welcome to the oil crisis

The kid was molested .

 

The italian mafia got nothing to do with gasoline prices unless you refering to the ones in the big house.

 

No I did not miss the point of the article I just completely disagree with the conclusions drawn in the article. (BTW- I did eventually read the hole thing when I had time to do so)

First off we are not running out of oil. As someone above said we are swimming in it. More than that, we are breathing it, polluting the earth with it and so on. In my opinion the faster we stop using oil the better. If we continue on our present course, oil (along with other pollutants) will destroy society as we know it.

If we stopped using fossil fuel for manufacturing etc.. there are alternatives to everything you have mentioned. The oil companies don’t want us to use those alternatives though and will do everything in there power to stop us from developing those alternatives.

Yes, you are right if we stop using oil then society as we know it will change. But it will be a change for the better IMO. There are just as much money to be made, technological advances to develop etc... from green energy as well.

 

Just to briefly summarize for anyone that has posted without bothering to read the article Dr Phibes linked:

The price of of oil is not just going to affect motor transport and all the industry dependent on it. Even if we use alternative fuel there are far more businesses that we are dependent on oil that will be hit: plastics and pharmaceuticals.

The picture is very frightening and the media are afraid (or ordered to avoid) to touch on the subject. You only need a basic klowledge in chemistry and biology to see what possibilities lie ahead when we can't afford to buy basic medicines!

 

The impression I got from the article (which was one part truth and 3 parts BS) was just one big long justification for the high gas prices.

I do agree with you that if these high gas prices continue we will see huge increases in just about everything we need including (food, clothing, shelter and medicine) That part of the piece was true.

I am currently:

1) boycotting all Exxon/Mobil and Hess gas stations. I will not purchase anything form them not even soda or lotto tickets. (I buy goods and gas only from their competitors)

2) I buy no gas on the weekend

3) I will not travel for summer vacation this year.

I will continue this until gas is down to at least $2.00 per gallon which is the fair market value for gas.

I hope others will join me!

 

Consider me with you Dalamar, on the boycott. I have not much need for my car these days, so I just walk everywhere, or sometimes take the bus if it's raining. I wish we could all be like the Chinese and ride a bike to work, but that wouldn't be practical for all people.

It's not that I hate cars. I really love them, but I love the world we live in a lot more, even if it's run by idiots.

 

Quote Dr Phibes "I dont believe it!
You said I wouldn't and I don't !
If you had said it was believable
I might have believed it and read it!"

You've removed my honest and sincere reply. What is wrong? It took me a lot of time in making it. Only because of the fact my gramar or style isn't perfect? I live in the Netherlands. Hell, in this perspective my english is pretty good!
Is this your only way for discussion?
Nothing in this world is black or white. At the moment, the story you dropped on this site is very hot in the Netherlands.
Most countries are far behind in planning to develop new infrastructure for new forms of energy.
It seems that one of the good solutions is cow farms, well, its their shit they want to transform it in methane. Well I'm sure you know a lot of alternative energy forms. In future we'll keep warm and still can put all our lights on and drive our cars and aeroplanes and ships. But true, the real problem is the fact we're a plastic civilization. Even pharmacy depends on oil.
Skip my doomscenario but at least read the link.

http://www.spacedaily.com/news/earth-04q.html

It is a story of hope for our children and grandchildren, nobody likes to see a child suffer from leukaemia. And when its your own child, you only want a cure, no matter what.
So its also ethics. It always is.
Some people are happy that we have to find a more simple way of living in future and see the romantic side of it but also enjoy live today and are worried about the negative side effects, all in one mindmixture.

To be honest, no matter what future will show us, life will change in a very fast way. Deep down inside ourselves we all feel we walk right into worldwar 3. Right?
But hey: That's the world we are living in!

 

There are only 40 years of oil left on Earth. How did people live for 5 million years without it? why can't we? Who put the bang in the bang she bang she bang?

 

First of all let me say to Human racer that I'm sorry I was so flippant in my reply to you that you pointed out. Sorry, about that, really!
I did look at the paper you mention and would like to come back to that in another post.
But Dalmar, The graphs in the report are actually suggesting what you say but coupled to the fact that production is linked to population growth and the available capacity for raising production levels. As the population grows the capacity for production must grow, and that's where we are at now

- High availability with high population growth and demand outstripping the present capacity to produce. that is what the peak oil thing is about - no room for extra capacity but growing demand. It has the same effect as if the oil were really running out. But take a look at this map and see how the oil world looks. The picture tells a whole chapter of a book - right at the bottom of the page.

 

Human racer, the page that you refer to : http://www.spacedaily.com/news/earth-04q.html
is saying

I must say it sounds really expensive to me, both in terms of the energy needed to gather this source of fuel and the cost of the equipment needed to refine it. Tell me otherwise I'm willing to listen but it does seem incredibly complex in terms of gathering and costs

 

I was angling my response to Pressed Rats post. Not the article itself.
Terribly rude, i imagine ?.

Anyway, i agree with you about there being a crisis. And our overdependance on that oil substance.

Though i suspect it will be a fairly well managed if chaotic [goverments working together] move from one form of energy to another.

Most if not all things currently ''oil hungry'' will be replaced/removed/re-engineered.

e.g

Nuclear [as a form of energy] don't ask me how we'll replace the need to use oil to 'make' it. As i'm not the one given the task, i'm sure i'll sleep tonight.
GM

Reducing the need for such a symbiotic relationship.

I don't think the ideas the site endorses are ''crap''. Overstated possibly. Crap ?, NO.

If this kind of language hastens [the end of] the use of oil in our societies. Then frightenening a few people is a small price to pay.

 

Not rude at all - my mistake!

 

I appreciate your response. Thankyou.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2005/10/23/nfuel23.xml&sSheet=/news/2005/10/23/ixhome.html


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/norfolk/4418360.stm
http://www.interconnector.com/


http://www.energybulletin.net/785.html%20onmousedown=return%20rwt(this,

The harsh winter never materialised . ''They'' ''We'' coped.

The same thing was said the year before

Aside from that, gas prices remain high.

"what's going to happen when the 'real problems' start showing up?"


Good question.

 

The fair market value based on what? Isn't the fair market value the price at which supply equals demand, which by definition is the current price?

 

Actually that is not true. What we are paying today is not the fair market value. The only justification for the current gas prices would be oil prices well over $100.00 per barrel!

The reason we are paying $3.00+ per gallon is due to out right price gouging and market manipulation done by the oil giants.

 

Exxon made a 10% profit margin in 2005, which is not really anybody's idea of wild price gouging.

It's not like the oil giants own all the oil they refine into gas. A lot of it they buy from big oil exporters like Mexico, Canada, Saudi Arabia, and Iran. If you want oil from these countries, you pay $70 a barrel, Exxon or no Exxon. Oil costs $70 a barrel, that's it, end of story. Its not like some executive in Texas is deciding what the oil price is.

 

Surely the fair market value is whatever they think they can get out of you.
A fair point that the article makes is that governments must think of a way to collapse the economy or to charge high prices so that demand drops.

Surely the executives in Texas add a percentage that they think is high enough to be excessive but not so excessive you cant afford it? In otherwords theyre screwing you but just at the right level so you know it but dont complain too much.

I dont know where you are located but a few years ago there were consumer boycotts in Britain against the price of fuel and it halted the whole country (for a week or so if I remember rightly). Perhaps the USA citizens should do the same if they feel the prices are excessive (or move to Europe - where we pay double what you do)

 

Yea right. Stop drinking the kool aid and research things for yourself!

That still does not justify $3.00+ per gallon at the pump. For prices that high gas would have to sell at well over $100.00 per barrel. Yes, the oil companies do rig the prices and conspire to control the supply of oil. Yes, the problems with imported oil is a problem as well since those prices are inflated as well. Here in the US it only costs $4.00 per barrel in total costs to get the oil from the ground, refine it then get it to the gas station! (Even cheaper in other countries)So what do you think a fair price for a barrel of oil should be.

The bottom line is that we need to find alternatives to oil and they are out there. Ethanol is a perfect solution, but what little progress we are making in exploring the use of Ethanol is made from corn. This is more expensive than petrol fuels. Also, growing that much corn seriously depletes the soil of nutrients and requires massive amounts of pesticides.

Ethanol can be made from almost anything. For example, sugar is far more efficient, cheaper and environmentally safe! Is are government researching this and other methods like saw grass etc? No. They are bowing to agriculture lobby and just exploring corn.

I am still boycotting Exxon/Mobil and Hess stations and will continue to do so until they seriously drop the price of gas.

 

Maybe they're doing all this to work up the public, so they can start a war with Iran. Just an idea, no proof.