Angry Omnis....

i am not coming here adn complaining that people are veggies! i am complaining because they are PUTTING DOWN omnis! thats why! is that so hard to understand?You are not moral because you kill less animals than i do to survive! the way you live kills animals too. So we are both equally "immoral."

I have no clue what your concentration camp analogy is supposed to mean. Though, i think your reading comprehension has failed you again. I did not say grew up on a farm..i said grow your own farm! You know, some people, my family included, have a garden and grow some of our own vegetables during the summer.

Yes you do have animals killed in order to satisfy your own personal tastes! The animals you kill just rot and are incinerated. The ones that are killed for me are eaten.

Seriously, if you're not going to add anything new and just continue to call me immoral and not recognize that you yourself are just as immoral then there is no point in continuing this.

 

It's a veggie forum, dude. We are of the opinion that vegetarianism is a preferable lifestyle option to that of a meat-eater. If you don't like that opinion or the arguments surrounding it, then don't come to a veggie forum if you don't want to hear it. Simple.

OK, let's try and simplify this. Say you lived in Nazi Germany and had the choice between eating Jews or eating vegetables. Say that some Jews were worked to death in the fields. Would you consider it preferable to eat Jews or to eat vegetables?

Thank you. Your continued use of personal insults just serves to illustrate your confrontational attitude. Please, throw some more.

I don't have enough money to buy a farm. I don't have a garden. Next suggestion, please.

No I don't. I need to eat something in order to live, and so I choose the path that produces the least suffering. Meat is an option, and not something that you require. So it's a choice. You're choosing to kill to satisfy your taste for meat. I don't have a taste for vegetables, I have a requirement for vegetables. Given the option of purchasing vegetables that guaranteed that no animals had been killed during their production, then that's what I'd buy.

I didn't call you immoral. I called your lifestyle immoral. If you refuse to accept that supporting the deliberate slaughter of living creatures in order to satisfy your personal taste is somehow on a footing with eating the fruits of the earth, then indeed there's little point to the discussion.

 

This says it all. you have lost your marbles

 

No, it's just that you've lost your ability to understand an analogy or respect the opinions of others.

 

What it really has to do with is the fact that vegans and veggies get self-righteous about their lifestyle. So this response that you attribute to so-called omnis is not unlike the type of response that one gives to people such as JWs and Moromons, to name but a few other well known self-righteous types. Simply put, no one likes being preached at. There are a whole host of things that I find other people can't justify, but I don't go around hounding these people about their lifestyle; why can't you do the same?

 

No, actually, it is a very stupid analogy, and somenody pointing out that to make such an argument constitutes your having lost your "marbles" is certainly not a lack of respect for your opinions.

 

But that's exaclty it. I don't push my opinions on anyone. I never raise vegetariansim in conversation, and only talk about it when someone asks me.

This is a forum for veggies. When I post here, it's to talk to other veggies. If, as a meat-eater, you want to come here and challenge us on our behaviour/lifestyle, then you can't really complain when we explain our point of view. If you don't like it, then there's a really simple alternative - be somewhere else!

 

Interesting. I was always under the impression that resorting to personal abuse was a true sign of stupidity.

If you think it's a bad analogy, then an intelligent person might attempt to point out why they think this is the case, rather than hurling insults. Clearly I haven't 'lost my marbles' since I maintain healthy social relationships and hold down a demanding and intellectually challenging job. So you'll really need to justify this accusation a little further.

 

"This forum is for vegetarians, vegans, and those interested in learning more about the vegetarian lifestyle"


I for one would prefer to have the usual flames about creul omnis and pompous veges exported to a special 'flame' forum so the rest of us can get onto discussing something new and substantive. (Ditto the main thread in the womens issues forum.) Need a moderator for the purpose... I'm available.

 

The theories about guilt and stuff might be right, but I think another reason is that a lot of people know vegans only as people who think they're better than others, who constantly try to convince them of becoming vegan too, who can't seem to talk about anythink not related to veganism in any way AND who, if the omni people complain about this "missionary" behaviour will answer "You're just feeling guilty."

 

Umm. That's because you only know some-one is vegan/vege if they talk about it. The majority are probably 'in the closet' from all the boring conversations omnis start if you mention it. Like they think its a personal attack on their ethics if you so much as mention being vege. Almost none of my colleagues/acquaintences even know I am vege.

 

Very true. Nobody off-line would even know I was veggie unless they asked me. The same goes for my veggie and vegan friends. And yet somehow it's always us who are classed as preachy, yet we're not the ones seeking out omni forums to go post our opinions in.

 

I have to say I agree with DoktorAtomik- if you don't want to hear the vegetarian/vegan argument- don't come to the forum! It does specifiy who the forum is for. If I don't like or agree with something, I don't visit the forum- I wouldn't visit a forum linked with the BNP (British National Party) etc. If we came into a forum labelled "omnivorous forum" or something to that effect, then I would expect to be told that an omni diet was good.
Summer. xx.

 

Wasn't a veggie that started this thread to begin with? Wasn't it originally intended to bash omni's? How is that cool?

kayatree

 

The pseudo-psychological theory (on guilt) in the beginning of the thread was funny.

I don't need to justify meat eating anyway. It just is. I like a juicy steak, it taste good and it's nutritional.
I'm not a hypocrite and I don't feel guilty when i kill the food on legs myself. For example, there is nothing more normal than bleeding a pig. It's part of making food.

Comparing normal meat eating to cannibalism is so dumb. The frontier between them is razor sharp. Cannibalism is eating one's own species. I never heard of carnivores like lions eating each other, but (of course) they will eat other animals. Predators don't kill each other for food. There is no comparison. Doing so is veggie rationalizing.

Anyway there's no problem with either veganism or not. Nothing is more or less healthy. Just as long as you feed your body the right chemicals it doesn't care about the source. Hell, even pills alone could do the job.
There are bad omni diets as much as there are bad vegans diets. It's just a matter of choosing the best ingredients and cooking them well.

Fact is that some people are creating problems out of thin air. We're (usually) on top of the food chain, the rest is just personal choice.

 

I do believe that meat-eating is absolutely morally disgusting, but I also accept that some vegetarians are too preachy about the issue. Frankly, if I thought preaching would save the life of one more animal, then I'd be all for it. But I think it's counterproductive in many instances. I've found that I 'convert' more people to vegetarianism by waiting for them to ask me about it rather than trying to evangelise them.

I also don't judge people for eating meat.
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I agree with you completely. I don't go around advertising I'm vegan. But it's hard to keep it a secret when I go out to eat or have friends over for for a meal or vice versa. I only let people know my stance on the whole thing if they ask me. And when I am asked I don't hold back. But I certainly don't judge them or preach to them about their ways being bad either, as preaching does tend to fall on def ears, and sadly it is our majorities way of life to eat meat. I merely explain my love for animals and state the facts of a meateating diet to them. I have found that this approach opens more minds than gettin' in a huff and trying to offend their ways. One does attract more flies with honey.

 

I didn't say it was cool. I was merely stating that if you come into a vegetarian or vegan forum, people are obviously going to defend their veg*an beliefs. If I went into an omnivourous forum and started bashing omnis then that would be the same thing, - I would expect people to defend their diet just like us veggies do in here. My point was, if people don't want to hear the argument, don't go into the forum! I wouldn't go into a omni forum and expect them to agree with my veg*an beliefs, so I don't like it when omnis come into a veg*an forum and expect us to agree with them. No harm meant or anything, just stating a point I thought was rather obvious, and backing up DoktorAtomik.

Summer. xx.

 

Hey! I like you already!

 

I totally agree with antimatter. I am an omni and i know many vegegarians so i looked at this forum to learn more about it, and what do i find, this thread that is veggies bashing omnis...Hmm, maybe that is why omnis think of veggies in a negative way.

I think the "guilt" argument is ridiculous. I really don't feel guilty about eating meat, if i did i would become a vegetarian. I think it's such a silly reason to get so upset. Eating is just supposed to be something you do to do live. You shouldn't live worrying about what you eat. I remember once in one of the college cafeterias someone put a piece of meat in a vegetarian's salad. After she was done eating, the person told her there was meat in her salad. She FREAKED out; i couldn't help but laugh.

Also, i try not to argue over whether it is right or not right to eat meat, but the people that are saying humans got where we are now due to eating meat are basically right. Take a university anthropology class if you don't believe me...Humans evolved and developed such high intelligence because of hunting and toolmaking(and most of the tools were made to hunt with). A good friend of mine said in response to this "yes, but now can't we evolve and not eat meat anymore now that we don't have to?" And that's a good point, i'm not saying it's wrong, i'm just saying humans developed high intelligence due mostly to hunting. And the people that say "humans lived for 2,000 years without hunting" may be right, but hunting is what sparked the explosion of intelligence.

Omnivores kill animals(and plants), vegetarians kill plants. Both are living things, what is the difference? Animals have feelings, plants don't? It's ok to eat fish cuz they don't have any feelings? Animals are caged and forced to live a way they don't want to? I'm forced to live a way i don't want to; i work a job i hate to buy shit i don't need(actually i'm in college in order to be able to get a job i hate). Only the independently wealthy are free to live how they want, which is a small percent of people. There is a precentage of wild animals that can live the way they want(probably higher than the percentage of people who can live the way they want)...

Sorry if i offended any vegetarians in this post, but many of you have deeply offended me in this thread too...

 

I think it's funny that meat eaters are here to make sure they tell everyone that eating meat is good. Kaytree just had to make up a thing about the thread being meant to bash meat eaters, and everyone wanted to get their part in. I learned just now though that eating meat and making tools will change the structure of your DNA though. I also learned from antimatter than cannabalism doesn't happen in nature. I also learned that when some people have to justify their eating of meat, then all things become a personal choice. I guess then that killing people is also okay with you. Can there be more reasons for making fun of meat eaters than their own words?