There is a group of people in the liberal culture that bothers me, and these people are the bizzaro world versions of the religious right, that I shall call the ultra-left. These are the people who are the first to argue against good judgement in the name of civil liberties, or will step up to battle 'thought-crime." I feel its time for someone to denounce and protest these folks. I've seen on this forum people argue about how an artist's rendering of a nude minor is ok because if we disallow such "art" then we might as well be burning books. I've also heard arguements about just because someone has an interest in some vice, i.e. -murder, rape, child porn, clandestine chemestry, that they shouldn't be treated any differently until they commit a crime. Well, If you are thinking about killing someone, thinking about making bombs, meth, or having sex with children, too bad you sorry scumbag, you deserve to be singled out and dealt with. Thats not thought crime, thats stopping a bad situation before it starts. I've found people who have these views tend to be liberal just for liberitarianism's sake. Now, I hold some views that are far, far left of normal, such as I don't believe in formal government or law enforcement, I don't believe in capitalism, and I don't believe in the use of money.(all of which makes my life pretty difficult)But these ultra-liberals don't seem to understand that while everyone should be treated fairly,what is fair should always be considered relative. And also that even though exercising one's freedom of art, literature, and speech etc. is good and should be protected there are some things that go too far. I shall leave you tonight(3:50AM as I write,don't bust my balls for my tired mistakes) with a few bits I feel are important to relate: 1.please don't get on here and try to flame me 2.I don't disapprove of all clandestine chemistry, I like drugs and homemade fireworks as much as the next guy. 3.Question everything and don't trust people who frown and shout when they talk about their beliefs 4.Our government attacks its own people so don't trust them either. 5.Rinse and repeat Peace and thanks for reading, Day
I'm not trying to flame you or anything but I totally disagree without the idea of thought crime. I don't see what thinking about something has to do with actually doing it. Many people such that are artists, writers, painters,etc. think about horrible things, in the context of artistic creation. Say, I was writing a story or novel or movie about a pedophile or serial killer or something similar, of course I would need to think about all the possible scenerios of what that kind of character would do. The ability to think about such things is essenetial. Without it there would be no art or even popular pulp novels, or movies, etc.
How are you going to try to stop them before it starts if you don't even have a law enforcement agency??? Or even catch them after they commit the crime?
I think you must have drunk too much last night Shugga, when the world condones locking people up for what they think...that's a world I don't want to be a part of, and one which all of us should beware. Ever read 1984, by Orwell?
Nothing in life is ever guarranteed. You can buy insurance, but you better read the policy carefully, they don't always pay off. You can't legislate a world that is going to be without risk, without limiting life to a point that makes it meaningless. Is that how you really want to live?
I didn't know these were leftest ideas. Anyways I am pretty close to center, in my own mind anyway. Just think how "difficult" your life would be if these things didn't exist. Do you think life would be easier? You would have to work your ass off just to produce something you could maybe trade for other goods taking up much of your time but you wouldn't have time because you would constantly be trying to fight off others trying to steal whatever you have acquired. Its not perfect but I like Government, Law Enforcement, Capitialism and Money. They are a basis to start a fair system. Not one that everyone makes out in but a lot more people then if we had to fend for ourselves for everything.
dd3stp233: I'm not saying that thinking about such things in an artistic way to write a book etc. is wrong, I'm saying that if you contemplate such things and your motive is to carry it out, that is wrong. Also lets say I were to paint a minor in a sexually explict manner,that is wrong, and people shouldn't support or protect such "art" Also not all nude pictures are sexual, for instance, paintings of cherubs, but a painting of a 12 year old girl, spread eagle on a bear skin rug isn't art, its pornography. Moncul: Without law enforcement, justice is a burden of the people, lets say someone commits a crime, the victim and/or the victims family or friends would then inflict their justice apon the person who committed the crime. (I think this is a better way then what is established, and lets not forget that the knowledge of how to conduct an investigation of crime isn't lost with the dissolution of law enforcement.) This view of mine reflects my wish to return to a more tribal, simple way of life. Oh, and how would one stop someone before it starts without law enforcment? Easy, be any means necessary. Gardener: I'm not condoning locking people up for what they think, but If someone forms a plan and is intent on following through with this plan, something should be done to stop them. If a pedophile wanted to rape your daughter would you wait until he did it or would stop him before he had the chance? And for your second post, I'm not sure what insurance has to do with it. ??? Oh yea, I have read 1984, open your eyes, we are living it now. Haid: Ever heard of Anarchy, or Communism (leftist ideas)? Life would be easier without those things, and that isn't the basis of a fair system. Go read anything having to do with pre-contact native people. Also you would have a lot more time and freedom with this lifestyle. Maybe you've never worked a full time job but that leaves you with about 6 hours a day for friends, family, and hobbies, where as a more back to the land style of living would allow you to spend all of your time with family. Also our current style of living makes one totally dependant on others. Say you lose your job because the capitalist employer is losing money and needs to lay off workers to match reduced demand for their product, now you don't have any money coming in, and no skills to provide yourself and your family with food shelter or clothing (skills like hunting and gathering,leather tanning, shelter constuction....),you try to get assistance from government programs,(oh yea, within 20 years those programs won't exhist if the current trend of government spending stays like it is.), so now you are living in your car with your wife and kids, here comes law enforcement, you can't have your kids living in a car, so they get taken away, you can't make your car payment so there goes your car, and you can't live on the street because vagrancy is illegal....so you get locked up and your wife gets to move back in with her folks....sounds great. I think thats about it so keep posting and stay on topic, Peace, Day
Oh, I would like to state that I'm not trying to be an asshole, and if I came off like that my apologies. Also I don't want people to think I'm tarzan living in the jungle wearing furs, but I have lived in the wild, living on the land and taking care of myself with my own hands and wit, and I long to return, and thats part of the reason why I hold the views that I do.
I am far from an ultra liberal and I think what you said is ridiculous. You are one of these people who believes the government's role is to look out for you and protect you, which is a joke. If anyone is an ultra liberal, it is you, as you seem to be in favor of a big invasive government that has its nose in everyone's business. Wake up and smell the coffee.
Ok, Anarchy is not a leftest idea. The left still believe in Government and in my opinion Anarchy is a farse anyway. It could never stand due to the fact more organized groups would dominate the un-organized and governments would re-form. Communism: Yea, there is no government or law enforcement there. What Communist is against government? It is all about Government control. I do have a full time job but you have obviously never lived off the land. It is much less work to get up and go to work then it is to take care of animals, farm, secure yourself and possesions and try to trade for goods you can't produce. Ask people who have lived in communes, it is not a easy life. You could say more rewarding but not easier or less time consuming? You are always dependent on others. You can not possibly produce everything that you need on your own. You get another job. There is not just one job out there. I have never went without a job when I was motivated to get and hold one. You gain skills that are usefull to other companies including education and the jobs are there. If they all dry up you would have to be self suffeicent and thus in your utopia. Do you believe people should be able to do whatever they want to their kids? Should you be able to molest them to? Are you thankful for the safety of a child when you hear about an abuser being arrested? So you got your family scatching a living from the land. Fighting other families for limited resources. You are out hunting down some food and fall in a river and drown. Now your family has no food and no protection. So your women and children are drug off and raped and murdered. There is no one left to enact your "revenge" but justice doesn't matter because you are not around and no one cares. ......Sounds Great......
Arresting a person before an act has been committed, is just wrong. A parent's role is to protect those they are responsible for. If parents don't relinquish that role and allow their children to be placed in a position of risk in the first place, then trying to prevent actions by prohibiting thought is unnecessary.
