Atention wise men and sages, a question...

says whom? those who arent? LOL!

 

I refuse to enter into a battle of the wits with an unarmed opponent..end of story.

Here it comes.....

 

that sounds funny, from experience i know that it is all what you are able to do... and as prove for it, what i was answering to was your battle started in my abscence.. much easier, huh?!

 

xxxxxxxxxxxxx (my answer)

 

No sir, says those who are. There are many self realized individuals in this universe. Even God describes the qualities of a person who is enlightened. It is described in bhagavad gita. Please read it in your free time.

 

I DONT BELIEVE IN GOD NOR IN THE BAGAVAD GITA.

Anything else? like first hand knowledge?

 

But have you read the gita? You don't really have to believe it to read and see the importance of the dialogue within it.

If you want first hand knowledge, I cannot show it to you, it seems that your mind is very agitated, find some peace first. Undertake a yoga.

We have hatha yoga: The stretching excercises will develop your health.
Dhyana Yoga: Meditation on a mantra and image continously within the mind.
Jnana Yoga: Self reflection as to who you are, but rejecting the notion that you are your body.
Karma Yoga: Doing selfless deeds continously.
Bhakti Yoga: giving devotional service to the Lord.
Raja Yoga: Pranayama, breathing excercises and meditation.

Do any of these, and you will attain the equipment to see it first hand.

 

i know all those, I was at the end doing Raja yoga only.
dropped it since very long.
I begin yoga when i was 14, I taught it to me on my own never took classes.
the gita and the non gita.
i've been there done that and thats in the past, next.
I know i am very very very very agitated and for good reasosn or bad ones.
i am in the eye and the borders of a storm since weeks.
And i have used all my ressources to resist it and to found a way out.
it call and attract other storms to it, amplify
i know that but i cant kill the major one i cant untangle it alone.
the knot is there and has to be taken care of but i cannot do so on my own, so i have to found the angle in whish i will be able to can see it and go through it with a smile on my face feeling good about it, and to can turn the winds in my favor, to can make advantage of the pressure and negativity so it works for me, so that i can feel happy and have a smile on my soul, and then, then this source of pressure and pain and unbalance will disappear, and harmony will be restaure.
But how do I get there from here? I have to build a bridge but i have no more ressources. It should have been now. Why is it delayed again?

As for your other reamrk, i already have first hand. We are in it right now. I do not live in a monastery in himalaya, I am living here, at the center of the storm and riding several of them at once.
Like with illusion offense depend what you make of it. define offense proof and define illusion.
I dont give a shit until i give a shit. and thats my definition, and i do react when vertues or truth justice harmony love sincerity or all are touched. How I react depend on the sun or on the storm. if it destroy all my work by damamging the recievers, the containmers, diminishing their capacity to recieve it, because of soemone stiupid intervention then ic an do plenty to try to discourage that person, because lot is at stake for others.
of course i cant explain it to the one doing so as if he could understood he will not have done so in the first place.
And i also use ti as a damp releaser for the other storm, the real one.
But when you are in real struggle and pain, even smiling hurt.

There is 2 mountains and i am on top of both, yet i am told that i do not have finish to climb, yet i dont see how i could climb higher nor why it had to be now.
ok, enough water for today.
i have to sleep at some point. When i will have found a way out.

 

hehe, very well.

I will put some quotes from bhagavad gita for your own climbing.

A LIST OF MAJOR DIVINE QUALITIES THAT SHOULD BE CULTIVATED FOR SALVATION
Lord Krishna said: Fearlessness, purity of inner psyche, perseverance in the yoga of Self-knowledge, charity, sense restraint, sacrifice, study of the scriptures, austerity, honesty; nonviolence, truthfulness, absence of anger, renunciation, equanimity, abstaining from malicious talk, compassion for all creatures, freedom from greed, gentleness, modesty, absence of fickleness, splendor, forgiveness, fortitude, cleanliness, absence of malice, and absence of pride these are some of the qualities of those endowed with divine virtues, O Arjuna. (16.01-03)

A LIST OF DEMONIC QUALITIES THAT SHOULD BE GIVEN UP BEFORE SPIRITUAL JOURNEY CAN BEGIN
O Arjuna, the marks of those who are born with demonic qualities are: Hypocrisy, arrogance, pride, anger, harshness, and ignorance. (16.04)
Divine qualities lead to salvation, the demonic qualities are said to be for bondage. Do not grieve, O Arjuna, you are born with divine qualities. (16.05)



THERE ARE ONLY TWO TYPES OF HUMAN BEINGS THE WISE AND THE IGNORANT
There are only two types (or castes) of human beings in this world: The divine, or the wise; and the demonic, or the ignorant. The divine has been described at length, now hear from Me about the demonic, O Arjuna. (16.06)
Persons of demonic nature do not know what to do and what not to do. They neither have purity nor good conduct nor truthfulness. (16.07)
They say: The world is unreal, without a substratum, without a God, and without an order. Sexual union of man and woman alone and nothing else causes the world. (16.08)
Adhering to this wrong atheist view, these degraded souls — with small intellect and cruel deeds are born as enemies for the destruction of the world. (16.09)
Filled with insatiable desires, hypocrisy, pride, and arrogance; holding wrong views due to delusion; they act with impure motives. (16.10)
Obsessed with endless anxiety lasting until death, considering sense gratification their highest aim, convinced that sense pleasure is everything; (16.11)
Bound by hundreds of ties of desire and enslaved by lust and anger; they strive to obtain wealth by unlawful means for the fulfillment of sensual pleasures. They think: (16.12)
This has been gained by me today, I shall fulfill this desire, I have this much wealth, and will have more wealth in the future; (16.13)
That enemy has been slain by me, and I shall slay others also. I am the Lord. I am the enjoyer. I am successful, powerful, and happy; (16.14)
I am rich and born in a noble family. Who is equal to me? I shall perform sacrifice, I shall give charity, and I shall rejoice. Thus deluded by ignorance; (16.15)
Bewildered by many fancies; entangled in the net of delusion; addicted to the enjoyment of sensual pleasures; they fall into a foul hell. (16.16)
Self-conceited, stubborn, filled with pride and intoxication of wealth; they perform service only in name, for show, and not according to scriptural injunction. (16.17)
These malicious people cling to egoism, power, arrogance, lust, and anger; and hate Me who dwells in their own bodies and those of others. (16.18)

SUFFERING IS THE DESTINY OF THE IGNORANT



I hurl these haters, cruel, sinful, and mean people into the cycles of rebirth in the womb of demons again and again. (16.19)
O Arjuna, entering the wombs of demons birth after birth, the deluded ones sink to the lowest hell without ever attaining Me (until their minds change for the better by the causeless mercy of the Lord). (16.20)


LUST, ANGER, AND GREED ARE THE THREE GATES TO HELL



Lust, anger, and greed are the three gates of hell leading to the downfall (or bondage) of the individual. Therefore, one must learn to give up these three. (16.21)
One who is liberated from these three gates of hell, O Arjuna, does what is best for him or her, and consequently attains the Supreme Abode. (16.22)


ONE MUST FOLLOW THE SCRIPTURAL INJUNCTIONS

One, who acts under the influence of his or her desires, disobeying scriptural injunctions, neither attains perfection nor happiness, nor the Supreme Abode. (16.23)
Therefore, let the scripture be your authority in determining what should be done and what should not be done. You should perform your duty following the scriptural injunction. (16.24)

 

jedi, the gita is a book of wisdom, not a book of facts which you seem to confuse the difference between, there is nothing to believe in gita cuz none of it is true, its wisdom

 

Right Molly.

 

thanks

from my perspective it was a left but my left is your right

 

Excellent . I was hoping for a post like this. This is an excellent example and case study of Jalpa.

Jalpa (wrangling) is that kind of dialogue in which one or both of the parties involved is primarily interested in victory rather than establishing the truth. For this reason, it is traditionally associated with the quality of rajas or passion. It is similar to Vaada in that both sides are advancing a thesis which is supported by proof and syllogistic reasoning. In Jalpa, however, one or both of the opponents resorts to the use of less-than-honourable tactics to defeat the argument of the opposition.

I never stated anyone to follow the hindu religion or anything. I only stated that there is a proper manner of debate as stated by Vaada , and only presented it to you two, since this is the hindu forum.And I have presented it in other forums as well, in order to promote the ideals of Vaada. And since this is the hinduism forum, it is only apt that I will put my post on vaada to you guys, if I see that ideal debate is not going on.
And not only me, everyone else should do this, and nip every potential jalpa or vitaanda debate in the bud, before it pollutes themselves and others and spread negative vibes. This forum should be as sattvic and pure as possible, not rajasic or tamasic.

I couldnt get any knowledge or make anything out of this. Logically speaking , you seem to be assuming things about me , without any base of proofs.
And if you do have proofs to back your assumption, please furnish it,as I am eager to know about my personality quirks. I like knowing myself.

Meaning of the bean ! What do you mean by this ?

Finally cuteface, I enjoy watching your picture.

 

I also just read the whole thread, and I find you making authoritative comments (though I find a lot of errors )and also claiming that you are enlightened.

Perhaps in the interest of mankind and humanity, you can tell us about the course of action that led to your 'enlightenment', and your subsequent experiences.

 

I find your statement contradictory. How can wisdom be untrue !!!

 

Thats what is called using sophisme in argumentation.
Which mean using a pseudo arguemnt, an argument who isnt true. Like saying this parfume is good because einstein say so. But einstein has no knowledge about parfume. Sophisme are widly used in advertising, but also in politic.
It is building an argumentation which foundations are false.
The same can occur in an solid builded argumentation, but where one or several links are wrong, where the logical step who has been taken to the next level of the argumentation is not proven, but more assumed as true.
Thats where logical argumentation and arguemntation theory help the philosopher to avoid errors. The same construction type is used in science, and in all development of scientifical theories.

Sophiesme occured during greek period, and the cast of sophiste like to meet once a week and argue agianst other philosophers. Who didnt like the way those sophists were working.
It is from the cast of sophists that lawyers come from, they were used a lot under the greek empire by owners who wanted to solve a litige in their favor, and used sophismes constantly, and it is this argumentations method who is used at large by lawyers today.
Specially if they need a circonvoluted way to prove a lie true..

About your ideals I wil strongly suggest you to live them instead to talk about them.

As for the last part, well, didnt you just give me the prove of it right now?
By what you wrote above..

 

I very well know about sophistry,cuteface, and it has no relevance here.

The theory of jalpa is a very logical thing which anyone with an intelligent mind can understand, and you seem to be following that , and you are trying to save your skin by following sophistry yourself. Kind of like the pot calling the kettle black.

 

I don't think I have boasted or bragged, and nor do I see anything wrong in boasting as well. Boasting and praising oneself is good for ones morale, selfesteem and helps to get rid of depression or lack of confidence, which are also great vices.

When Arjuna , in a particular period of the mahabharatha war, was severely depressed and wanted to commit suicide, krishna intuitively understood this, and asked him to go to his tent and sit down and contemplate strictly on all his positive qualities and achievements and nothing else for a period of time.
Arjuna did what Krishna said , and after the period, emerging from his tent, he appeared rejuvenated and revitalised and his depression had gone.

Boasting becomes wrong only when we think we are good enough to trample upon others rights and person.

 

LOL! you dont know anything about it as I can see!
You are so arrogant that it hurt to see you fighting like that against you own deamons.
Stop calling me names. It is forbidden in this forum, and not very polite to do so.

 

you do so constantly and in all your posts. All you have to do is open your eyes to the truth and be sincere.
Can you?