One more freedom gone.

This is it right here. Don't worry though everyone else will be bitching when they start banning and taxing fat, its coming. People let the government take a role in our general health(our decisions)(and where you work is a decision) and you think it will stop there?

 

People only hurt themselves when they're "fat", smoking hurts everyone else.

But I guess if power plants spraying toxic fumes into the air is legal. Why not just lite up anywhere...

 

To all the pro-ban people in this thread:

Give me a fucking break!

1.)"It's everybody's air"

last i checked you don't have to stand next to a person who's smoking, jesus take 2 fucking steps.

2.) "it' just rude"

Legislating politeness is okay now? fuck you.

3.) "i don't want 2nd hand when i'm trying to eat."

so eat somewhere else! You chose to eat there knowing at the time that the place allows smoking, if You don't want to be around smokers then eat somewhere else.

4.) "what about the manager/busser/server/bartender/musician who doesn't want to be around 2nd hand'

see #3, replace the word "eat" with the word "work"...

and comparing my cigarette to "power plants spraying toxic fumes", are you fucking serious?

 

the flaw in your anti ban argument is in assuming cigarette smoke only travels 2 feet. In a room, whatever a large size room in your mind, lets say big enough for a banquet, if it hasn't been smoked in I can guarantee you that everyone in that room will smell you lite up. If not immediately than within a few minutes. Especially if they're smelling receptors are not damaged by cigarette smoke.

Give you a break? Give me a break. YOUR the one who chooses to have a habit, not me. Why should I sacrifice my space with YOUR pollution.

I don't have anything against smokers. Most of my friends smoke. But all of them have respect for us that don't. Otherwise I wouldn't be chilling with them

 

When they banned smoking in New York, restraunts' business went up like 10% or more!
So as a bartender I'm with bannding smoking. Its not like we can just step back or walk away.

 

.

 

I forgot to mention as a waitress you cannot simply step back 2 feet, even if 2 feet feel would do anything, which it wouldn't unless you were outside, which is what I'm advocating for. I wouldn't be doing my job if I took your advice and I wouldn't make any money trying to take an order far from the table/customer, let alone hear them correctly. (you obviously haven't worked in restaurants/bars)

The smoke gets soooo thick at my work that my eyes will start to burn and customers will ask me if I'm crying. Not to mention I smell like shit when I get home.

And I choose not to smoke. Which are not suppost to smoke anyways. You think thats fair? YOU want the big break. Can anyone here make that sound alright to me and all the other nonsmokers here?

Plus when they inniated the smoking ban in other states they noticed a new thrend in restaruants/bars. Nonsmokers started coming out. business went up.

I do feel bad for you guys b/c it's winter, I do. But that still doesn't make it okay in my book.

 

Even though I am a smoker...I must agree with Crystal...we smokers are the ones that are choosing to harm ourselves, nonsmokers shouldn't be forced to breath our smoke inside public places. My city is working on a ban right now, the county council and the mayor are against government imposed ban, but the people seem to mostly want smoke-free places. A few of our restaurants in town have already taken the leap to be non-smoking establishments, and they don't seem to be losing business. The general consensus in town is that the businesses themselves should decide, not the government, then we all can choose where we want to patronize, and where we don't. It's like some folks in my town are saying, if you can't go into a restaurant and have a meal and wait for an hour or hour and a half for a cigarette, that is pretty pathetic, LOL. Myself, I have just 3-4 throughout the day at work, but only until January 1st, 2007, which is when my employer is going smoke-free on all hospital grounds. We are not even supposed to smoke if we leave the property at lunch, because the patients are bothered by the smell on our clothes. IMO, it's time smokers had more consideration for non-smokers, if WE want to smoke, WE should have to make the special effort to not bother other people, not the other way around. Peace

 

wow thats cool your town does that. Here though it's all smoking with non smoking accomadations. If I did have a choice between a smoking bar and a non smoking I'd definitely pick the non, and then smokers and non smokers would have nothing to bitch about seeing as they had a choice. But thats not here....

How did you town get so open minded?

 

This new law also bans smoking outside the entrances to buildings. Just to add one more annoying poke at those who think they can just go outside to smoke.

I voted against it, as did my daughter (there were actually two such issues). We tried.

 

Ok lets run with that flawed assumption. Cars, electricity, natural gas and many other things create toxic polution that can cause cancer. If I don't have a car I should be able to ban everyone else? If I just hudle under blankets for warmth, I should be able to ban everyone else from heating their homes because I have to breath the polution. Same with almost anything in modern life. Cells give off radiation, why should I be subjected to someone elses radiation if I choose to not use one. People just keep on making calls by me though. You can not get away from every little thing that causes harm. That is real life. Many of these things are causing rises in cancer rates. Isn't it funny how cancer deaths have soared even though smoking is steadily decreasing? The car you drive puts out much more toxic polution for people to breath then someone smoking. Hell lets all live in little rubber balls then nothing harmful can touch us ever. If you are so frightened of smoke then stay inside your own controlled environment don't push the safety nazi crap on everyone else or at least not until your own daily activities aren't creating toxins.

Oh and they say being "fat" effects others because we have to pay more in medical expenses in the form of taxes. Remember this argument from the anti smoking campains, you will see it used again.

 

That's something I've wondered about too. I wonder if there are any hard stats on how many children have been saved from horrible head injuries since helmets are a state statute for kids on bicycles in California. Funny how we never do follow up stats, to see how efficient these legislative acts actually are. They seem to be self perpetuating.

I think personally more kids are staying home and getting fat playing XBox, rather than wear a sweat creating helmet to ride to a friends in the summertime in California.

 

So Haid...

The worlds fucked so just fuck it so more?

Thats not a good argument. Yes other things are killing us and some things should be done about it. We should be using eco-cars and solar power. Everything you said has a safe alternative that could be applied if people were willing to change and start to care. but see, it's easier not to care. Just like it's easier for you to lite up with no question of the morality of doing so around those who would rather stay away. And for you to tell them to stay at home if they want to care about their health. thats NAZI

It's not nazi to tell other people to keep their harmful habits theirs and not yours. It's nazi for you to FORCE your habit on others.

And another thing. I used the term nazi in my rebuttal only to prove a point, that it doesn't really prove a point. you dig? . you don't get anywhere by calling people nazi's. It doesn't help your argument or make you look good. Unless I really am a hitler nazi and I can assure you I am not. The nazi's did way worse things than ban people from smoking inside.

Being an environmentalist does not make you a nazi. forcing your beliefs on others, your getting alittle closer. but who's forcing their beliefs. you or me. me who does not care what you do at home or on the street as long as its not in an en enclosed space with people who do not choose the habit, or you who says I have to breath your cigarrette air everytime I have dinner out or go to the bar to get a drink when you make the choice to smoke and not I. Or better yet.
That I shouldn't have a life if I care. Yea right.

 

Safety Nazi is just a common term around here.

If there are so many people creating a market for smoke free restraunts and bars then people are free to open one and make all that money. Why should every business be forced to follow the health concerns of some. You or anybody else has always been free to tap this market. The answer doesn't lie in pushing your beliefs on others. I can understand it in public and government institutions. I can understand it in businesses that wish to pursue a non-smoking market niche.

It would not even be remotely possible to remove every bit of polution created by someones personal choice. At some point you have to be responsible for yourself and avoid chemicals, toxin or other technologies on a personal level. You supposedly care unlike me, so you cause any polution that effects others? You don't drive a car, heat you house, buy manufactured products. Sure its possible to avoid these things, but do you? I don't think so. These things effect all of our health. The alternatives are out there so why aren't you using them?

You may be of the opinion that personal choice should be stamped out for the greater good of the masses but I don't. For one who decides whats best for the masses? Who get persecuted and who doesn't? People who drink, do drugs, smoke, drive a car, drink caffeine, etc. It is a slippery slope but usually people don't care until it hits home. When they come after something you do(and don't tell me you are completely polution free and health conscience) then maybe you will get it.

I am not advocating making people sit in enclosed areas with smoke they don't want to brethe. In situations where your pantronage is optional however it should be left to the business owner. Again, this huge market of non-smokers could be tapped for profit, no? If everyone went to non-smoking bars then the smoking ones would close on their own, that is a free market. We could ban until our hearts content and people will still die.

 

I think tobacco is the big bugaboo, because the tobacco industry at one time made the US what it is, and somewhere down the line someone turned on them. Someone with huge influence.

Now people don't even want you to smoke on your own time or in your own home...they say they don't like the smell. Do these people not use barbques, or fireplaces? It's become the in enemy of the public. And the fears have become unreasonable.

I helped a friend prepare for a yard sale. I happened to light up when a woman with yarn came up to the table. She didn't want me to bag her yarn, because I was smoking. Guess what I organized that yarn while I was smoking in an enclosed room. She never batted an eye when the other person bagged her purchases for her, but they had been contaminated according to her terms non the less, but it seems she couldn't tell. So just how far do you take your discrimination?

 

Why would you start smoking tobacco in the first place? Does it make you feel free?

 

Because i can, that's what's so great about freedoms...

 

How can they enforce a ban if no-one complies - just all get together and chain smoke somewhere about 3000 people they cant arrest you

 

i think smoking turns you into an asshole. everyone i have known a while, after they started smoking, became a dick. or at least, more of a dick than they were. especially when they had to wait half an hour to smoke, for whatever reason. it's not like smoking is so wonderful or improves anyone's life. it makes you look "cool" (stupid, conformist) and it kills you (as if you didn't know).

it's really easy to tell someone to go get another job. it's not that easy for that person to do so, and besides, it's insensitive to think that you have that kind of authority over somewhere when you are essentially a guest to them. make your own damn food and serve it to yourself if you can't stand to breath clean air for an hour out of your life. you can spend the money you saved on more cigarettes.

of course there are greater threats to our health, and we should do everything we can to stop them. but just because there are some things we can't change now, should we ignore the things we can and make ourselves die sooner?

as far as helmits go, that should be up to the parent, and if their kid falls and breaks their skull open they have no one to whine to. of course, they'll whine anyway, and wonder why a helmit law was never enforced.

you should be free to fuck yourself up as much as you want to, but you shouldn't be allowed to hurt anyone else in any way for any reason. it is addictive, but if you want to quit you should be able to get that help, and if you don't, keep it to yourself. if you're all for freedom in every sense of the word, do you think people should be allowed to shoot up heroin at applebys? or snort coke on the counters at starbucks? there is freedom, and then there is respect. unfortunately the latter is lacking so the former has to be limited.

 

There is no freedom, it's all limited, in Canada smoking in apartments is soon going to be illegal, everywhere. I have a lot of smoker friends and I'm an occasional smoker myself, what's wrong with lighting up a Cubano at Christmas time? Huh? Nothing, this is all because of those damn hippies.