Why are Christians such homophobes?

It's not a matter of fear but a matter of respecting God's will. I don't have any anger towards someone when it comes to sexual preference. I just know that God spoke against homosexuality, and as a believer, I follow his word. I definetly don't agree with making gay marriage legal because again, according to the Bible, marriage was meant to be between a man and woman (hey, his rules) but I don't go into some rage over seeing two people of the same sex together. Hell, I've kissed girls before in the past. Course that was before I was saved.

Thanks Ice-man

 

While I agree that some Christians are just as concerned with other issues as Ice-Man was saying, I do think that a lot of churches will preach against homosexuality & other 'hot' issues & ignore other topics. They are often taught to hate more than they are taught to love. If they are not taught by their church to hate they will see other Christains acting that way on the television or in the papers.

It is the church's job to teach love & mercy & the church members' job to learn these lessons. But too many people ignore this & act the way they think they are supposed to... and so people look down on Christianity because so many people that live in America consider themselves Christian even when they know very little about it.

 

I am a Christian and I am not a homophobe to any extent. I don't really even pay that much attention to one's sexual orientation unless they want me to, even though some people would say I should. I love gay men, most of them are so nice and fun to hang around. Gay women on the other hand, are the completely opposite, in my experience they have been very bitchy and mean. Not sure why the trend seems to be this way, but it is. But my point is, I look at the person for who they are, not what their sexual preference is, even if I take note of it. When I do take note of it, it's usually like taking note that someone has blonde hair, or has a blue shirt on.

I do however believe that homosexuality is wrong, and I would do my best to not engage in it. I acknowledge that no one is perfect and some people are going to be attracted to the opposite sex... there have even been a few women I've seen in my life that I wouldn't mind "doing". But I feel like it's a bad idea to indulge in that for a variety of reasons, some of them being my personal religious beliefs, pratical and logical beliefs, and the fact that sometimes I wonder if I'm truly attracted to that or just attracted to the mystery, since I've never experienced it. I'm pretty sure after if I experienced it, I would no longer be interested... It would probably just feel weird.

Anyway my whole point is, I know that a stereotype of a Christian is to be homophobic, and to be honest I do know a lot of "Christians" and Christians who really are homophobic becasue of what they've been taught growing up. But on the flip side there are just as many tolerant and loving Christians who realize the truth about this matter, and aren't homophobic at all. I feel bad for the people who are homophobic as well as the people that are hurt by them because of their homophobia... it's such needless stress that gets either them nowhere. So much more could be accomplished if they would just get along and be nice, and love them for what they are: human.

 

I am blessed to be part of a church that not only teaches against what is wrong, but also teaches to have love for one another no matter what.

 

You tell me. Christians are the ones that condemn them, as though you're free of sin yourselves. The Bible has a few passages about homosexual sex (probably a very small amount compared to other Roman Empire works). There are more passages about other sins that Christians are generally silent about.

You claim that you're not the way I perceive you, and then you mention the Christian Coalition as a positive force in America. If Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson are your idea of good Christians, I think that pretty much verifies that you ARE the way I perceive you. The Christian Coalition is one of the largest hate groups in America.

 

i'm a christian. i don't care who someone has sex with unless it's a family member or forced. but to be honest, there's a lot of areas in the bible where i can't help but say "what the fuck?" god doesn't make mistakes, men do. so, as i christian, i make a point to follow christ's fundamental teachings, i trust them rather well. love everyone, no sin is unforgiveable, be a shining light to others and bring peace to all you can.

 

did you hear him personally or you just going by what people told you?

 

This is a rant from the Real Live Preacher's blog. It pretty much summarizes my opinion of homophobic "Christians."



So you want to talk about homosexuality? YOU want to talk about homosexuality? You want to talk about homosexuALITY?

Sit down CHRIStian. Give me that bible you’re waving before you hurt yourself. I’m going to resist the temptation to snatch it from your hands and beat you with it. I am your worst nightmare, a Texas preacher who knows The Book better than you do.

You cannot wave your unread bible and scare me. I know its larger story and I will tear you a new biblical asshole.

Show me your scriptures. Show me how you justify condemning homosexual people.

Show me what you got, Christian. The Sodom story? That story is about people who wanted to commit a brutal rape. Let’s all say it together, “God doesn’t like rape”. You could have listened to your heart and learned that, Christian. Move on. What else you got?

A weak-ass little passage from Leviticus? Are you kidding me? Are you prepared to adhere to the whole Levitical code of behavior? No? Then why would you expect others to? What else?

Two little passages - two verses from Romans and one from I Corinthians. There you stand, your justification for a worldwide campaign of hatred is written on two limp pieces of paper. I know these passages, both their greater context and the original language. I could show you why you have nothing, but there is something more important you need to see.

Come with me to the church cellar. Come now and don’t delay. I am shaking with anger and fighting the urge to grab you by the collar and drag you down these steps.

You didn’t know the church had a cellar? Oh yes, every church does. Down, down we go into the darkness. Don’t slip on the flagstone and never mind the heat.

There, do you see the iron furnace door, gaping open? Do you see the roaring flames? Do you see the huge man with glistening muscles, covered with soot? Do you see him feeding the fire as fast as can with his massive, scooped shovel?

He feeds these flames with the bible, with every book, chapter, and verse that American Christians must burn to support our bloated lifestyles, our selfishness, our materialism, our love of power, our neglect of the poor, our support of injustice, our nationalism, and our pride.

See how frantically he works? Time is short, and he has much to burn. The prophets, the Shema, whole sections of Matthew, most of Luke, the entire book of James. Your blessed 10 commandments? Why would you want to post them on courtroom walls when you’ve burned them in your own cellar?

Do you see? DO YOU SEE? Do you see how we rip, tear, and burn scripture to justify our lives?

The heat from this cursed furnace rises up and warms the complacent worshippers in the pews above. The soot from the fire blackens our stained glass so that we may not see out and no one wants to see in.

Do you smell the reek of this injustice? It is a stink in the nostrils of the very living God. We are dressed in beautiful clothes and we wear pretty smiles, but we stink of this blasphemous holocaust.

Every church in America has a cellar like this. We must shovel 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, 365 days a year, because every chapter and book we ignore must be burned to warm our comfy pews.

And you come to me with two little scraps of scripture to justify your persecution of God’s children?

Sit down Christian. Sit down and be you silent.

How long has it been since you forgot that we were called to walk the earth as pilgrims? Do you not remember when HE told us to give our coats to those in need and sell our possessions to help the poor? Did you forget how the first church had all things in common so that none would lack.

Did you forget the day He told us that whatever we did for the oppressed we did for Him, and whatever we withheld from them was kept from Him as well?

Sit down Christian. You have not earned the right to speak to this generation. The right to speak is earned with love.

Take back your bible. Take it back and start reading it. Fall in love again with Jesus. Sell what you must and walk the earth. Let your love be astonishing and people may one day listen to your words.

Even now you might be saved. Our God is merciful and forgiveness awaits.

 

I'd like to speak to this issue in 4 parts.

Part One - Hypocrisy:
If Christians were honest, they would admit that they do not abide by all the commandments of scripture themselves. I don't mean we try and fail. I mean we deliberately choose to ignore scriptures that are not convenient for our lifestyle. As I pointed out in my post yesterday, the amount of scripture that is ignored, scorned, and abused by modern Christians is appalling.
I think we should afford our homosexual brothers and sisters the same luxury. Perhaps we should offer them space at our bonfire to burn their little handful of scriptures as we burn the bible chapter and verse.
We should all agree that none of us are able or willing to follow all the teachings of scripture. Let the one who is obeying God's word ask for explanations from others.
In my book, that settles the argument, and there is no reason to go further. However, if you are determined to hold homosexuals to a higher standard, demanding detailed explanations of why they do not obey minor parts of the bible while all of Christendom tramples on the very heart of scripture, move on to part two:

Part Two - The Bible and homosexuality:
(I’m indebted to my new friend B. in Dallas for these thoughts)
The bible never addresses the subject of homosexuality. The idea of sexual identity was not a part of human thought until very recently. The bible addresses some specific homosexual acts in very specific contexts.
The idea of two people in a loving, committed homosexual relationship was not understood in the ancient Hebrew world and is not a subject in the bible.
Very credible biblical scholars treat the passages in question as specific commands against specific acts, and not as a wholesale prohibition on a homosexual orientation.
For many people, understanding this obvious limitation of the bible is all that is needed. The bible does not address the broad subject of sexual orientation because it was written before that was an issue. Any specific condemnation of homosexual acts must be seen as just that – a specific condemnation of an act in a specific context.
However, if that sounds too wishy-washy to you, if it sounds too slippery and subjective, let me now speak to all 6 of the passages in the bible that are thought by some people to address the issue of homosexuality.

Part Three – Exegesis
There are exactly 6 scriptures that are thought to address homosexuality. I’ll either quote the passage or provide a link so that you can read it.
The story of the destruction of Sodom – Genesis 19:1-29. If you read this story, you’ll quickly see that the men of the city of Sodom wanted to commit a brutal, homosexual rape (is there any other kind?). We simply cannot condemn a sexual orientation because of a rape. There is a heterosexual rape described in the next passage we will examine together. Shall we condemn heterosexuality because of this rape?
Any reasonable person will understand that this passage has nothing to say about loving, consensual homosexual relationships.
Judges 19:1-30 is a sad story of human evil of the type that are often recounted in scripture. It is basically a retelling of the Sodom story in a different context. This time, however, the men actually did rape a woman. This passage speaks to the need for God's love in a brutal world. It has no bearing on the question of homosexual orientation for the same reason that the Sodom story is not applicable. Both of these stories condemn ignorance and sexual brutality, but not homosexuality.
Texts 3 and 4 are both in Leviticus and make up a part of the Old Testament Levitical code.
Leviticus 18:22 – “Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable.”
Leviticus 20:13 – “If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.”
The code of rules and behaviors in Leviticus does not apply to Christians. No Christian group I know demands full compliance with this ancient code of behavior. If we did we would have to keep kosher laws. We don’t even demand compliance with the sexual rules in Leviticus. If we did, we would allow polygamy, which is lawful in Leviticus. Unless you are prepared to obey all the rules in Leviticus, you cannot blame the homosexual for not feeling bound to obey them. To point to these two verses and demand selective compliance is ludicrous.
The Old Testament really has nothing specific to say to Christians about homosexuality. We turn now to the New Testament.
Jesus had nothing to say on the subject of homosexuality. His absence of comment does not support or condemn homosexuality. As I’ve noted, the idea of sexual orientation was not a part of human thinking. It’s not surprising that Jesus never addressed what was not an issue.
Paul discusses specific homosexual acts twice. These passages are the only two times homosexual behavior is mentioned in the New Testament.
I Corinthians 6:9 – “Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders”
Male prostitutes and homosexual offenders. Can someone explain to me why we would condemn an entire orientation because of the prohibition of these specific acts?
The Greek words Paul used in this passage include the word for a young, effeminate male prostitute and the word for the older man who paid to have sex with him.
We can acknowledge that the bible condemns prostitution and a system where a younger man makes his living committing sex acts for money with older men. But we cannot condemn homosexuality in general because homosexual prostitution was condemned.
Paul condemns many heterosexual acts in his writings, even in this very verse, yet we do not condemn heterosexuality.
Romans 1:18-29 is the single most important passage dealing with homosexual acts. It is the one most often quoted and it is clearly the closest thing we find to condemnation. Verse 27 is the most specific verse.
I simply ask you to read this entire passage with an open mind. Paul says that those who reject God will be “given over to a shameful lusts”. They will engage in many acts that are not pleasing to God. Men will “burn with lust for one another” (verse 27)
I have seen sexuality perverted and used for evil in many contexts. The faithful and monogamous homosexuals that I know do not burn with lust for other men. They express their sexuality with each other, just as married heterosexuals do.
I don’t know exactly what Paul meant by this passage. I know he was describing people who chose not to worship God and then "burned with lust for other men." I don't know exactly what he meant, but I know this DOES NOT describe the homosexual Christians I know, who love God with great passion and are quietly committed to each other.

Part Four – Conclusion
Those are the 6 passages in the bible that are thought to address the subject of homosexuality. The Old Testament passages amount to nothing and the two New Testament passages are ambiguous at best and highly open to interpretation.
I do not think the bible teaches that every expression of homosexual love is sinful. The scriptural witness on this subject is shaky at best.
Even if you do not buy my claim that we have no right to demand specific explanation of scriptures from homosexuals since we don’t provide similar explanations for the hundreds of passages we blatantly ignore…
Even if you do not agree that the Bible never really addresses the subject of homosexuality as a sexual orientation…
Even if you reject my biblical analysis and decide that the bible is condemning of homosexuals…
Would you at least agree that the passages are ambiguous and open to many interpretations? Would you at least agree that others may responsibly interpret them and not agree with you?
If you could at least acknowledge that scripture is far from clear on this subject, then perhaps you would be willing to err on the side of compassion. Perhaps you would be willing to open your churches to our homosexual brothers and sisters, trusting them to read the bible just as you do, with love and hoping for Grace from God.

 

I personally am not Christian; nor am I homophobic. I believe there are several reasons for this fear among Christians. First, it does specifically say in the Bible that being Gay is wrong. Also, in the Catholic Church, the image many people get when thinking about homosexuality is of priests sexually abusing boys. There has been many a scandal with a gay priest.

 

I cannot personally think of any Christian I know who fears homosexuality. I don't necessarily agree with it, but I certainly do not fear it. You claim that many christians condem those who practice a radical lifestyle, and quite of few of them may. But on the other hand, quite a few of them don't. Any Christian who really tries to live by the book will not pick and choose the scriptures they wish to follow. A true Christian will try to follow all of Christ's teachings and not single out what is most convinent to them. If someone claims to be a Christian and protests homosexuality, but they themselves are caught up in an adulterous relationship, or they lie and steal, then yes, I can see your point about hypocrisy. But not all Christians are the same because not all people are the same. Some people claim they are Christians, but they decide what part of the word they wish to follow and what part they wish to omit. However, some Christians actually try to follow all of the scriptures and lead a lifestyle like that of Christ. You cannot judge a group of people based on the actions of a few.

The most important part of your point was when you said, quote: "I don't think". Implying your own personal interpretation of what it means. You say that homosexually isn't discussed in detail in the bible , but think of like this. Every relationship in the bible is between a man and a woman. Human life is created between a man and a woman. God created Eve for Adam and together they had children. The passage you discredit that discusses a man lying with another man to be sinful, (Leviticus 18:22), seems pretty blunt. If it straight out says that a man lying with another man is detestable to God, then apparently it is.

 

Homosexuality, along with other forms of sexual immorality, is partially responsible for the present AIDS epidemic in the world. This is hardly up for debate, and it is a very serious problem. Sexual Immorality = Death. Just look at Africa if you don't believe it. Those of us who condemn this vigorously are doing so because we care about the continued existence of our civilization - not out of so-called "homophobia." Homophobic is just a stupid psycho-babble term that doesn't describe any real human condition. Besides it is an ignorant word.

"Homo" in Greek means "same"
"Phobia" in Greek means "fear"

So, strictly rendered the word means "Fear of Similarity."
I don't believe that is what you mean when you use the word.

 

The point that God rained fire and brimstone on two cities over the matter most likly has something to do with it.

 

dude thats not the way i am....i disagree with homosexual marriages...so what i have nothing against anyone who is gay,i have a few friends that are gay and they know where i stand on the issue. But when i say im against the marriage .i agree with you not all christians are like i am im not perfect by no means and i dont go around condeming anyone.I just know what the Bible says and try to obey it as much as i can...as a matter of fact if the world keeps going like it is there is gonna be nothing but anarchy in the future first it was about the pledge...One nation under GOD..then prayer in school....then the ten commandments....what the hell?? whats next?? about what you wrote up there ..not all preachers are hippocrites......nor is Christian Coalition the biggest hate group and if by chance it is....i dont guess i need to be in it.. i wasnt raised that way to be raicist.......

I totaly aggre with you ephipahy

 

Bull. I have never met a single Christian intent on following everything the Bible says. When is the last time you took the following passages into account?

"Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourself every girl who has never slept with a man." (Numbers 31:17-18)

"The Lord commands: "... slay old men outright, young men and maidens, little children and women" (Ezechial 9:4-6)

"When the Lord delivers it into your hand, put to the sword all the males .... As for the women, the children, the livestock and everything else in the city, you may take these as plunder for yourselves." (Deuteronomy 20:13-14)

"... Go and smite the inhabitants of Jabesh-gilead with the edge of the sword and; also the women and little ones.... every male and every woman that has lain with a male you shall utterly destroy." (Judges 21:10-12)

"This is what the Lord says: Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have; do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass .... And Saul ... utterly destroyed all the people with the edge of the sword." (1 Samuel 15:3,7-8)

"The people of Samaria must bear their guilt, because they have rebelled against their God. They will fall by the sword; their little ones will be dashed to the ground, their women with child ripped open." (Hosea 13:16)


"A curse on him who is lax in doing the LORD's work!
A curse on him who keeps his sword from bloodshed!" (Jeremiah 48:10)

Christ never once condemned homosexuals, like you do.

The concept of homosexual relationships simply did not exist at the time of the Bible. Homosexual sex, sure, but not homosexual relationships. The idea of sexual orientation is only a couple hundred years old.

Again, look at the verses I posted above. If you've kept your sword from bloodshed, you seem pretty detestable in your god's eyes too.

 

It seems to me like most people with AIDS in Africa are heterosexuals. Yep, the statistics back me up on that one.

Bullshit. You're telling me that you'd stop your campaign of hate if a cure for AIDS was discovered tomorrow? Somehow I doubt it.

What is ignorant is equivocating on the commonly-used definition of words instead of addressing the actual argument. We both know perfectly well what homophobia is, so let's cease these irrelevant linguistics debates.

 

According to the Bible, Sodom and Gomorra were destroyed because the citizens were practicing rape, not because they were homosexuals.

How come your god hasn't rained fire and brimstone on San Francisco or Key West or Amsterdam anytime recently?

 

If right-wing Christian zealots would stop trying to impose their religion on the rest of the country in the first place, then those controversies would not exist.

 

What abour Ruth and her mother-in-law? Her love seemed to be more than a platonic relationship.

 

So I suppose you are the type of person that believes..... "Pluck out thine eye", means to literally pluck your eye out

I did? When did I do this? I used the bible verses you pointed out that said it was destesable in God's eyes, to point out why religious people feel it is wrong. I said that I don't AGREE with it because of what the Bible says. Please show me where I was condemning anyone who practices homosexuality. Apparently it means something if it's mentioned in the bible.

So, you know for a fact that some 2,000 years ago, a man did not have feelings for another man? Were you there? If you honestly don't believe that, then let's look at it like this. Notice the book of Revelation. It is a book of prophecy. Meaning, things that were to happen after it was written. Things of Revelation are happening today. So, if homosexuality was not taking place back then (which I highly doubt that it was not), then the passages that speak against it in the Bible, were prophetically written, knowing that it would happen in the future.

Well, if I oppose something that doesn't agree with the word of God, then technically, I am fighting the Christian fight of faith.

As far as Sodom and Gomorrah.... They were destroyed because of violence AND sexual immorality. 1 Corinthians mentiones that male prostitues and homosexual offenders will not inherit the kingdom of God. If you feel that has no meaning, then why is mentioned in the Bible?

If the Bible says something is wrong, I try not to do it. Obviously, no one is perfect. I have friends with different sexual orientations. I don't agree with it, but I don't fear them as you claim I do.


Thanks again, IcE-MaN