Gospel of Judas

Okay. But all you said you could find in Ancient Greece, and it is possible to say that Cathars were like Pythagoreans, for example. With the exception of:

But this, in my humble opinion, is a very lame idea, and many Buddhists also don’t think in this way.

 

No Dan Brown is currently under a law suit for plagarizing a book called Holy Blood Holy Grail. This is a well known Idea and a massive historical and religious study among skeptics of ordinary Christianity. He just made a novel out of some aspects of it.

I never said anything about Greece. I only said Gnostic comes from the greek word for knowledge Gnosis. There were many gnostic cults in hellenstic greece and the mid east during the time of Christ and before and after.

That is your opinion, I do not believe matter is entirely evil either. Although it is an easy blame for when stuff goes bad, or about the faults in your body or character.

Is this directed to me? or do you mean the Gospel of Judas.

Of course they won't change their beleif, they feed off this beleif. It would distort alot of the Bible, which they feed off of.

 

I know. Sure he will wriggle out But before the Da Vinci Code, this idea hadn’t agitated so many people, although, of course, it was well known in some circles.

This is very strange that despite all that historical research nothing has been found so far to support it from the earliest centuries of Christianity. On the contrary, all the Gospels, including Gnostic, say about Jesus’ death in Palestine, and nothing, despite the claims of Dan Brown and other writers, could confirm Jesus and Mary’s matrimonial relationships. And with total lack of early facts, it seems just ridiculous to believe that. But maybe I am not right.

This is why I said about it

 

Actually about 75% of the "Revelations" of Davinci Code are quite well documented. These are things that the Vatican had supposed were destroyed after the First Council of 325AD but fragments did survive.

Skeptical?

Think about this: Why has the vatican, in the midst of a mass of coffer draining lawsuits, pumped MILLIONS of dollars into discrediting Dan Brown? Wouldn't it be easier, not to mention CHEAPER to just let it die?

Ponderous, man... F'ing ponderous...

 

FYI, Dan Brown won his lawsuit, or so I heard.

 

I heard of that many times But where are these fragments? I have already asked about them twice in this thread, but since we have no answer, it sounds quite like an urban legend. Give me just a simple reason to believe it. Why is it better than, say, alligators in the sewer?

What makes me suspicious, among other things, is that the private life of Jesus has apparently nothing to do with anybody’s spiritual growth, but, at the same time, this theme is so popular!

And some of these “documents” are sham or fiction, as aforementioned Holy Blood, Holy Grail.

It’s easy: they are going to gain more These books about breaking the Da Vinci Code are sold everywhere. Also, the book contains some very contradictory issues concerning just the Catholic world view, not the facts, and they want to refute that. That’s understandable.

 

Man, that National Geographic Show about the Gospels was tight to a t!

 

ohh I watched this the other night on the national geographic channel. it was quite insightful.

this text they found in egypt is authentic. it was written on papyrus, and it deteriorated alot over the years, especially the last 15-20, because some egyptian black market antiquities dealer didnt take care of it.

anyways, it doesnt surprise me that there was a gospel of judas. (because there were at least 30 different gospels). I can go on forever and ever about that special, but I will spare some minds and ears.

more and more, I dont agree with christianity and the bible in particular, because it left out alot of important things, and people take things in the bible literally, and so much anti semitism comes from the bible. especially with judas the betrayer (according to the gospel of john) and of course the jews that put jesus to death. but judas and jews are synonymous. and of course, hitler attended passion plays (which portrayed judas a dispicable, greedy, betrayor of jesus.

in all actuality, judas was the closest friend of jesus, and he had knowledge that the other apostles didnt. jesus persuaded judas to turn him in to the romans, told him that it was his destiny.....

the gnostics followed this gospel closely, because it taught that they dont need church leaders or the church, that the knowledge is within them, and the kingdom of heaven is within them, which was a threat to the christian religion at the time, so they claimed the gospel of judas as hereacy, and banished it, amoung other gospels as well.......

 

hardcore christians only follow the four gospels.

its kind of strange though, how from gospel mark to john, that judas wasnt even mentioned as a betrayor (mark) to such a devilish and hated character (john). mark was the first gospel written, and john was the last......

 

of course yall should mention the other gospels like the gospel of mary magdelene, gospel of thomas, and gospel of phillip, to name a few.

 

Christianity does not cause Antisemitism. Jesus was a Jew. All of the heroes in the Bible were Jews. Sure, some people claiming to be Christians have done horrendous things to not only Jews but lots of different people. But, it wasn't because they were Christians. It's because they were evil.

 

Be careful – keep them from the Illuminati!

Look, I am like doubting Thomas: before I read those fragments, I feel no urge to believe in their existence. For me, this is a natural attitude, although I can believe in everything, of course. I can believe even in hummingbirds on the face of Uranus.

Yes, it doesn’t. But when someone strenuously tries to make something popular, I always think: What do they really want? And there is no secret that the Da Vinci Code and The Gospel of Judas (already!) have received a lot of publicity. So I am just curious, who is behind all of that.

Yes, the institution. Not the person. I am not a Christian and I hope if they have problems they can solve them without my assistance Or, if they are heavily dissatisfied, they can simply change the institution, since we don’t live in the Middle Ages. Anyway, the most important human problems are personal, not institutional, that’s what I meant. And very often an institution becomes a scapegoat. In my opinion, the best way is to avoid all the institutions as far as possible, just not to pay attention to them, as Jesus usually did.

As for me, I don’t think that celibacy necessarily brings with it purity. Sometimes it’s quite the contrary.

It isn’t a big problem that it’s not proved. The thing is that the authors didn’t even believe all the stuff they wrote, as one of them has admitted.

Well, in the Newton’s times, if anybody dared to say that the Earth is flat, he or she would be terribly ridiculed But I understand what you mean. However, physics and history are very different sciences, and history is mostly not even a science, but ideology. By the highest standards, you cannot prove anything in history as you can do it in physics. We will never know for sure, if Jesus and Mary were husband and wife or not, this dispute is endless. You can only believe. Or not believe. But the important thing, whether you believe or not, is to escape from any brainwashing.

Heart attack? After so much publicity? Come on, they’re happy! And you know, the best way to force people to read something is to say: do not read it!

I have another milestones But this is only a matter of choice.

 

Here is an overview of the Gospel of Judas:

http://www.palmtreegarden.org/forum/viewtopic.php?id=455

The guy briefly points out at the unique features of the Gospel in comparison with other Gnostic texts.

 

I didnt say christianity causes antisemitism, I said the bible does. big difference.

 

They already know, but they persecute those who know too

There is a non-verbal knowledge, so to speak, and I think, if I truly knew God, I wouldn’t care if Jesus were married or not. This is a well known religious problem that if you want to know God you should forget, at least for a while, any factual knowledge and become irrational.

Or someone between God and me

What I am absolutely certain of is that the Creator didn’t leave any papers about the process of creation

That’s a hard question for me. I feel that some people desperately need that same religious institution as now, with celibacy for the priests and so on, just for their spiritual growth, or they think in such a way; so for those who disagree there is a way to leave the institution. But I am not sure about that at all, it’s only a guess.

Catholics would argue I won’t.

In fact, Richard Leigh has stated on television that they only set out to offer a plausible hypothesis, but "never believed it to be true."

This is the quotation from the link I gave earlier. Richard Leigh is one of the authors of Holy Blood, Holy Grail. Actually, all the history, as we know it, is only a hypothesis. It doesn't mean that it doesn't exist.

Columbus certainly didn’t discover America, because many people already lived here when he arrived But things are more serious. For example, historians still argue about Stalin’s personality and his biography, and it isn’t even known if he killed his wife or not, despite the fact that he died only 53 years ago. Do you think he, or some other person, made a confession? The more historical facts you learn, the less you are certain, actually. But, to some extent, the factual knowledge isn’t so important.

What if that guy is eager to deceive you?

 

One time at a benadictine monastary, one of the monks and ram dass (who wrote remember be here now) were hanging out. The monk asked, "what is the meaning of the kiss between judas and jesus?" and ram dass said, "Perhaps they were enjoying the game..." Then they danced in ecstasy...

Perhaps this is because Ram Dass knew it was Jesus's doing, his planning with Judas and they were playing this game with everyone... mind games in the name of love!

 

Yeah, Newton lived 1643-1727, so they knew the earth was round by then. Shit, the ancient Greeks knew the earth was round, at least, some of the philosophers did (who knows how widespread their word went among the people).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_Earth

 

Just kidding. Hopefully, they don’t exist

Sure, everybody would, we just choose different ways, which is normal.

I could agree in some degree, sorry for the rhyme. However, as for the Gnostics, one of their main idea was that if something is between God and you, it should be better removed. And they’re right – in some degree

Probably She did, but I didn’t understand Her I just feel this way. It’s unlikely that the process of Creation can be verbalized.

This just means that even natural sciences can’t prove everything, let alone history. Logical absurdity lies in the very heart of the world. There are some tangential proofs of that in mathematics, but I don’t remember them now

Hey, what about the Amerindians?

That’s what I am going to do either.



Returning to the Gospel of Judas… What if Jesus wanted to test Judas asking him for the betrayal? It was a very serious test, considering that his own life was at stake. This hypothesis could have strange implications, but I am not ready to elaborate.

 

Probably you mean Nicolaus Copernicus, not Newton.

 

Because this thread is about something written allegedly by Gnostics. But anyway, this idea is quite common for all Christians.

For some the Creator is She, for others He, for somebody maybe even a poplar or a prairie dog or fly or water or sheep or deer or shark or shrimp or seaweed

No, I haven’t seen Her, and She may change her sex and race and appearance before that happens.

Chaos theory? It's impossible. Chaos throws all theories away

We have the gift of free will, and this means that even God can’t know everything about people’s intentions. Of course, this opinion seems arguable, contradictory and unproved, as all the best things in the world, but I am standing firm on it