Kangaroos kick Brit butts

what you said, clearly was in no way comparible with the racism you describe, yet the english are a race, by definition, a race can also be used to a nation state. and you discriminated and stereotyped people who were born to a country, i just don't think that is very acceptable in modern standards, i am english and I would never say such a thing.

 

yeah looks like i would

i am welsh, and very aware of the "sheepshagger" thing, which lets put it this way is "culturally insulting" because it insults an entire culture, state and group of people..(whatever floats your boat )

and i'll think you'll find (as the other welsh people on this post) that the sheepshagger comment is very insulting

 

hmm good one showmet

common history? yes
Eisteddfod
International Eisteddfod
Welsh Historical overview
inderpendant language? yes
Welsh Language Board

nationality? yes
Nationality

geographic distribution? yes
genealogical line? yes
considered as a group? yes


well i guess that makes the welsh a race...

 

I don't personally think that anything anyone says to me about being Welsh is insulting especially not sheepshagger. I think that if you hear it enough you end up just shrugging it off and stuff.

The Welsh are a race! We are a different country! We have our own language! we are people! We have our own government! Being Welsh is a race, nation and a culture!

 

exactely, and therfore stereotyping all of these becomes racist
Michael x

 

Also!!! Just to point out! That Wales played the All Blacks yeah? Now get me if I'm wrong the All Blacks are New Zealand. I don't think that New Zealanders would take being called Aussies nicely!!!

 

This is the thing I dont understand. On the cenus, application forms etc, you can put that your Welsh, you can put that your Scottish, and you can put that your Irish. But can you say your English? No, we have to be 'British'. I'm English damnit!

 

theres a little thing called "other" and you can fill it in below

that is ofcourse, if its not on the form already

 

i have a few feelings on the welsh government...hmm...

 

That's quite a loose definition of race I think, and the categories become broader the lower ranked they are there. For example, 'humans considered as a group' could mean anything. Women aren't a race, but they are a group of humans. Feminists, equally, aren't a race of women, but they are a group of women. I would accept number 1 there as a valid definition of race, but the other three, sociologically speaking, apply more to ethnicity. The two are very often confused, and I think a closer examination of the terms are necessary than a dictionary would give. Dictionaries are not gospel, and these are not neutral, but value laden terms.

For the purposes of this debate, I would say, if it is possible to genetically distinguish the Welsh from the rest of the white British population, then I'd say they constituted a race. If not, then Welsh constitutes an ethnic identity, based on nationality, language and culture. Race denotes physical characteristics, ethnicity the social, cultural, linguistic and religious elements, which are often, but not always, attached to race.

Either way, I can see why a Welsh person might be offended by the term 'sheep shagger'. I can also see why they might find it funny and take it in their stride. Horses for courses, sheep for pastures and all that. It's a matter of personal taste as much as anything else....

 

Fuck's sake. One is a race and the other is a nationality. If you think nationality and race are the same thing then you're not reading the dictionary. Race doesn't care who a person is, just what they look like. Nationality is where they come from. You wouldn't say northerners are a race but people take the piss out of them in the same way they do the welsh - there's no difference. AND by the way - Wales may have its own language (which fewer and fewer people are speaking these days) but it's technically not a country - it's a principality. Not that that makes any difference of course. Now if you're not happy with national stereotyping banter then that's your choice. But I resent it being called racism. I think you lot need to develop some thicker skin. I happen to know for a fact that the Welsh have plenty of things to say about everybody else as well. Being irish i know ALL about national stereotypes. If you get all worked up about such a little thing then bloody hell, you might as well kill yourselves now as you're not going to enjoy life.

All this fuss about a slight jibe relating to the six nations. Blimey - and I bet that despite being welsh all those people who made a fuss probably don't even LIKE rugby.

 

firstly welsh language rates are going up massively in the last 10 years, the only reason it went down was because the english once out lawed it, as they did with the scottish...

and the welsh are part of the celtic nations

anyway, i still dont appreciate the term...

 

Ah i think being an Aussie i would know who the All Blacks are. I was refering to the game we (the Wallabies ) played against france in th league not union.

But, i have heard us Aussies and Kiwis called sheep shaggers (althought there are more sheep in NZ) Who gives a rats, if you want to be that senstive then go ahead but it's usually said as a joke and is taken that way. Plus, we give as good as we get.

 

Whilst largely I agree with your differenciation between race and nationality, it is worth noting that Wales is a country, in the same way that Scotland, England are America are countries. It is not, however, a nation state, which is the source of political sovereignty....

 

well far aside from any debate

the "sheepshagger" comment has offended the welsh people who have posted here...

so next time you visit wales...try avoiding that phrase

 

I'm glad SOMEONE here sees the point I'm trying to make. And I'm also glad it's you. I'd really like to try and patch things up a bit because I've absolutely NO idea what your stance is any more, but we can leave that to another conversation.

Incidentally I've never heard Aussies called sheepshaggers, only the Kiwis. And it's simply because New Zealand lamb and Welsh lamb is the best there is, that's all.

 

Well my boy this simply shows how loose the term actually is, and that you could according to this dictionary definition quite properly refer to "the female race"

 

*cough*

race
n.

1. A local geographic or global human population distinguished as a more or less distinct group by genetically transmitted physical characteristics.
2. A group of people united or classified together on the basis of common history, nationality, or geographic distribution: the German race.
3. A genealogical line; a lineage.
4. Humans considered as a group.

It's so annoying when people can't even speak their own language adequately

 

*cough cough*

the word you want to look up is not race but racism.

 

Beth Sy'n Digwydd I'r Fuwch!