Buddhist and Taoist views on being vegetarian

Hello kind-hearted friends:


Buddhism and Taoism also persuade people to become vegetarian, and they have many great reasons.

I'd like to share them with you but I don't know if I'm allowed?

 

yeah come post it in our forum

Or I might as well tell you now I suppose!

Not all buddhists are vegetarian, not by a long shot.

In the Therevadin tradition that is dominant in SE Asia (and Sri Lanka, Burma) the community support the monks of their local sangha. The monks rise early in the morning to collect food from the lay people. This is known as collecting alms. Sometimes they are given meat, and rather than refuse food that was so kindly donated to them they are obliged to eat it. They will eat whatever is given.
In the Tibetan tradition many monks and laity eat meat, this is partly because of the harsh landscape of Tibet and the difficultly in growing edible plants. Many people are surprised to find out the Dalai Lama eats meat. Even more will probably be surprised to know Buddha also ate meat. So a lot of Buddhists have no qualms about eating meat.
That said all traditions and schools within Buddhism ackowledge that a vegetarian diet is best for spiritual practice and well-being and vegetarianism is greatly respected.
Personally I am vegetarian but initially my reasons for going veggie were mainly based on health reasons before I even began practicing meditation/ trying to live by the eightfold path...It's all down to personal choice.

I imagine Taoism is much the same but my knowledge is very limited on that philosophy.

Hope this clears it up for you.

 

Thank you very much Peterness

The sutras are quite long, I have to test if I can post links first

http://www.e-sangha.com/alphone/671_16.html

 

About meat eating -- Sutra citations

From "Mahaparinirvana Sutra":


Then Bodhisattva Kasyapa said to the Buddha: "O World-Honoured One! To one who eats flesh, we should not give flesh. Why not? I see a great virtue arising out of abstention from eating flesh." The Buddha praised Kasyapa and said: "Well said, well said! You now come to know my mind well. A Bodhisattva who protects Dharma should be thus. O good man! From now on, I do not permit my sravaka disciples to eat meat. When receiving from a danapati a pristine dana [gift] of faith, think that one is eating the flesh of one's own son." Bodhisattva Kasyapa said further to the Buddha: "O World-Honoured One! Why is it that the Tathagata does not allow us to eat meat?" "O good man! ¡°One who eats meat kills the seed of great compassion."

Kasyapa said again: "Why did you first allow the bhiksus to eat three kinds of pure meat?" "O Kasyapa! These three kinds of pure meat were so instituted following the need of the occasion." Bodhisattva Kasyapa said again to the Buddha: "O World-Honoured One! In what circumstances do you not allow the ten impurities or the nine kinds of what is pure?" The Buddha said to Kasyapa: "This also is permitted by gradual steps following the need of the occasion. This is what applies in the actual segregation from eating meat."

Bodhisattva Kasyapa said further to the Buddha: "Why is it that the flesh of fish is praised and called beautiful?" "O good man! I do not say that the flesh of fish is a beautiful food. I say that sugar can, non-glutinous rice, rock candy, black rock candy, all kinds of wheat, honey, milk, cream, and oil are beautiful foods. Various kinds of clothing material can be stocked, but what can be stocked is those whose colour has faded. How could one greedily stick to [crave after] the flesh of fish?"

Kasyapa said again to the Buddha: "If the Tathagata means to prohibit the eating of meat, such things as the five kinds of flavours as milk, cream, fresh butter, clarified butter, and sarpirmanda, all kinds of clothing, silk cloth, horse-shoe shell, hide and leather, bowls of gold and silver should not be received." "O good man! Do not muddle things up with what the Nirgranthas [Jains] say. Each of the prohibitions which the Tathagata lays down has a different meaning. By this, three pure meats are permitted standing on different grounds and the ten kinds of meat are prohibited by different standpoints. By different standpoints, all are prohibited, until the time of one's death. O Kasyapa! ¡°I, from now on, tell my disciples to refrain from eating any kind of meat¡±. O Kasyapa! When one eats meat, this gives out the smell of meat while one is walking, standing, sitting or reclining. People smell this and become fearful. This is as when one comes near a lion. One sees and smells the lion, and fear arises.

O good man! When one eats garlic, the dirty smell is unbearable. Other people notice it. They smell the bad smell. They leave that person and go away. Even from far off, people hate to see such a person. They will not come near him. It is the same with one who eats meat. It is a similar situation with all people who, on smelling the meat, become afraid and entertain the thought of death. All living things in the water, on land and in the sky desert such a person and run away. They say that this person is their enemy. Hence the Bodhisattva does not eat meat. In order to save beings, he shows [pretends] that he eats meat. Though he [seems to] eat meat, in actual fact he does not. O good man! Such a Bodhisattva does not even take pure food. How could he eat meat?

One hundred years after my death, all the holy sages of the four fruitions [the four stages leading to "arhatship"] will enter Nirvana. The age of Wonderful Dharma will be over, and there will appear the age of Counterfeit Dharma, when the bhiksu will keep the precepts [only] as a matter of form, will recite [only] a little of the sutras, will greedily take food and drink and [excessively] nourish his body. What he wears on his body will be ugly and coarse. He will look wearied and show no dignity. He will feed [farm] cows and sheep and carry fuel and grass. His beard, nails and hair will be long. He will don the kasaya [priestly robe] but look like a hunter. He will narrow his eyes, walk slowly and look like a cat who is after a rat. He will always mutter: "I have attained arhatship". He will suffer from all kinds of diseases, lie and sleep on dung. Outwardly he will look wise, but inside he will be greedy and jealous. He practises mute like a Brahmin. Truth to tell, he is no shramana [monk], but only tries to appear as such. He is burning with perverted views, ever slandering Wonderful Dharma. One such as this transgresses against the precepts, right action and deportment instituted by the Tathagata. He talks about the fruit of emancipation, but his actions depart from what is pure and he violates Dharma, which is profound and hidden. Each such person, following his own interpretation, will speak contrary to what the sutras and vinaya rules state, saying: "The Tathagata allows all of us meat". They will talk thus and say that the Buddha has so spoken. They will dispute and say that they are shramanas and successors to the Buddha's teaching. O good man! At that time, again, there will be shramanas who store cereals, receive fish and meat, prepare meals themselves, and keep oil pots. They will be around bejewelled parasols, leather footgear, kings, ministers and rich people. They will indulge in astrological practices and medical treatments; they will keep servants, gold, silver, beryl, musaragalva, agate, crystal, coral, amber, jade, horse-shoe shell, and many kinds of melons [seeds]. They will learn all arts, painting, plastering, book-making, and all kinds of science, all kinds of seed- sowing and planting of roots, placing of curses, charming, preparation of medicines, theatrical art, music, adorning of their body with fragrances and flowers, gambling, "go" game, and various kinds of handiwork. If any bhiksu rejects such evils, one can say that he is truly my disciple."

Then Kasyapa said further to the Buddha: "O World-Honoured One! The bhiksus, bhiksunis, upasakas and upasikas may have to live depending on people. At the time of the alms-round, one may be given food containing meat. How can one take it and yet be pure?" The Buddha said: "Use water, wash away the meat, and then eat it [the rest of the food]. The utensil may be defiled by meat. But if no taste of meat remains, this may be used. There will be no harm done. If one sees that there is a lot of meat, one should not accept such a meal. One must never eat the meat itself. One who eats it infringes the rule. I now set this rule of segregating one's self from eating meat. If we go into detail, there will be no end of explanations. It is now time that I enter Nirvana. So I must dispense with explanations. This is "answering well what is enquired about."

 

"Lankavatara Sutra -- Chapter 16: Do not eat meat" says:

"Mahamati, if no one eats meat, then no one kills living beings for food. Because there are people who wish to eat meat, if they have no meat to eat they will go everywhere to buy meat, then the others who wish to earn money will kill living beings and sell the flesh to the meat eaters. The killings are for the buyers, thus the buying is the same as the killing. Therefore, meat eating can obstruct the holy Way."
......
"Mahamati, I see that in the world, all meats are gotten from the bodies of living beings. If people do not kill, do not ask others to kill, and nobody kill for earning, then where are the meats come from? If there are meats that are not gotten from the bodies of living beings and are indeed delicious foods, how come I do not allow eating them? But there is no such meat all over the world, thus I say that meat eating is a sin, which destroys the seed of Tathagata. Therefore, I do not allow eating meat."
......
"And some people will say: 'In other sutras, the Tathagata has allowed eating of three kinds of meat', they simply do not understand that the meaning of precepts is to stop meat eating gradually, so they will say that meat eating is allowed."
......
"If someone say: 'The reason that the precepts mention three kinds of meat is to forbid meat eating, not to allow', we should know that he keeps precepts firmly, and does not slander me. Mahamati, now in this Lankavatara Sutra I say, at all times, all kinds of meats are inedible, unexceptionally. Mahamati, I forbid meat eating not only for one time, I mean that both in present and future, meat eating is forbidden."
......
The conditions that mentioned above: did not see the killing, did not hear the killing, and do not suspect that they were killed,
have already excluded all kinds of meat,
but those with mistaken thoughts do not understand that,
so they still think that some meat are edible.

 

"Shurangama Sutra" says:

You should know that, even if these meat-eaters may enter the heart-open state similar to Samadhi, they are all great Rakshas. When their retribution ends, they are bound to sink into the bitter sea of birth and death. They are not disciples of the Buddha. Such people as these kill and eat one another in a never-ending cycle. How can such people transcend the Triple Realm? "
......
What I have said here is the Buddhas' teaching. Any explanation counter to it is the teaching of Papiyan(demon king)."
......
Ananda, if the debt involves money, material goods, or manual labor, then once it is paid, the debt is resolved. But if in the process of repayment the lives of other beings were taken or their flesh eaten, then it will start a cycle of mutual devouring and slaughtering that will send the debtors and creditors up and down endlessly for as many eons as there are atoms of universe. There is no way to put a stop to it, except through Shamatha or through a Buddha's coming to the world."

 

The Scripture of Forty-nine Chapters, by Ultra Supreme Emptiness Emperor, the Heavenly Lord

Chapter 2: Keep the precept of being vegetarian

The Heavenly Lord said:

The precept of being vegetarian is the fundamental of Tao, and is a bridge of truth, which across the ocean of births and death, between the ferry and the other shore of liberation.

If you wish to learn Tao, you should be a vegetarian and keep the precepts, and your every single thought should be righteous and Real, then the evils and delusions will vanish of themselves.

Most living beings had abandoned the pure realm and are indulging in meat-eating, this defiles both their bodies and minds. They are like the hungry ghosts who eat dead bodies but cannot extinguish the fire that are burning their hungry intestines so that they can never eat their fill; they are also like the flies and worms who scramble for putrid and stinky things and stay still on them as if those are sandalwood.

In a meat eater's body, the three palaces are turbid, and the six viscera are defiled, the dark souls (PUG) of the dead bodies (that he ate) are exciting and thriving, and are always willing to guide him to the place of death.

Therefore, you should cut off the root of desires, enter into the pure and tranquil state, do not put any living being into suffering, do not commit anything evil, do not produce any delusions, and do not arouse any evil from your heart.

You should regard the precepts as the laws of the world, when you want to violate any of them, you should be aware of the punishment with fear. You should uphold the teachings of precepts sincerely and respectfully, keep the precepts solemnly as if they are in front of you, and as if you are facing something that you fear. You should keep your heart righteous and solemn, eliminate all thoughts, and listen attentively to the non-dual, then you will be able to experience the Correct Truth, and become my disciple.

 

Yeah , all those suttas are favoured the Mahayanan (North schools) tradition and they are much more pro-vegetarian. As stated above one of the Boddhisattva vows is to commit to vegetarianism and the above suttas are quite clear on this. The Buddha is giving solid reasons against eating meat that can't really be interpreted in any other way. It's undeniable.

However buddhist's who study and practice in the Therevadin (south school) tradition study different texts to the Mahayanan's. Indeed this is what seperates the two schools. Therevadins study the Pali Canon. They claim this is the original teaching of the Buddha and so has more value than those added many years later by the Mahayanan schools. So nothing the Therevadin texts say anything about favouring vegetarianism or meat-eating. In the Pali texts you'll find many occasions where Buddha ate meat.
The Thereavdins also argue that even by only eating vegetables millions of insects and other living beings are being killed in the harvest and transport of vegetarian food. But as this killing is by 'proxy' it doesn't break the first precept of refraining from killing other living beings. So the same must go for the eating of meat, as long as the animal wasn't killed especially for the individual then it's okay because it was already killed but not specially for the individual. So there was no intention on there part to crave the flesh of the animal and thus kill the animal to eat.

 

hey alphone! i saw you on VeggieBoards.

as i said over there, very interesting stuff.