So here's a crazy idea that I think might be wonderfull. The way I see it, we've got two choices. We can push everything into having a centralised national again this year, and do our best to get on site. Or we can go exactly in the oposite direction. Do exactly what they ask us to. My vission is a summer of tightly interwoven regionals, all accross the country. 10's of thousands of people. If we split up into groups of under 75, that would pretty well blanket the country. So in fact, more people could get involved, because they wouldn't have to travel as far. Whatever local family could find a space to host. Massive migrations of people accross the country. Impossible to track and therefor dificult to effectively disrupt. The main problem would be networking. Having trusted family check out all broadcast sites for decoys, and making sure that people know about the good sites. I think that we could do it. Everywhere we go, we spread the story about how we were going to have a centralised national gathering, but now it's against the law and they won't let us on site. If we respond to this correctly, we can gain massive amounts of momentum from it. This is a long term solution. We need to respond to the fact that we're being targetted for destruction in a more effective manner than sticking to tradition and responding to the crises as they occur. I think that rainbow should be moving in the direction of smaller, tighter, harder to track and destroy, gatherings, all over the place. Swarm strategy. I'm considering broadcasting this call widely. What do you all think?
The leos didn't count the number of folks on the site to make sure that there were more then 75. They issued tickets anyway. Ever wonder why the number allowed is 75? They are thinking about crowd control. You can bully and intimidate a small crowd. Once the crowd numbers in the thousands, it's a lot harder to push those people around.
They can bully and intimidate anyone that they can catch. But are they going to go around bullying every group of campers in the National Forests this summer? They'll piss off a lot of people that way. We'll get less problems if we stop giving them a big target to hit.
THIS IS RIDICULOUS, WE ARE A FAMILY, WE ARE NOT GOING TO SUBMIT TO THE ILLEGAL FOREST SERVICE NO WAY, NO HOW, They're lying through their teeth, and we have proven it, GET THE MEDIA INVOLVED, NOW! PEACE & BLESSINGS lindasafley@hotmail.com
There are already alot of regionals. Going underground is only for people who have already been beaten. The National is necessary. We need to show the rest of the world just how many of us there really are. This keeps us strong.
OK, so what is our response? It's been 8 years now since they started preasuring us for permits. Still all we do is exactly what we've done all along, and every year it gets worse. A changing world should not be responded to with rigidity. You guys don't like my idea. That's fine. But let's hear some long term suggestions about what to do about this. Even if we get a gathering this year. Even if we do it unpermitted and everything's OK this year, it's just getting worse. One crisis to another, and we're completely predictable.
long term solution is simply this, we are in the right, they are in the wrong, we continue doing as were doing, taking each & every case to curt, never admit any wrongdoing, push till the supreme cort finaly recognizes our right to be heard. every single ticket should be fought on that level (camping without permit tickets & simular) imagine if this year 1000 people were icketed & 1000 cases were sent to the supreme court..sure they could still refuse to hear the case, but for how long? people woud notice 1000 1st ammendment rights cases being ignored..but when its 3-4 who notices? i',m not advocating going out of the way to get ticketed..just keep the gathering in its natural pure state..let the harrassers come, in the end jstice will win out besides, 1 of the things i love at the gatherings is seeingall my family..all in 1 spot..i dont want to wonder if someone i miss terribluy is 1 state away or 3 or 5 or 17.. its hard enough to makre it to 1 gathering, let alone have to run from 1 to another all over the country to see everyone you want to see
I totally agree, but this thing could go in different directions. What would be wrong with approaching some Indian reservations IF ALL ELSE FAILS?
I would have to say that I hear what everyones saying, but I totally agree with David... this isn't about who's right and who's wrong...but about focusing on the moment, and living accordingly... To truly live effectively one must realize that every moment is the movie...this is the gathering right now, shit-we're havin an internet gathering... ha, well moving on... I can not possibly see the harm in stayin' put wherever you are, having the ability to be completely satisfied in where you are is an amazing feat that few people learn to achieve... this means not NEEDING to go somewhere just to feel satisfied as if you can't live effectively unless 15,000 people are there too... hell, let's just claim all of north and south america as Indigenous land and Nationals is about a spirit found in this time and in this place EVERYTHING simultaneously... I know it can be fun to find all your kids, meet up with old family, and find new...but it does seem like an insistance on this method is an insistance that we become a larger and larger targer to hit.... who wants rainbow gatherings to turn into a 'burning man'-type idea to those who do not know or have never attending a counsel or a gathering?... no one.... and I fear that people only see Nat'ls as a party... thats not the rainbow I know, or hope for... This is a time for meditation, and action...This country of ours is in a sad state and hope is here, we can be that hope...and I dont see how buying gas and driving 3 days reflects our intentions(now hitchhikin I cant argue with =) hehe)... but I suppose thats all I have for now... gather where you ARE, not where you think you should be, or where you think family is, hOMe is in the heart... and thats right, FAMILY IS... its singular, its present tense, it exists in the moment where youre reading this post now...look up and start loving NOW Lovin'light Adam
well put adam, & thank you for those words, however i still will disagre on 1 point, our strength is our ability to come together..to gather peacefuly as awhole, & grow as a family & a nation, & how can we do that if we don't have 1 united council? if we are split up into many gatherings with many councils some may decide its ok to sign permits while others decide it isnt, how would that help our cause if we are devided? the next step would be allowing the permited gatherings, but only if they sell tickets through ticketron & are sponsored by pepsi? and all the non permit gsatherers get arressted? this year proves the more we are devided, the easier they can push us around & force us to do ads they say if we gather in many locations we lose the benifit of the knowledge of those with experience.. so you call a gathering on a certain mountain, & 200 show up, but every one is a first timer with no clue how to gather, theres no kitchen no calm no main suply or bank or anyone to talk to the local merchants or make sure theres safe drinking water, & what you end up with is 200 clueless kids starving in the woods.. gatherings simply wont work without all the peices, the scouts, the people who run kitchens, dig shitters build bridges, know how to talk to fs & locals, those who like to council on the everyday issues, its all a part of the whjole, & by splitting into 20-50-1090 small gatherings you risk no having all the peices you need to make it happen, be safe, & hgealthy. we only have so many who do calm, so what if they all went to 1 state, & there were only 20 thtre to treat, & another state gets 5,000 but has no medical support at all? i think the solurion you seek is to make every day a gathering, where you are, keep the light alive in your hearts, but never sacrifice our ability to come together as 1, all in 1 place ..if we willingly give up that right to be together freely, we allow them to win.. i bewleive we are having these problems this year because many on site arent the usual seed camp group who know how to deal with these situations, sop are easily intimidated & pushed around.. if we split up into many groups that will only make it worse,
I hear you brother and thank you for your insight, your words are concerns that are necessary for a safe 'n healthy gathering...and yes the freedom, ability, and choice to unite as one is also a necessary one... these are first amendment rights that theyre attempting to ticket us for and, as much as I disassociate myself with the perceived government of this land's people, as far as I know people don't generally mess around with attempts at breaking those freedoms...I mean hell, apparently some of our countries men are across the atlantic dying in the name of 'Freedom' and we're simply attempting to live it... All Loving Light Adam
I understand all of the arguments for having national gatherings. But there are two massive holes in what you are saying, soaring eagle. 1) It is not logistically impossible to have lots of small gatherings all over the place at the same time. It's just more difficult to coordinate. In fact, a lot of our logistical problems come from being so concentrated. 2) What you are saying still amounts to plodding ahead doing exactly what we're doing. And it isn't working. It's like a python. Every time we exhale, the coils wrap tighter, and we can't inhale as much. The situation gets a little tighter every year. The idea that this is happening because the regulars showed up late because it's on the east coast doesn't work. Nothing like this happened in Penn in '99. But that was 6 years ago. And a lot changes in 6 years. So if we continue doing nationals, we still need a discussion of how we are going to respond, in the long term, to the campain to destroy us. A discussion that is lacking right now.
