You wanted a new thread. You gotta new thread. I'm going to spill my guts out here. When I arrived on this board I was expecting this board to be overrun with threads discussing the issues of the day. That doesn't seem to exist.One thing I've noticed on this board is the overall tone of this board is more on the peace and love aspects of the 60's movement. That is not what sparked the movement. Peace and love was more a goal of what we wanted to get to. The movement was driven by the outrage and anger towards racism, an immoral war, and an immoral society. The war ended, civil rights legislation came about; the movement died. But war hasn't ended, racism still exists, and the right-wing is dominating the national conversation. Hippies can't exist separate of the issues of the day. You CANNOT not care. If you want to create your own little separate world of peace and love and ignore the terrible things going on in the world, you just become a caricature of yourselves. It's the darkness that drives the light. It's the darkness that drives the passion of the movement. The light cannot exist without the dark. The movement had nothing to do with being passive. Alan Ginsberg's seminal work was 'Howl' not 'Squeak'. The movement was about being angry and screaming against the injustices of the world. It was about grabbing the man by the throat and demanding that he listen. All I see here for the most part are people with only a cursory understanding of what the issues of the day are. I see too much of: "I don't have to go to war, why should I care what they do?". Those are your brothers and sisters dying there whether you want to admit it or not. You are and always will be connected to what goes on outside of you. Don't try to quiet the angry voices that exist here. They are showing the passion that can drive the movement. Where is the face of this generation? Who are your leaders and intellectuals? Where are your Abbie Hoffmans, your Tom Haydens, your Ken Keseys, your Bobby Seales, your Angela Davises? The movement cannot exist in a void. The movement wasn't just about the peace symbol, it went much deeper than that. The clenched fist was as much a symbol of the times as the peace symbol was. Arm yourself with knowledge. Take it to the streets. Take rage, anger, and moral outrage and DO SOMETHING WITH IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Goddamnit, be passionate about something. Your time is now. Soon it will be over. Stop playing at being a hippy and actually BE a hippy. Rant over.
i agree, the movement is all about passion. afterall it is all about change and growth. to reply to your question about where our abbie hoffman is, public broadcasting has made it difficult to make many hip revolutionaries well know (big surprize), but do not forget about the power you hold in the impact with others. while we may not be able to impact many people national or worldwide we can make such a significant impact socially and individually. it is here where you can really let your spirit shine. in the realm of what effect you have on your friends, loved ones, strangers, and family, there is far less restriction then there would be in a political atmosphere. it is by having a significant personal impact that we can make a change. by having a lasting impact with people we can hope that in their growth and life that they spread the same qualities which we hope to pass on. i hope youve resonated with anything that i just said. while this is just my opinion, and everyone is entitled to their own, i hope that we can both learn and growth from our interaction. much love and strength to you.
My thoughts exactly, i'm getting sick of being called a fucking radical, being told "that's not hippy"........you know what, i'm not a goddamn hippie, i'm a pissed off human-be-in, a pranksta, and I support doing whatever it takes!! The peace and love era was cute but its done, passive civil disobedience (arguing back and forth via internet) accomplishes NOTHING, Get the FUCK out there and revolt, tear the fucking machine down to the ground!!! We as the people have the POWER to change the current of the world, We as the people have more CONTROL than them by sheer numbers, the world government provides media control, acceptance of apathy, and plenty of pointless distractions to prevent real thought. I'm fucking sick of it, i'm sick of paying ILLEGAL taxes to the IRS, i'm sick of the fucking Federal Reserve, I'm sick of preemptive WARS for the purpose of world conquest and corporate profit, i'm sick of being left at the bottom, we live in a society where 90% of the wealth is held by 10% of the population, WHY THE FUCK AREN'T PEOPLE OUTRAGED??? WHERE IS THE HUMAN SPIRIT?? HAVE PEOPLE REALLY BECOME SO INDOCTRINATED THAT THEY NO LONGER CARE?? In 2008 everyone in america will have to carry around an ID card with a microchip in it that can track any persons whereabouts, we are at a turning point in world history..........I just hope that this is a valley and not a plateau..........either way we're coming close to the edge. Government was originally intended to bring people together, to help everyone in a common goal, all that we have accomplished in the last 300 years is dividing our people, desimating the economies of other countries (the ENTIRE 3rd world is a result of western business practices!), launching preemptive war, installing puppet democracies in weak nations with resources (ie: Iraq <oil>, Afghanistan <Dick Cheney and Halliburton want to build an oil pipeline through here but the Taliban opposed it, solution, get rid of the Taliban>, PERU, Bolivia, Columbia <due to inflation caused by american corporations these formerly wealthy countries have become 3rd world dictatorships dependent on the growth and trade of Cocaine, largly run by the united states CIA or Cocaine Importers Association. Bottom line we as a world society need to act NOW before its too late................thiers a steep cliff at the end of this road and everybodies driving towards it full force while the powers that be hover in the air awaiting our demise.
No forums existed back in the day to preach our cause. By uniting and forcefully stating our righteous cause we forced our way onto the public stage. It was a movement, to have a movement you actually must MOVE. Nothing wrong with wanting to change your own little piece of the world and being satisfied with that. One finger standing alone. Very little strength and can make a tiny bit of difference. Five fingers clenched together into a fist. Much more strength and much more of a difference. It's fine if the movement wants to content itself making those small little differences on a personal level. But the movement will forever be considered a fringe movement composed of pollyannish kooks and nuts. Our movement tried to make a difference on a much larger scale. True, in the end we failed, but you will forever live small if you don't dream big. Peace little brother.
No my friend, you do have the heart of a hippy. A hippy at heart is a revolutionary. It's flip sides of the same coin. On the one side we strive for a world of peace and justice, but on the other side we deal with the CURRENT realities of the world and fight kicking and screaming. There is no change without turmoil. Keep the faith brother.
dude...back in the day a few folks would set around together...burn a few and then get a wild idea. Nobody there to talk us (them) out of it, or atleast nobody there that wasn't just as fucked up as the rest were. So intellegence being the second choice when stoned...shit happened. Now folks set around the computer...not smoking a few and not side by side with their lackeys and calmly and soberly talk each other out of shit. Your right...it sucks. had more fun back then.
man, if you can say that in front of a bunch of people, you should consider being a senator or something and try to change shit. cause if youve got public speaking skills you could get alot of people on your side. but yea, you have a god point. no one wants to do it themselves and they expect other people to do everything. and ya know what? ill be right there trying to start a movement with ya...once i get out of high school and am on my own, so as of now, there isnt much i can do sadly
that is why we have the internet, to spread ideas to people all over the world. what took years to do and organize back then is so much simpler and faster now.
Sadly, that's exactly right... it ain't gonna happen - not from people on these boards anyway. Darkside, many before you have tried to stir up some passion but it invariably fails to materialise into anything substantial. People have tried just about everything. But the fact that so many before you have tried, and so many people that haven't tried are bleating about being fed up, suggests a lot of people could do more - but there are just no definite plans around the place to get us all into action. We need specific plans, and people who are prepared to step up to the plate and get out there instead of "yeah I'm in!"'s, knowing very well it will all fall into a heap in about 10 posts' time.
Oh, I totally agree with the idea that something needs to get started. Call me old-fashioned, but I am with Thoreau, Gandhi, and Martin Luther King Jr. All of these men made a significant impact in their lifetime through these beliefs. Gandhi help free India, King helped gain civil rights for backs. You don't need a civics lesson, I am sure you know all of this. My point is, if people start a peaceful movement, some change will be made in the world. Violence is not the answer to this issue, we would be no better than the people who start the war. But the more voices that speak up against the government, the more people LEARN about the constitution and use it, more change will be made. But the problem with this sort of action is it tends to look like inaction. I agree with you, something needs to be done. That's why I go out and do stuff about it. I protest Bush, I engage in discussions concerning the war, I let people know how I feel regarding the whole matter. Where I am located right now, however, hinders any further forms of action. Trust me, once I get back to Boston, I will pick up the pace again.
You know that Hunter Thompson had it right when he ran the "Freak Party" in Colorado. Listen, you know the Republicans aren't going to do shit for you but what REALLY depresses me is the number of otherwise "smart" folks who think the Democrats are going to do something for them. They are ALL politicians and they are in it for themselves. They say what they think you want to here but don't do shit. A few questions from all the years the democrats were in charge (I don't expect anything when the Republicans have us by the balls mind you) 1) Did they legalize pot or did they instead pass laws to put more otherwise innocent folks behind bars ? 2) Did the stop wars or genocide (Ruwanda anyone or how about Yugoslovia). 3) Did they repeal any opressive social laws that were passed in years otherwise controled by Republicans. The deal is folks...if we don't find our own people and defeat the "two party system" of entrenched political machines then we are fucked!!!!!!!!
I agree. They are able to find themseves to do some good every once in a while. But it's time for another party to come up. The green party is a good one (I have to promote, I'm a part of it ), though it's human. It has flaws. The problem is, once that party comes into power, it will have a few good years, and then become just like the other two. Cooporate America will get it's hold of it.
most people here arent even hippies....i dont even know why they come here not that i care whether they do or not.....
Activism will come with knowledge. You can’t attack those who will take this country to ruin with platitudes. My main problem is that I see either apathy or just a superficial knowledge of the issues of the day. To fight the evil that exists, you must know the evil first. “If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle" - Sun Tzu The activism doesn’t have to start here. But at least a public discourse can take place here to arm yourself here, to gain knowledge to make you an effective member of an activist cause. The conditions are ripe for a truly meaningful peace movement to arise again. “Carpe diem, quam minimum credulo postero” - Horace, Roman Poet “Seize the day, put no trust in the future” I included this post in a thread that got locked. I will include again for anyone interested because it is at least a START in gaining knowledge of what this administration is all about. If nothing else, at least TRY to learn what the issues of the day are about: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- I have seen a lot of misinformation on the board concerning the War in Iraq. The War in Iraq was not a war of necessity, prewar Iraq did not have ties to terrorism, and a Saddam-led Iraq never posed an imminent threat to this country, and the Iraqi War had absolutely nothing to do with 9/11. The origins of the war occurred in 1992 with a policy paper called “ Defense Policy Guidance “ developed by the Undersecretary of Defense for Policy, Paul Wolfowitz. A number of conservatives signed onto the policy including Dick Cheney and Donald Rumsfeld. This policy is the basis of the current policy. Certain parts have been modified, but the great majority of it remains. Key Points/Excerpts: · The number one objective of U.S. post-Cold War political and military strategy should be preventing the emergence of a rival superpower. "Our first objective is to prevent the re-emergence of a new rival. This is a dominant consideration underlying the new regional defense strategy and requires that we endeavor to prevent any hostile power from dominating a region whose resources would, under consolidated control, be sufficient to generate global power. These regions include Western Europe, East Asia, the territory of the former Soviet Union, and Southwest Asia." "There are three additional aspects to this objective: First the U.S must show the leadership necessary to establish and protect a new order that holds the promise of convincing potential competitors that they need not aspire to a greater role or pursue a more aggressive posture to protect their legitimate interests. Second, in the non-defense areas, we must account sufficiently for the interests of the advanced industrial nations to discourage them from challenging our leadership or seeking to overturn the established political and economic order. Finally, we must maintain the mechanisms for deterring potential competitors from even aspiring to a larger regional or global role." · Another major U.S. objective should be to safeguard U.S. interests and promote American values. According to the draft document, the U.S. should aim "to address sources of regional conflict and instability in such a way as to promote increasing respect for international law, limit international violence, and encourage the spread of democratic government and open economic systems.” The draft outlines several scenarios in which U.S. interests could be threatened by regional conflict: "access to vital raw materials, primarily Persian Gulf oil; proliferation of weapons of mass destruction and ballistic missles, threats to U.S. citizens from terrorism or regional or local conflict, and threats to U.S. society from narcotics trafficking." The draft relies on seven scenarios in potential trouble spots to make its argument – with the primary case studies being Iraq and North Korea. · If necessary, the United States must be prepared to take unilateral action. There is no mention in the draft document of taking collective action through the United Nations. The document states that coalitions "hold considerable promise for promoting collective action," but it also states the U.S. "should expect future coalitions to be ad hoc assemblies" formed to deal with a particular crisis and which may not outlive the resolution of the crisis. The document states that what is most important is "the sense that the world order is ultimately backed by the U.S." and that "the United States should be postured to act independently when collective action cannot be orchestrated" or in a crisis that calls for quick response. The main emphasis of the policy was to maintain the United States as the unchallenged superpower existing in the world. It calls for coalitions, but only ones where the US calls the shots and only existing until the ends is achieved. Currently the UN provides the mandates to be achieved for the aggregation of countries in opposition to world-wide threats. The current attempt to undermine the legitimacy of the UN is part of this policy. We do not want an organization to get in the way of our ability to unilaterally enforce our will in any situation. Preemption is an element of this policy. A willingness to strike at nations that we PERCEIVE to be a threat, before the threat actually exists. It is proven that intelligence isn’t always reliable and can lead to attacks that aren’t warranted. This is creating instability in the world because other nations now look at us as a nation willing to attack without provocation. This never existed before as an official policy of this country. We have previously acted preemptively using the Gulf of Tonkin incident (Vietnam War) and the sinking of the Maine incident (Spanish-American War). These were based on either mistaken or concocted intelligence to justify those involvements, but it was never a stated policy. These were invented incidents to inflame the public into a pro-war mood. From a cited reference: “This country once rejected “unwarned” attacks such as Pearl Harbor as barbarous and unworthy of a civilized nation. Today many cheer the prospect of conducting sneak attacks—potentially with nuclear weapons—on piddling powers run by tin-pot despots.” Rumsfeld's version adds a few new ideas, most impressively the concept of preemptive strikes with nuclear weapons targets,” such as command-and-control bunkers, missile silos, and heavily fortified underground facilities. These would be earth-penetrating nuclear weapons used for attacking “hardened and deeply buried used to build and store weapons of mass destruction. The concept emerged earlier this year when the administration's Nuclear Posture Review leaked out. At the time, arms-control experts warned that adopting the NPR's recommendations would undercut existing arms-control treaties, do serious harm to nonproliferation efforts, set off new rounds of testing, and dramatically increase the prospects of nuclear weapons being used in combat. Using bunker-busting nuclear weapons is currently being floated as an idea in conjunction with Iran. Despite these concerns, the administration appears intent on developing the weapons. In a final flourish, the DPG also directs the military to develop cyber-, laser-, and electronic-warfare capabilities to ensure U.S. dominion over the heavens. The leaking of this policy led to its condemnation by the George H. Bush administration and rejection by the Clinton administration as being a far too radical of a policy. Many of the main advocates of this policy became part of George W. Bush’s administration. The policy was relatively dormant until 9/11 and was seized on by the originators of this policy as an excuse to implement it. Intelligence shortly led to the fact that Al Qaeda and Osama Bin Laden were responsible for the attack and the primary bases of operation and Osama himself were located in Afghanistan. Proponents of the policy were calling for the invasion of Iraq before Afghanistan even though they knew Iraq did not contain the Al Qaeda threat because Afghanistan did not contain the elements they needed to further their stated policy! Anyone interested in the origin and progression of the policy can read the following articles: http://www.harpers.org/DickCheneysSongOfAmerica.html http://www.carnegieendowment.org/publications/index.cfm?fa=view&id=1214&prog=zgp&proj=znpp Following is the view of a primary intelligence agent working directly with intelligence concerning Iraq and a second article concerning intelligence: http://www.foreignaffairs.org/20060301faessay85202/paul-r-pillar/intelligence-policy-and-the-war-in-iraq.html http://www.realcities.com/mld/krwashington/news/special_packages/iraq/intelligence/12995512.htm How they were twisting events to fit the preconceived notion of going to war ileaked in behind the scenes memos: http://www.downingstreetmemo.com/index.html This program run on PBS’s program Frontline called “The War Behind Closed Doors” is the program that got me pointed in the right direction on reasons for the war: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/iraq/ --------------------------------------------------------------------------- I apologize for the length of this post, but I have strong feelings on this issue, and believe the loss of innocent American and Iraqis lives justifies the length to point out the true nature of the administration.
why is it that people who beleive they are capable of carrying on a eductated converstation somehow cant carry on one without qouting someone elses 500 word post? maybee some here would comment more if they didnt have to scroll thrus big purple blahhs of shit they already read before they commented?? love n light
.....During the 60's, the first hippies were colege people, the movement started as an intelectual thing.....they created their own references, their own standards.......there was nothing or no one "hippie" before them...they had to be revolutionaries...there was no hippie pathway already made they just had to follow...they didn't have to look back....and if today the new young hippies look back so much, well, that's just a proof of the importance of the "hippy thing", and a tribute to those who made it happen.....but in the present time, the "revolutionary state of mind" is often left behind...
....could be the poetry, or the painting, or the literature, but I think was the MUSIC that made the hippie philosophy spread so fast around the world.........
Hippiehillbillie - Perhaps it's because people want to make sure others know what they are replying to? Otherwise it get's confusing. Darkside - Okay. Now you have given us the information. What do you propose we do about it? Otherwise this thread is reduced to a rant about the people here (and becoming a parody of itself) not doing anything. Help us figure out what you want to see done. Perhaps some idea's can be given here, and we can start something up.
