Jesus Christ was a cult leader

Jesus Christ would be an enemy of the church today (the institution, not the physical body holy temple). He would not be labeled a "Christian", he would be called a "wacko". He would be again be crucified in a modern fashion.

We have not come very far in the Way, heresy is no longer a policitally correct term, but the idea is still embraced with vigor by the self-righteous as applying to the truly righteous.

 

I wouldn't say he was a cult leader. I think that the time (if the man existed - he couldn't whether he was SOG or not) he was just telling people about his idea of the best way of life. It's other people who made it into a cult.

I have a t-shirt like your siggy. It was a birthday pressy.

 

Yeah, I agree with you 100%. I just wanted to spark a lively debate, but oh well. I did get my wish on another forum, got a very interesting argument going about the roman church vs. the ways of Jesus.

I drew that hourglass on my computer. The neat part is, and you can't tell here, is that the glass part is transparent.

 

There's no doubt they oppose each other. Spirit is the opposite of material. So you can be a earthbound spirit clinging to materialism, or you can be an aspiring spirit working toward releasing material ties upon your soul. The latter is a much harder route to take, but at least it pays off, in real dividends!

 

lol. That's a noble assumption...

I really wish someone would tell these lousy ethiopian kids to quit being such damned whiney materialists. Food and shelter will not bring them happiness. When will they all learn?

 

Now there is a fine line we tread between lofty spiritual aspirations and meeting the basic needs for survival.

Although those of us who have never wondered where our next meal was coming from would do well to experience a little temporary starvational hardship. It sure puts things in perspective, and if you're finicky, it puts an end to that, too!

 

I also couldn't agree more! The people who would shun Jesus' teachings the most (IMO) would be the majority of the people who identify themselves as 'christian,' particularly the 'religious' hierarchies, whom I prefer to call neo-pharisees!
http://www.religioustolerance.org
http://freechristians.com/Site_Contents.htm
http://www.goodnewsinc.org
http://www.americanunitarian.org

 

I no longer like to use the word "christian" because most of the ones who apply that label to themselves actually have no idea of what aspiring toward the spirit of Christ actually means and requires. It pretty much represents the opposite end of the spectrum, the way I see it.

religion----------------------atheism------------------------enlightenment

 

Um... interesting... quite an extreme view point don't you think? A little angry at the church are we?

 

Actually, no, I'm not angry with anyone. I try my best not to get angry.

Anyway, it didn't come off the way I intended it to. I didn’t mean to be so extreme, just understandable, I guess. I can be pretty blunt.



To clarify, I don’t like to use that term anymore, about myself or others, because I’m not sure what that word might mean to each person that hears it, anymore. What it means to me, to emulate Jesus Christ, is much removed from what is demonstrated by the visible, mainstream ‘Christians’ who currently represent that word. I’m including from the community to the national level. There’s a lot of politics and commercialism in organized religion these days, and I’m not about that, and I’m certain that Jesus wasn’t about that, either. At all.



Remember the money changers?



What about the motive behind those who wanted his crucifixion?



How did politics and commercialism manifest in Jesus’ life and teachings?



That’s why I said what I did. I’ve got no hard feelings, just my own ideas about christians (who go to church each week) vs. Christ(-conscious corporal temples who live in their church)ians. I try to eliminate the confusion by not using the word christian at all.

 

Okay, I promise I'm not trying to stir anything up here, but on the other hand don't mind if I do... I think Jesus was schizophrenic. I don't believe in miracles I'm afraid but I do believe in magic - I don't think it's impossible - quantum physics has space for all kinds of magical things to go on, possibly even on a macro level, at the very least things like psychic communication, but that's beside the point. The only reason the church thinks jesus was not insane (and don't get me wrong, I know schizophrenia is merely a label because I suffer from it) is because they seem to think that insane people are somehow evil. Honestly! I've seen the video they show at the alpha course which is an introduction to anglican Christianity, and they think it's impossible for someone who is insane to say honest and true things about what's wrong with the world. The only problem insane people have (those that get caught anyway) is that they don't know when to hold their tongue and not say what they honestly think. Or that's my main problem anyway. eg... (and now for something completely different maybe evil in many of your opinions)

Does anyone else think the 9/11 attacks were justifiable. Not right necessarily but justifiable. Here is a country (Afghanistan) that suffers from starvation, and death due to a lack of clean water. Meanwhile, while our stockbrockers and multinationals continue to hold them to ransom our (the west) biggest growing problem is obesity :0/ While 30,000 people a day die from lack of basics in the third world, our media is still talking about a mere 6000 (I know it doesn't make it easier if you knew any of them and I'm sorry if you did) who died in a protest, a vicious protest but a protest at the lack of equality in the world. Now is (or rather then was) a time to react with sympathy and love (which, as any simpleton can tell you, breeds love), for these poor minnows who are dying but instead we go out and kill even more of them. Far more than they ever killed on 9/11. And that's just the military deaths. I can't say I like those terrorists ideas about individuals being collatoral damage in sight of a larger goal but if your friends and family, and you were dying as a result of ridiculous, overpowering greed, wouldn't you want to do something about it. And if diplomatic pleas didn't work (30,000 people a day remember) wouldn't you want to do something drastic to bring attention to it? Sorry but that's how I feel. Let's see if they lock me up for it...

 

What is the point? What is your reason behind this theory? Jesus didn't smoke cigarettes, that's my argument against schizophrenia. Also, the environmental contributing factors were not present, not to mention the fact that his parents were considered sound stock for the production of a savior.

I don't know this, either, but no one has ever suggested I am insane, just 'brutally honest'.

You're sure of this?

You might have the start of some sort of argument, if it was truly the Afghans who killed the victims of 9/11. As well, please realize, it is not the people in the middle east being held for ransom by the wealthy and elite of this country or the multinational elite. It is you and I, my friend! The enemy is much closer than you realize, and still you let him sleep with you!

We are all victims of ridiculous, overpowering greed! The terrorists salute old Glory! You must open your eyes!

Why would they lock you up? You're doing just as they want you to! You're at the forefront of the propoganda parade! Don't forget to march!

 

Christianity became far removed from Jesus' original brand of Christianity long before even commercialism came about. It didn't even become popular until it was infused with Hellenistic/Platonic theory during the Roman era, and split into a myriad different variations ("mainstream," Gnostics...). Had Jesus hypothetically only returned a few centuries after the founding of his religion, he wouldn't have understood what happened.

 

Yes!!!

The whole point of my initial statement! Of course, you knew that.

One thing I disagree with is the part about 'long before even commercialism' came about. That's true, in respect to the specific definition we associate with commercialism today. That term didn't come of age until after the television invaded life. But commercialism is a off-shoot or product of greed. And greed was definitely around at the time of Jesus, else he would have died of old age!

Greed is not just about material wealth. Greed is 'wanting more than you need', which makes it a term applicable in all material classifications, wealth, power, sex, you name it. If it's of a physical manifestation, it has inspired greed already in some speck of humanity.

But that's splitting hairs, I guess.

Funny thing about modern society. We call traditional botanical health remedies 'alternative' medicine. We call pure, unchanged, spiritual direction which came right from the source, 'new age' and unilaterally condemn anything not considered 'fundamental' or 'orthodox', which is what we have labelled our versions meant also as 'spiritual direction'. Man's versions are just that, his preferred redesign for the truth, which is barbarian and severe, but somehow more comfortable to accept than the light yoke of Jesus.

In general, we are fools! Maybe not every last person, but overall, a foolish nation, with the rest of the world running a close 2nd.

 

I'm angry at the church too.

Athiest. It is what I am, and will always be.

My logic prevents me from believing in any kind of religion.

 

Who else is angry?

So does mine. 'Religion' is not 'G-d'. Religion is of the world, of man. Is that why you don't believe in a G-d? Because you don't believe in religion?

If that was the criteria, I would be an atheist, too. But a dislike for the dogma and doctrine of mortals contrived to be of 'G-d' doesn't have to lead you to atheism, rather you could begin a quest for the truth with logic and reason at the helm which leads to the realization of the truth of G-d inside each person. You've got an excellent head start without realizing it, since you put no stock in the fairytales of man.

It just depends on what your heart desires to do to solve a discrepancy.
Write it all off as rubbish? or rewrite it according to its original intention?

 

I like to think that if the Jesus legend was hypothetically true, Jesus is too scared to come back because of all the evangelical fanatics out there. I'd be scared if I came back to life two millennia later to find a crowd of puritanical crazies going nuts over me.

 

Jesus wasn’t scared of shit. And he wouldn’t be scared to land in this minute right here.

Hypothetically or possibly, regardless, Jesus is the Word that personifies love, wisdom, and faith.

Faith=fearlessness

better be afraid of Him, the way I see it.

Sounds like the same crowd giving the bon voyage party known as the ‘crucifixion’.

 

Okay, who says cigarrettes cause schizophrenia? I've never heard of this theory and, like I said, I am schizophrenic. They tell me I mustn't smoke weed but cigarettes as far as I know are fine. Maybe that's a conspiracy by the tobacco multi-nationals. Me no know, but Jesus was obviously pretty upset with his environment, is that not true? Apart from the bollocks we have to go through to maintain an existence in everyday life what are the environmental factors that cause schizophrenia?

As for me and you being the worst off victims of multi-national greed... I thought I was the crazy one! They pay their taxes in our countries and this goes to support our countries. That's why our governments like them. That's the problem with national democracies, it's that they think (and I think they may be right when I consider your opinions) we don't care about the welfare of other countries. They are there to protect our interests alone, and we want to be rich.


The reason I think Jesus was schizophrenic was because I have been psychotic and in the lead up to it I truly believed I was in touch with a greater power. If I hadn't heard of anyone else going through the same kinda thing (and I considered both the story of Jesus and my vague knowledge of schizophrenics at the time) maybe I would have believed I was the son of god or somehow superior to all these wankers who go about their lives never thinking of anything more than how to get the next buck. It is a fact that, if ANYONE, even Jesus himself, came into the world at this juncture claiming to be the son of god, he would be reviled by christians, ignored by the public and possibly locked up by the psychiatric profession. How do you know that guy at Waco wasn't the reincarnation of Jesus? He had convinced quite a few people he was worth following and was then killed for it. Along with many of his followers.

 

Check out this article:
http://www.rense.com/general54/lies.htm