Feminist AND a homemaker?

Do you think that you can be both? Because I hear a lot of people saying that woman who do that are bad for feminism, but I'm not sure I agree with that statement. I think if a woman becomes a homemaker because they think they must because they are woman, of course it's a bad thing, or if they are forced to stay home by their husbands, that's definitly it's a bad thing. I'm definintly not arguing that making a woman stay home is okay, (obviously. I like to think that most woman aren't that brainwashed) but if a woman makes that decision to be a homemaker because she wants to- well, it's her decision, isn't it? If that's what makes her happy, who am I to tell her not to? It may not be for me, but everyone is different.

I just believe that the feminist movement is about giving woman equal rights and more choices of what they can do with their lives. Well, by calling homemakers immoral or bad, wouldn't that be taking away choices?

I dunno, am I totally out of my mind or do you see where I'm coming from?

 

No, I totally agree with you. It's all about choice. It's just as bad for society to expect all women to work as it is for society to expect all women to stay at home. Although personally, I feel that every woman should get an education so that if her husband leaves her she'll have something to fall back on. And also, if you don't have any kids, you shouldn't stay at home.


-Kate

 

Yes, you can be a feminist and a homemaker at the same time, if being a homemaker was YOUR choice and not anyone else's! It's the same thing as going to work because you want to, it's about what YOU want. If that happens to be what you truly want, then you're not breaking any "feminist" rules in my opinion. I don't know if I'm a feminist or not, but I am definitely all about freedom and women doin' their own thing.

Strawberry, why do you say that if one doesn't have any children, they shouldn't stay at home? If finances provide and that's the woman's choice, again, that is what she should do. By setting the rule that if you don't have any children, you shouldn't stay at home, you are biting yourself in the ass, because that is not choice or freedom at all, that's just as bad as someone saying if you have children, you should never be allowed to work at all.

 

Because if you don't have kids or a job, what, praytell, are you going to do all day? Cleaning house only takes so long. And personally, I think that is sexist against men. Think about it: What if a man wanted to stay at home with no children while the wife went to work? How many women would put up with that kind of freeloading? I sure as hell wouldn't. I mean, if you had your adult child living in your house, and that kid ate your food and used your running water but didn't contribute to the household financially, that kid would be looked down on as a FREELOADER, but if a wife wants to do it, suddenly it's okay?

 

I agree, about the threadstarter's post, and strawberry's post above. I think though that most people just staying at home cleaning would get tired of it and want to go out and get a job or something. Also, I think that homemakers(w/kids) is kind of a good thing. It gives them (the mothers or fathers) time to do things they otherwise would'nt be able to do. For example, my friend has a big family with a toddler and an infant, and his mom stays home all day and takes care of them, but while she's doing that she picked up writing and reading again, and she just started an online bookstore.

 

I agree that someone who stays home without children should do something productive. But it doesn't have to be a job, it could be volunteering in many places than need volunteers, or just doing things in general to improve the life of the couple, their families, or people around them.

But you are wrong that cleaning house "only takes so long". Sometimes the stay at home person's working partner can actually be such a huge slob, it takes a big part of the day while they are at work to clean it up! Or they live in an area that creates a lot of dirt, or they have people over all the time. Or they have a lot of pets they have to clean up after.

I do stay at home as of right now, and I have no children. But both are because of illness. Because of that illness, it also takes me much longer to do normal housework and chores than it takes other people, so maybe this doesn't apply to this situation, but I do know that I spend at least 2 hours every morning doing just daily morning routine things, and then throughout the day I am busy taking care of dogs, doing odd little cleaning jobs or chores, paying bills, grocery shopping, cooking, and whatever else that needs to be done. All this takes up a large part of the day, and I really only end up having 3 hours or less of actual free time... then my husband gets home and I am busy messing with stuff he wants me to do or doing more housework because he's messy, cooking, whatever. then I get another hour or so spread out throughout the rest of the evening to have some recreational time. On top of all this, I often have doctor's appoinments or family obligations and things like that to take another big chunk out of my day. I may not work, but I am constantly busy.

My point? Not everyone who stays at home has a butt-load of free time. Granted, if I wasn't struggling with an illness, I would have a lot more free time than I do, but only by a few more hours, in which I would spend volunteering or working because I wanted to. Backtothelab is right... even though I don't have a butt-load of free time due to no job or kids, I still get tired and bored of my life sometimes and wish I had a job... but I can't do that right now because even if I could make it through a work day, I'd be too sick to do ANYTHING at home and nothing would EVER get done. So if I DID have a butt-load of free time, I'd go even MORE nuts than I do now out of boredome and loneliness... I'd work because I WANTED to.. but the key word here is WANT.

My even bigger point is that I would think, given common sense, anyone who does not have children but does not work has a good reason for it... such as illness like me, or maybe they are busy caring for other family members or friends, or they volunteer, or they enjoy devoting a large part of their time to fixing up the house and making it a nice haven for themselves and their partner.

People with illnesses aside, if there are able-bodied people out there who are able to not work, we need them! Who's gonna do the nice little things in life like clean up the parks when the city won't, or help out the old people in the neighborhood who need help with THEIR housework, or volunteer to help at soup kitchens and homeless shelters? What about the kids who'd otherwise have to stay at a nasty daycare center instead of with their nice, able-bodied non-working neighbor? Who's going to give their time to help those who can't afford to hire the help? I sure wish that there were more able-bodied people who didn't work, with kindness in their hearts to help me out in my worst days. If you took away all the healthy people who don't work, sending them all to actual jobs, you'd be taking away a large part of the "workforce" that these parts of life so heavily rely on. Being able to be healthy and yet not work is a blessing not just to the person but to those around them, if they are a decent human being. So no, not everyone who doesn't have kids should get a job. Sometimes not working IS their job, when they put their energies in places that get ignored by the working people. As soon as I get well and healthy enough to handle everything at home, I plan to either work at a paying job IF we need the money, if we don't, I will be volunteering and helping out in other areas of life rather than working at a paying job.

I know there are people out there who don't have kids or a job and just sit in sweats all day eating snacks, while the house piles up and the partner works. I think these people have serious issues that getting a job wouldn't help, they need therapy, because no one in their RIGHT mind could stand to do that day in and day out! So you can't really just tell those people to get a job either, especially since whatever their problem is, is the reason they are like that anyway. They probably couldn't KEEP a job, so what's the point?

So those are my reasons for why you can't just say people who don't have children should work.

 

Bree:


What the hell is wrong with your husband?!!! Seriously, YOU have an illness and he's too lazy to pick up after himself? You deserve better than to pick up after a slob when you're sick. If he really loved you, he'd be more understanding towards your condition and help you out more. Who does he think he is? Either dump him or kick his ass into cleaning up after himself. Then maybe you wouldn't be so tired and overwhelmed. Have some self-respect, girl. Your husband is a grown man and should be cleaning up after himself. If he expects you to do it all, he's an abusive freak who should be dumped faster than last weeks garbage.

I wasn't talking about people out on disability, and when I said cleaning only takes so long, I was assuming the husband was decent enough to help out when he was home. If not, that's another issue entirely. I still don't think volunteering is an excuse. Alot of stay-at-home mom's volunteer, which is cool, and there are alot of retired people to volunteer in the community, not to mention student groups. And I still say it's sexist against men to assume that they should be the one to always work. What if both partners want to stay home with no kids and volunteer their time? Who would pay the bills then? It would probably end up being the husband, which is essentially saying that women have choice but men don't.

 

I also disagree that house cleaning only takes so long, because logically, if that is what you do all day, then you're not just going to clean the way that people who don't have time for it to do. You're going to do the grunt work that people usually only do on the weekends- like repairs and gutter cleaning and whatnot. That's part of the reason it's not for me- I'm not into housework. LOL

Actually, it's just not my personality. I like working. Right now, I have a job that pays for textbooks and college fees, and I like that. Not really the job so much, but the fact that I'm paying for it on my own is satisifying. I'm sure some people get the same satisfaction from housework, but I sure don't.

 

I agree with that. Not necassarily incase she loses her husband somehow, but education is just important in general. My grandmother takes classes at a college, not because she's going to get a job, just because she wants to learn.

 

Its fine for a woman to be a feminist and a homemaker. There's nothing nessecarily empowering about mindless carrerism, and its fine for a woman to want to stay home and take care of things. All that matters is that you have a choice.

 

I think I gave the wrong impression of my husband. LOL

He does help out when he can, but he works long hours and it's extremely hard physical labor in a warehouse with no air conditioning, and it reaches 130 degrees or more in there sometimes in the summer. On top of that, he only gets about 4 hours of sleep per night, AND he has sleep apnea, for which the docs said he needed 10. So I don't blame him for not doing much around the house... when he's home and awake, I want to spend that time with him or let him have his recreational time.. all work and no play makes for a grumpy person! However he does still do just about anything I ask him to, and he does a lot of stuff on his own, like mowing, yardwork, taking the trash out, putting his clothes in the hamper. On the weekends he does turn into a slob, but I think I would too if I had that kind of a week! LOL He also spends a lot of his free time taking me to doctor's appointments or taking care of me when I can't do anything. Housecleaning is just not his strong point. We complement each other.

I appreciate that he works so hard, and I honestly don't mind cleaning up after him, and that is the only reason I do it. I enjoy being able to do mundane things like housework, because for a long while there I couldn't even do that much due to be so sick and I felt absolutely worthless... so now that I can do housework, even if it takes me all day, I really appreciate being able to do it. It also keeps me busy, because otherwise I'd have nothing to do since I can't really get out and about much. The point here is I do what I do because I WANT to. If I am able to, I like being able to do it, if I am too sick, he will do it if I ask him to. If I didn't want to do those things, I just wouldn't do them. But it works out easier on the both of us, because he works so hard, it's nice for him to not have to work even harder to clean up after him self ALL the time. And because I don't have work obligations or child obligations, it frees me up to take my time to do it for him without overdoing it or getting sick, and still have a decent quality of life at home. When I was sick, I felt bad asking him to do so much stuff on top of his already strenous schedule, so it's nice not to have to do that as much anymore.

He also doesn't really expect me to do anything.. when I have bad weeks where I am too sick to do anything and the place starts looking bad or we have a shortage of clothes due to undone laundry, he doesn't complain and never ever has complained. He says he doesn't really care that much, he's fine with it, and says that I should rest anyway. So when I do what I do, it's still my choice. I do it out of love for him and blessing our lives together.

Which is why no feminist can complain about me, because EVERYTHING I do as far as work or housework is my choice. (relating to the original topic of the thread)

I know you weren't talking about people with disabilities, but I was saying that I felt like disabilies weren't the ONLY good reasons to stay at home. If I knew one of my healthy neighbors didn't work just so they could volunteer at the homeless shelter downtown (which really needs it), I'd be just fine with that. She/he would be would be doing what they chose to do, which is something that is needed just like workers are needed elsewhere.

You do have a point about what happens if both people want to stay at home.... Society does seem to place the work load on the man's shoulders, and in situations where no children are involved, that is rather sexist. But I just think that each couple should be able to work something out to suit them both. Maybe in some relationships, the woman wants to work but the man wants to stay home, that's fine too. Maybe not fine to society but to me it's fine. My husband has just as much freedom to stay at home while I worked if our relationship worked that way (but we are in our best places where we are). Or maybe they could both work part time and share the burden and the pleasantries. It's about finding a balance for your individual lives, and the solution won't be the same for every couple. Even if one partner does way more actual work both in and out of the home than the other partner, if they don't mind and they are happy that way, then it is the balance for them.

Some people, believe it or not, actually LIKE to work. And because of the way our bodies work, men actually tend to NEED an actual paying job for themselves more than women do, the way they are wired, they need that aspect in their lives, something to feel proud of doing... So maybe that's why it seems to be left up to the man more than the woman when it comes to working. I honestly believe that women do not get the respect they deserve when it comes to domestic work, and that's why so many women are choosing to work in the workforce, because there they get recognized for the work they do, they get a paycheck and they get respected. If society respected domestic work as much as they respect a paying job, I would be willing to bet a large chunk of my money that most women would be choosing to stay at home, children or no children. And if all men were given the choice to work or stay at home, I'd be willing to bet that most of them would want to work, because that's just how they are! As much as my husband needs and wants a nice long break from work, he'd never want to not have a job. It'd drive him insane. It's his identity and his thing in life, and he likes "bringin' home the bacon".

I don't think that it really matters who works and who stays home. Unfortunately society believes otherwise, but maybe they have been led to believe this because of the natural inclination in the past years for men to work and women to stay home because MAYBE that's just how we are wired as human beings, to complement each other! And not only that, but in past years, staying home was just as much work as working. Nowadays with the advent of machines to do a big chunk of our housework, staying home can be a breeze. But back then it wasn't, and women worked just as hard at home as their men did at their jobs. The roles that everyone played fell into place naturally because let's face it, there are just some things women are better at than men and vice versa! Women ended up staying at home because for the most part women were better with housework and childrearing! And men went to work because they were for the most part just better at mechanical and heavy work!

Things are different now, though. Thanks to modern techonogoly and more widespread available education, women can do most stuff men can do and men can do most stuff women can do. We all recognize that, but I think what happens is that we fail to realize that the patterns of the past are still going to be present today, because technology really is still a new thing. Yeah it's sexist of our society to still make those assumptions in this day and age, but come on, it takes a while to grow out of old habits. Maybe we should be complaining about society's inability to grow out of that old habit faster than it is, rather than complaining about the character of society?

I'm not saying this is how it is, but it's something to consider, as a possibility.

 

the way i figure it, if a husband and wife decide together that with or without children, the wife can stay home, then that's their decision. it in no way adversely affects the decision of the hardworking female executive up the road, since it's really not her business. if a man is delighted that his childless wife is home dedicating her work hours to making his home a haven from the world, plus doing whatever else she finds satisfying, then that's their deal. however, i don't see that happening much.


telling a woman that her decision to stay home adversely affects the feminist movement is like telling two gay people they can't get married because it devalues the sanctity of straight marriage. it's nonsense.

 

Well said kc! I agree completely... much better said than my long rambling LOL

My hubby and I are one of those couples.

 

Yep, it's all about choice. Feminism is about allowing women to make choices that they feel will benefit them-if a woman wants to stay at home, as long as she's not bein forced to, then good for her.

 

Well that and selling books...

 

Wicca's about selling books. Feminism's about gaining rights for woman.

 

lol, I knew it was one of those hollywood fads. serioulsy I love equal rights... and fads, I'm easy to please.

 

Hehehehe.

 

Well. I am a stay at home mom of three ( one on the way). I stay home because I WANT to. Because I feel my most powerful and fuffilled taking care of my kids. I support my husband because that is also part of my contribution to our household. I am not forced to. It has always been my choice. We are mothers. That is a powerful force for some of us as well. Why would it be ridiculous to think that we could be as happy as a woman with a career? In fact, for some of us this IS our chosen career. My husband and I are partners. He respects me and values my input and my contribution to our life together. I do not ask him for money. We have a JOINT bank account and I have my own savings account. I do not ask him for " permission" to do anything. I talk to him about it but I make my own choices. He respects women and sees me as much wiser and nurturing than him in some areas so he consults me about his life choices . I make the parenting choices and that is fine. I don't want to do his job. He also helps me take care of the kids as much as possible. For example I don't think I have gotten up in the middle of the night once for my kids since they were weaned off the breast. I think if it is an equal partnership in which the woman is happy and making her own choices than a homemaker very much CAN be a feminist. That is what is so wonderful about us. We can do ANYTHING and as my husband who works at a very stressful high tech wall street job has told me many times. My job is harder than his .......

 

Well, it sounds like you have a cool husband and a pretty happy life. Mind if I forward your post to some of my asshole friends?