Is Circumcision an Infringement of Male Rights ?

This is disturbing.
I was reading up on the biography of Kellogg (the Puritanical Health Guru) and although he was fantastic on so many things - he had a very peculiar sexual 'fetish' or belief that sexual ejaculation or intercourse was unhealthy.
No offense to my American friends but this is honestly a very peculiar concept I find about the USA.
The idea that sex is 'dirty' or 'naughty' or 'forbidden' etc.
Anywayssssss....
The whole thing went something like this: On occasion, one of the boys would get caught masterbating (wow surprise).
Sometimes they would get caught more than once.
Now since masterbating was morally unhygenic (note that term because its major in explaining why Americans do this even today) it was determined that a 'Cure' for this morally unsanitary practice must be found.
Now, since each and every parent would insist there was simply no way their boys were 'dirty little boys' it simply MUST be something else 'causing them' to do this.
Aha!
It was noticed that the same time the boys were growing in pubic hairs - this was about when the dirty masterbating began!
Small hairs must be getting caught under the foreskin (of a flaccid penis) and this was itching and bothering the boys - who naturally would rub their penis for relief.

GREAT! Oh boy.. whew!
What a relief to know that their sons were actually victims and not 'dirty little boys' after all!
Kellogg then would 'cure' the problem by having the boys foreskin amputated (circumcision is just a term describing how its amputated btw)

Now hang on because here is the 'good part':
It WORKED!
Yep.. the theory was now a proven fact of science and you know why?
After that - the boys were NEVER CAUGHT MASTERBATING EVER AGAIN!
They were now 'cured' and 'Morally Hygenic'.
Eventually it was a social status to do this - after all, everybody knows those 'uncut' boys were dirty little masterbators.. or at least you would NOT want anyone else thinking that would you!

The real popular wave was a health scare .. what amounted to nothing short of a hoax in New York.
Personally, if you ask me (and many others) I have no doubt that because almost all the original Doctors promoting this were circumcised and probably felt 'different' and what not - they were more than happy to get revenge on all those locker-room teasing by turning the tables.
"Now WE are the majority and intact men will be the minority!"
That I imagine is how it went in the 40's.

Anyways.. the Kellogg thing was just damm creepy as hell to me .. and otherwise I actually admire the man in so many other ways!
Anyways.. the males foreskin is to PROTECT the nearly transparent and highly sensitive sex gland at the top of the penis.
Especially to protect it from disease and foreign particles.
Not really much different than the Labia on a female in principle.
The ONLY reason you hear words like 'hygenic' in the USA is because there is a sort of left-over social memory about 'Moral Hygeine'.

I dont know .. almost every other nation on the planet disallows or officially rejects the practice except the USA?
Im not counting, obviously Middle-Eastern or 'Semetic' countries, 'Muslim' countries etc where obviously they do it for their own religious traditions.
Even then.. the original biblical version didnt do this modern extremely radical USA version.
btw.. Southern Canadians copied that too (around my age group was the worst) so its not just the USA.

 

I completely believe that circumcision is a human rights violation. How anyone can argue that actually chopping off a part of another human being's body is just a "parenting choice" is beyond me. My son is intact, and he'll stay that way unless HE decides he'd like to start chopping off body parts.

 

Yeah, I totally agree.
I really do not have a big problem with Jews following their custom if only they are keeping it to the original practice of just the foreskin.
(Im not wanting that - but saying i can respect it).
The relatively new version of digging down the penis and peeling the skin off the gland is simply the most barbaric and downright disgusting thing I can think of.

What so mind boggling on this - just imagine taking a newborn girl into a surgeon and saying that you want her labia cut off.
The cops would kick your door down and you go to Jail - you lose your child and the surgeon would be lucky to make it through his prison sentence without being killed by other inmates.

But for some reason its ok in the USA for the bizarre reason that American women (allegedly) have a sexual Fetish for seeing a flaccid penis with the skin cut off and the gland exposed.
(and I dont believe thats true for the new generation of women but thats what the parent will say to justify the amputation).

Personally, I am extremely proud and willing to support any Mens Rights Groups (actually Childs rights) fully and I highly commend all the people taking a stand on this.
If your one of the men who is not pissed off about it then thats awesome but Im saying for the men that are - its their total right to launch protests and look for compensation.

 

Can someone lay something to rest for me? Sorry if it's already been asked, but: is there actually any significant hygeine-based reason for circumcision, given that we live in an environment which is relatively disease-free?

 

I'm basing this on an episode of Sex In The City of all things, but I got the impression most American women manage to go through their lives without having to confront an uncircumcised dong. I know I might be being slightly hypocritical here, but how do we know this isn't a product of cultural conditioning?

Have to say, re your point about the Jewish custom, I can't really see how tradition makes it acceptable within the confines of a religion any more than does tradition within a secular, medical field, as is the case with US hospitals.

 

i believe much of the hygeine reasons are past due, assuming uncirced guys take the time to clean properly.


There is evidence though, that circed guys are less likely to attract STDS. You can do a search on thise especially in regards to Africa and AIDS.

 

That's the whole thing. uncircumsized guys have to exercise an extra step in hygiene. The first time I saw an uncircumsized dick (i was 18) I was a little grossed out cuz I was young and naive. My current Lover is my first uncurcumsized and I through being with him I have come to realize that it is an unneccasary procedure that I would never inflict on a baby. If I could go back and make the choice for my parents I would choose not to be circumsized. So I don't really think that it should be considered an infringement--that sounds too political. But I think people should be more educated about the fact that it is an unnecesary procedure. (pardon my spelling)

 

I think circumcision at birth is a good thing. I also believe that all your finger nails should be pulled out at birth, and you should get slapped in the face several times every time you cry.

 

I didnt read any of this thread other then the origional post, but it still makes me laugh, What guy in his right mind gay, strait, bisexual, whatever, 'excluding masochists, and transexuals' would consent to having their penis mutilated, personally I am glad it was done at such an early age I have no possible way of remembering it.

 

Yes, it's an abhorrent little practice...and all the 'benefits' have yet to really be proven.
Parents who disfigure their child in this way are ignorant. Pinky toes don't serve much purpose either, so why not trim them off too? Earlobes are just pesky...why not trim them while we're at it?
Silly is what it is.

If the child grows up and decides for himself that it needs to be done, then that's their choice. But it's no different then slicing off any other chunk of skin from an infant - it's assault, and given the location - it's very brutal assault.

 

Actually according to the book The Naked Ape earlobes have high concentrations of nerve endings they where evolved in the human body as an extra place for sexual stimulation. And actually we should be chopping off peoples pinky toes, everyone line up!

 

Ah no not when it has to be done. Like me when I was in grade one I had to be circumcisized I'm not quite sure on why as that was a long time ago but everyone just said it was because the skin (of fore variety) grew wrong.

 

Well, I think it should be mandatory.

 

Bartenddersrum, why do you think it should be mandatory that every male have his genitals mutilated?

Greengodess, take your arguement and aply it to your self. If it was tradition to have your vagina cut up so that you could fit in socialy better, would you want to start cutting it up? Even worse, what if your parents made that personal desision for you? You know, your arguement could be used to defend any social custum, no matter how degrading or sick it is. I'm sure a lot of chinese girls had their feet binded so that they would fit in socialy, not get odd looks, and be more atractive to guys. It may be a little akward for the first people that stop one of these degrating customs, but isn't it worth it to society in the long run? If I sound a little defensive, its because MY PARENTS CUT OFF PART OF MY GENITALS WHEN I WAS A BABY. Think long and hard about that statement and weather or not it is a "healthy" thing that you would have wanted done to you.

 

It's very disturbing that some doctors will circumsize a baby automatically when it's born without even asking the parents.

 

I just think it's disturbing period. Parents should not mutilate thier children, and it should be a choice that an individual can make about themselves. I mean, if you like being circumcized, good for you, but to say that everyone should be circumsized at birth regardless of thier own personal feelings, then you need to seriously rethink your views on human rights.

 

It is disturbing and its also very peculiar that Americans just love it so much. (yes, i know some Canadian regions too).
Someone told me that Americans are STILL amputating boys at a rate OVER 50%.
Anyways,
Im not speaking towards Muslims and Jews here and I realise they do it but at least that has a religious thing there.
Americans are supposedly Gentiles.
Whats the deal there?

 

I love my foreskin! My friends call me "the anteater"
I have 3 extra inches of foreskin

Freakish

I know!

 

Ok...Ive put off posting on this thread...I had to have both my sons cut when they were babies....their foreskins were too tight to move to be able to clean them properly...and the doctor advised that this could lead to infections....I dont think I violated their rights.

 

erzebet1961, since their was a medical reason you did the right thing.