take a look at this

http://irregulartimes.com/dead.html
please let the page load. if you still think that Amerika is doing the right thing by being over there after seeing these, then you are more ignorant then I could ever imagine. These images have been burned into my mind, and i got tears in my eyes looking at them. my god....


here is one, no pictures tho: http://www.iraqbodycount.net/

 

here are some pictures..




just what the hell did these people do?

 

what i dont get is how we can go over there and kill all these people but then they do it once to us (9/11) and theyre just a bunch of devils and evil-doers (mind you when i say once i mean that we freaked out about it and are still making movies about it)

 

If these pictures were of kurds killed in Saddam's Anfal campaign, would you care? Would the antiwar and islamist sites that post them everywhere be interested?

If these pictures were of French civilians killed in the bombing prior to the D-Day invasion, would you ask why we were "liberating" Europe?

 

well it is not pictures of those, these are pictures of innocent Iraqi civilians killed by your homeboys, the Amerikan troops, who HAVE to be there because they HAVE to put in a government that was determined by Amerika to be the best govt for the Iraqis.

 

You completely avoided all of my questions. I guess you weren't comfortable with the answers.

 

haha oops didnt see the question marks. Yes I would care if these were Kurds killed in Saddam's campaign, but if this war was to get Saddam out to bring peace to the Iraqis, then I probably wouldn't be as much against this war as I am now. The war was first started to get Osama, then it was to get those oh-so-elusive WMD's, and since there are none it's Bush's job to "liberate" the Iraqi people. Well look at those pictures, quite the liberator.

The U.S was attacked by Germany in World War 2, maybe not directly attacked but Germany backed Japan. It has been found that the Iraqi government did not back Al-Queda

 

You originally came in here saying "look - dead civilians! if you think America is doing the right thing you are more ignorant than I could ever imagine".

Now you are admitting that civilian casualties happen in war and sometimes they are justified.

So what's wrong with thinking that taking out Saddam - who killed about 100,000 Kurds in a single year - was worth a few thousand civilian casualties?

 

The age old dodge from the warmonger camp. Our destruction of civilians is merely understandable "collateral damage", but those whom we choose to attack, well now, THEIR civilian casualties (in time of a known war no less) are not only genocide but indeed grounds for us to launch our own attack on them. Your hypocrisy and evasion of the moral duplicities involved, PB, certainly do outstrip any criticism you have brought against our fellow poster here.

Your what if's, as he rightly pointed out, are a bogus evasion of the facts on the ground HERE and NOW and in THIS conflict, which was indeed based on lies and political malfeasance of the highest order.

Of course, you couldnt care less so long as its good ol boy Republicans leading the charge and turning US foreign policy into a one stop corruption shop for the further profiteering of their MIC and energy sector pals.

You show yourself to be more willfully blind and morally twisted with each passing day.

 

Pointbreak, how would the Americans react if those were American children?? If that was a little American girl with blonde hair and blue eyes, and her father carrying her out of the rubble. Or a little 5 year old American boy screaming in pain from the burns, and he doesnt understand why!! Put yourself in a compassionate view and imagine your child, cousin, or neice as a victim. Then imagine the other country full of people who dont give a care, and are so hypocritical.

It is not okay, or something that should be waived off. I dont care who killed innocent people, whether it be Saddam or Bush. The point is that these children had experience suffering, and brutality unjustly. Their lives, and their families lives will be forever pained by this war.

 

What is in dispute here is not whether the death of innocent children is a tragedy. What I am disputing is whether the fact that there have been innocent civilian casualties is in and of itself sufficient to prove that the US invasion of Iraq was wrong.

I merely pointed out that we could never have liberated Europe if this logic held true. Similarly, something which may be approaching genocide is happening in the Sudan right now. If we were to intervene to stop it with military force, it is almost certain that some innocents would be killed. So is the moral choice to stand by and let genocide happen, as we did in Rwanda, for fear that one of our bombs might miss its target and kill civilians?

 

And once again you cannot compare the pre-emptive invasion of Iraq (for which an entire roster of duplicitous claims have been revealed sufficient to condemn it) to WWII.

WWII was the effort to stop a nation which was conducting the very self justified expansionistic war of aggression which we have assumed unto ourselves under this Bush admin. It is WE who disregarded international law just as Nazi Germany did in its day.

So, if you had any intellectual honesty (which we have long seen you do not) you would have the integrity to admit that we have acted out of the principle of might makes right once again as we did with Grenada, Panama, Vietnam, Laos, Cambodia and by proxy in Honduras, Nicaragua, etc.

Our militancy will be our own undoing in the end.

 

Pointbutt, isn't there some RepuliBush rally you need to be attending?

You totally miss the point -- as do most Repubs in here. We DID NOT go to war to liberate Iraq. We were TOLD that our reason for going to war was because:

- Iraq had WMD's (LIE)

- Iraq was linked to Al Qaeda (LIE)

- Iraq/Suddam was a threat to the U.S.A. (LIE)

And now, because these reasons have turned out to be lies, your beloved President and his cronies are throwing out other reasons to back up their love of war and human slaughter -- Because it is our duty to liberate other countries, free them from their pain and dictatorial oppressors. FUCKING BULLSHIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And who loses???? We ALL do. We slaughter the citizens in order to shove our democratic fervor down their throats. We blow children up and call them collateral damage. And we breed martyrs in the process. Families, cititzens, extremists, will remember when we bombed their homes, killed their children, parents, family and those remaining will seek revenge on the U.S. through terrorism. And the cycle continues. All in the name of BUSH. He has the blood on his hands. And everyone who casts a vote for him in November.

 

The reasons they gave, all bogus, indeed!

IF they had WMD's- which I don't know anything about except, if they did, they were gained during the Reagan presidency, to further the interest of the USA, somewhere down the line. (here we are at the end of the line)

Iraq being linked to Al Qaeda is irrelevant, since it's looking more and more like the 9/11 tragedy was orchestrated by the USA, to further it's own ends. As well the Oklahoma bombing, too.

Iraq/Saddam was a pawn of the USA, later translated as "scapegoat."

As far as the cruelty he exercised upon his own people, I do believe that truly occurred, but how did it compare to this?!?!?! Besides, as has been mentioned, that was not the goal of the invasion.

All this bullshit about 'the war on terrorism' is the final big weapon of 'mass distraction', designed to make the land of the free into the world's worst prison camp, overnight. The terrorists live in DC, not the middle east.

As Bob Dylan said, "Sometimes Satan comes as a man of peace."

 

It is WE who disregarded international law just as Nazi Germany did in its day
Yes, I remember reading in my history books about the Nazi war machine taking over Poland and them giving it back to Polish people. Letting them vote for their leaders..
Are you saying that none of the US military actions over the last 25 years ever resulted in a better aftermath?
You don't think that for Iraq, life will be better for the children. Since they were being lost at 50 thousand kids a year..

 

Actually yes, Vietnam.

 

Ok these pictures as horrible as they are were obtained from Al-Jazeera, no? This leads me to think that maybe these are pictures of an aftermath of a terrorist attack (or insurgent liberatoin action) that was presented as American burtaility.

 

American brutality is the true terrorism! And yes, these people are actually victims of such an 'insurgent liberation action'--also known as the War in Iraq.

Pretty good deductions.

 

All war is sick...and there arn't any rules...Those pictures could be reproduced in any area of the world where there is conflict.....

Fancy living in the Sudan right now ? Try it...Muslims are doing far worse out there right now....if there can be worse..

BOSNIA,
CROATIA,
NORTH KOREA,
the list is endless.....

This is not normal to you, and why not..? because you lived in a society that has made these thing HISTORY...you are the VOTING person that keeps it out.....

That is what WE are fighting for...The freedom of these people to live with those pictures as an abhorent act that should not happen just as you see it now........

But they do not have the luxury to choose or vote....OK, so we may be treading on cultures with hob nailed boots, but untill you and I start asking our leaders to tread lighter, and demand our warmongers to learn just how to do it a little better...You can do one of two things....Let them alone to kill, torture, commit genocide among themselves, or take all we have at the moment to go in there and sort it out...AND TRY TO STOP IT....

So what do you want ?

 

You must understand that in the long run more lives are being saved by this war than are being ended.