they stone someone for their sins? Do they forget that they are sinners even as they are stoning someone?

"So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses."