what do muslims think about jews and christians? i know they recognize them as people of the book and that they all follow the same god but do muslims think they go to heavon too? i know christians arevery intolerable and say jews and muslims go to hell and i think jews are the same way.
It helps if you understand what Muhammeds understanding (or misunderstanding) of Jews and Christians was. Jews believed and accepted the 'Old Testament' but not the New Testament. Christians (and Christian Jews) accept both the Old AND the New. Muhammed doesnt seem to quite grasp this and thats why he puts them all under this title of 'People of the Book' which is not really helpful or quite accurate. Ok. Now Muhammed also seems to know Christianity based on abberant Christian 'Cults' or 'Sects' which might have lived in his region. Either that or he did not understand Christianity at all. At one point he suggests that Christians were 'Pantheists' and believed in two or more Gods. This is, of course total nonsense and Christians would be (as everyone knows) fiercly monotheistic. But again, Its possible Muhammed is talking about some 'Christian Cult' or Sect which has since disappeared. Its not really too surprising since Muhammed was from and was himself a Pagan worshipper before he accepted the Judeo-Christian concept of 'Yahweh' and converted his pagan community over to the Jewish idea. (I agree with him on that!) At one point Muhammed was possessed by Satan and suggested that Allahs three daughters were also Gods. (Meaning Allah the Pagan Moon God Idol who was worshipped at that time). So, you can see why its not surprising that Muhammed was trying to relate his understanding of 'God, Son, Holy Spirit' through what 'he knew' in his time, in his region, in his world. You can see where it would be easy for him to be confused. Christians and Jews were not killed unless they converted but were 'allowed' to live under the House of Islam if they paid a 'Jeeyza' (sp?) but basically its a tax to support Islam. They are also relegated to a 'second class' of citizenship in that there were certain offices they could not hold (obviously). But yeah.. Muhammed got his whole idea and based it on the Bible .. or rather to say 'Made his own version' so the least he could do was not kill them. Thats not asking much is it?
Well, the poll tax was pretty much a standard thing you would expect- a new empire expands, and the new citizens pay the costs of their local governments. Conversion was actually discouraged for a long time; the idea of non-Muslims being only "allowed" to live in the House of Islam is completely preposterous, and the claim that any force was either used to encourage conversion or to harass people unwilling to conform is completely inaccurate. In addition, the Ahl al-Kitab shouldn't necessarily be restriced to the Jews and the christian Cults Muhammad encountered first-hand. Most scholars suggest that, if he had had enough contact with them to form a basis for it, Buddhism, Hinduism, etc would probably have been mentioned as institutions to be respected equally as those he did mention. -Which is why you often see the less literal translation 'People of an Earlier Revelation.' As for whether or not anybody goes to 'heaven,' that's really between you and you God, now isn't it? Grouve on...
The term; "People of the book" implies a certain kind of respect since we both worship the same god and believe in the earlier scriptures. Too understand wether or not muslims believe christians&jews can attain paradise you have to be able to understand some of the basic princibles of islam such as the belief that all the prophets were muslims ("muslim" being one who submits him/herself to God). The disicple of Christ (peace be upon him) were desbriced as muslims in the Quran: "But when Jesus perceived unbelief on their part, he said Who will be my helpers in Allah's way? The disciples said: We are helpers (in the way) of Allah: We believe in Allah and bear witness that we are muslims " We believe that christians who followed the true teaching of Christ (Christ did not teach trinity nor salvation by the cross, these things are innovation from Paul and others) were muslims and if they died in that state they could be among those mentioned in the verse: "Surely those who believe, and those who are Jews, and the f Christians, and the Sabians, whoever believes in Allah and the Last day and does good, they shall have their reward from their Lord, and there is no fear for them, nor shall they grieve. " [2:62] This lasted up until God sent another messanger, ie. the jews could attain paradise up until God sent a new messanger, those who denied Christ became disbelievers and the christians who denied the last and final messanger became thus disbelievers. The belief is composed of different parts, like believing in all the books and prophets, a muslim who denies Christ being a prophet is no more muslim than the Jesus worshipping christian today. Say: "O People of the Book! come to common terms as between us and you: That we worship none but Allah; that we associate no partners with him; that we erect not, from among ourselves, Lords and patrons other than Allah." If then they turn back, say ye: "Bear witness that we (at least) are Muslims (bowing to Allah's Will). [3:64]
Erasmus, there is NO historical records that support your words about the prophet Muhammed (may peace and blessing of Allah be upon him) ever being a pagan worshipper, rahter (before becoming a prophet) he used to seclude him self from the pagans of mecka and worship God alone. Indeed, he never left monotheism even before preaching islam. The man who took care of orphans and the needy being an orphan him self, the illeterate man who was deeply respected by his people as the most honorble and truthful who used to refuse to worship their gods, drink alcohol and engage in their loathsome activities, whom else shoulh of been chosen to become the last prophet of God? "If greatness of purpose, smallness of means, and astounding results are the three criteria of human genius, who could dare to compare any great man in modem history with Muhammad?" - Lamartine "I have studied him - the wonderful man - and in my opinion far from being an anti-Christ he must be called the saviour of humanity. " Nobel prize winner George Bernard Shaw in "The Genuine Islam"
Just to be clear: You do not worship the same God that I do. I do not (and no Christian would) worship a God with 'Partners' but instead I worship the one true God of the Jews (sometimes said 'Yahweh'). I do not worship Allah and the Jews do not worship Allah. Now it is true that Jews and Christians worship the same God but of course we know that many Jews did not accept that Jesus was the incarnation of God on Earth. I think this is important. There is a movement and appeal for some acceptance of 'Allah' as the same god as the one Jews and Christians worship. No. As far as 'Historical evidence' for anything we are saying, its well established that Muhammed was from a region steeped in Paganism. He says it himself. Now.. I AGREE that Muhammed was right to recognise Monotheism just as the Jews and Christians did. Yes, to his credit he got that right. However, This is the worst attempt to rewrite history and 'reframe' the premise of history by pretending that .. low and behold.. it was the wonderous Arabs the whole time who have been the true jews descended from Abraham and ... wow... it turns out its everyone else who then changed things. Wow! This is stupid. Jews were running that show from Abraham on and its probably one of the best and most well recorded realities in human civilisation. Muhammeds people were no different than most of the Gentile (non-Jews) all over Europe and elsewhere who were worshipping all kinds of pagan dieties and pantheistic idol worship and whatnot. btw.. wasnt Muhammeds own father having the name 'Allah' in his own name? Since the only 'Allah' anyone knew about before Muhammeds version was the Pagan Moon God then I think it is safe to say there is SOME evidence Muhammed was at least born and raised Pagan. If not.. then what do you suppose he was.. A Jew? Like I say, I give him credit for, at least agreeing with the Jews on that one aspect - Monotheism. I realise he also gave Allah some 'partners' in the three daughters (Moon God Allah also had Three Daughter goddesses if I recall this right). But Muhammed later rebuked his own words when he realised that Satan had possessed him and given him that false scripture.
as long as a islamic radical dosen't try to blow me up I dont have problems with muslims....they are people too....I guess sometimes people don't wanna see the good in a particular group because of a few bad nut cases
Like me. I don't look for the good in Texans because of the nutcases bread there... But as long as some crazy drunk-ass hick doesn't try to stick it up my ass, I don't have problems with you personally. ...Does it work both ways? Am I supposed to be unnoffended by the way that YOU talk? Are you offended when I act like you?
Erasmus, I think you are very arrogant, and that you really have no clue what you are talking about. I would really recommend that you step away from the computer, and get a life. A life where you can really be apart of something greater than just venting your hatred for another belief system. Stop staring at a screen, trying to feel better about yourself. Muslims are not going to disappear off the face of this planet anytime soon. You might as well channel your life energy in a positive, and nuturing direction. Stomping millions of peoples way of feeling connected to the DIVINE CREATOR is nonsense. Anyway, back to my point...These people do worship the same God. Have you been to the middle east? Do you speak Hebrew or Arabic? Well I speak Arabic, and my family is Armenian. BTW, they are mostly Catholic. I see both sides of spectrum and how stupid Muslims and Christians can be. They just keep getting caught in this endless dance. No one is better than the other. Erasamus you are not one atom better than any Muslim or Pagan. You both come from the womb of a woman, breath the air, eat the food of this earth, and eventually die. Our final destination only God knows, and we as free minds all have our own personal relationship with God. "In the city of Madina in what we call today "Saudi Arabia", there were three main religions: Idol worshiping, Judaism and Christianity. The name of the Jewish leader who also was the Highest Priest in Madina before Islam came was "Abdallah Bin-Saba". His Arabic name was not "AbdElohim Bin-Saba" or "AbdElloi Bin-Saba" or "AbdGOD Bin-Saba". The reason why his first name was "Abdallah" is because the Arab Jews in Madina used the word "Allah" for GOD in their Holy Scriptures. The word "Allah" did indeed exist in the Arabic Talmud and the other Jewish Holy Scriptures. Also, the Christians' Arabic Bible at that time used the word "Allah" for GOD. Even today's Christians' Arabic Bibles use the word "Allah" for GOD. Today in the Middle East, Christians sometimes name their kids "Abdallah". Also there are Christian families who's last names is "Abdallah". In today's Arabic Bible, the word "Allah" is used for both the Old Testament and the New Testament."
We believe the anyone can go to Paradise if they followed the teachings of the prophets, because like brother cabdirazzaq sayed, we don't believe Christ to be a son of God, because he taught about Allah, it was his "disciples" that taught he was a god. But those Christians and Jews who believe justly are just as welcome to Paradise as Muslims are.
