Communist party USA

Like working in a unionized job, equal pay for equal job title. Equality is difficult to accomplish even among those who are truly equal as the supply may be greater than the demand for their abilities.

Communism does more or less equalize those under it in a way that diminishes all as even the most capable eventually recognize that the rewards, or lack of, are not worth the efforts. And eventually government might have to make use of force and forms of punishment to bring about the needed levels of productivity.

 

Yep. Communism makes everyone equally miserable.

But I disagree with you guys. Being purged sounds like an incentive to work to me.

 

and why shouldn't we all be miserable?

 

Because, by contrast, socialism could make us all happy.:2thumbsup:

 

I'm a Fascism kinda guy myself. I had my fingers crossed with George W., but NOOOO

 

Work is the source of nearly all the misery in the world. Almost any evil you'd care to name comes from working or from living in a world designed for work. In order to stop suffering, we have to stop working(not literally, but at least not make it such a priority ,where we forget about the beauty of the other aspects of living)

Even if you aren't killed or crippled while actually working, you very well might be while going to work, coming from work, looking for work, or trying to forget about work. The vast majority of victims of the automobile are either doing one of these work-obligatory activities or else fall afoul of those who do them. To this augmented body-count must be added the victims of auto- industrial pollution and work-induced alcoholism and drug addiction.

Both cancer and heart disease are modern afflictions normally traceable, directly or indirectly, to work.

Usually -- and this is even more true in "communist" than capitalist countries, where the state is almost the only employer and everyone is an employee -- work is employment, i.e. wage-labor, which means selling yourself on the installment plan. Thus 95% of Americans who work, work for somebody (or something) else

The official line is that we all have rights and live in a democracy. Other unfortunates who aren't free like we are have to live in police states. These victims obey orders or else, no matter how arbitrary.
The authorities keep them under regular surveillance. State bureaucrats control even the smaller details of everyday life. The officials who push them around are answerable only to higher-ups, public or private. Either way, dissent and disobedience are punished. Informers report regularly to the authorities. All this is a very bad thing.

Although it is nothing but a description of the modern workplace

State control of the economy is no solution. Work is, if anything, more dangerous in the state-socialist countries than it is here- - so all this being said- - I can,t see how a state run system, that would take way what little rights we have left > in the work place, and in our lives in general could possibly better our quality of life under any other system-

Most of the old ideologies like Marxism and most brands of anarchism, believe in work all the more fiercely because they believe in so little else

Listen, our way- the democratic way of life has its faults and shortcomings for sure-
- But almost all (maybe not 100%) of the people living and working under such a suppressed system,chance their very lives to get to this country- - so one can imagine what a state run system, run by a chosen few, can do to a mans dreams, his will to provide better, or at least be given a chance without the threat of violence by the dream police:smash:

Its what we got is this country- but we do have the right to organize if we want change- -which is more than any other communist country can do-

JJack- >>
I saw 1st hand in SE Asia, how the state brainwashed their people into hating the very people who came to liberate them from a state run situation.
It happened that back then, we really had no clue about thier long history,ancient customs, and strong loyalties. So even if they wanted change, they were more apt to trust thier Northern countrymen, then the foreigners who were dropping bombs over their countryside and civilians- all in the name of Democracy.:army:

Sorry I dragged on people- felt strongly- got on a roll

 

i guess i shoulda put a winkie thing in there

 

Junglejack-I skimmed over most of your post, but about nam:

Ho chi minh should have been our strong ally, he quoted thomas jefferson in his inaguration speech, jefferson's whole yeoman farmer thing made him and his nation minh's hero. WE betrayed him, he was the good guy. We stepped in for the french when they lost, and fought their colonial war of evil. Minh was doing what george washington did in the US, basically. (I don't think he made that analogy himself, but, he would have LIKED to do what jefferson did for us) And as I understand it, once we got out, he did rather well for his people, the us and our war for the french's failed colonialism was something he HAD to deal with, however.

Ho chi minh could have been that thing we wanted in asia that would stop the red menace, instead we set him firmly against us, by being fucking evil empire builders.

No offence against anyone who fought in nam, it's not the soldiers on either side that are to blame. They're the victims (well them, and all the little asian kids born without limbs and shit because of agent orange, while monsanto currently claims there's no evidence it's a health hazard..... fumigate their coorporate headquarters with it, and then see what they say :2thumbsup: )

 

It only seemed to work in nativist cultures. The native americans,for example. They took what they needed and no more. They all ate or they all starved. With the industrial revolution--well before really--humans seemed to take naturally to ownership and therefore differing classes evolved. The owners and the owned. Still the same.

 

There's so much land available for everyone to have their 40 acres and a mule. But no, we are cramped in cities fighting each other for a measly job, expensive car and a measly little apartment. It's a shit social design.

 

There's about 7.5 acres available per member of the U.S. population, but I doubt there are currently enough mules to go around without requiring some intensive breeding, and even then the majority of the population would likely starve to death in short order if they had to rely upon their own efforts to feed themselves, hence government would just confiscate from those who are capable and productive to provide for those who are not.

 

most of which is unsuitable for farming

 

Let's set the record straight. There is no such thing as human nature and communists correctly disavow a belief in it. The false idea of human nature is the fundament of reactionary thought.
If anyone is interested in an interesting discussion that brings out this issue check out Michel Foucault debating Noam Chomsky in the early 1970's (I think it's on YouTube). It becomes clear that Chomsky is naively getting trapped in the human nature argument, while Foucault is, nicely, trying to make the point that there is no such thing and that a theory of history and society is not based on such.

 

The Cuban government has been accused of numerous human rights abuses including torture, arbitrary imprisonment, unfair trials, and extrajudicial executions (also known as "El Paredón").[92][93] The Human Rights Watch alleges that the government "represses nearly all forms of political dissent" and that "Cubans are systematically denied basic rights to free expression, association, assembly, privacy, movement, and due process of law".[94]

Cuba had the second-highest number of imprisoned journalists of any nation in 2008 (the People's Republic of China had the highest) according to various sources, including the Committee to Protect Journalists (CPJ), an international NGO, and Human Rights Watch.[95][96] As a result of ownership restrictions, computer ownership rates are among the world's lowest.[97] The right to use the Internet is granted only to selected locations and they may be monitored.[97][98] Connecting to the Internet illegally can lead to a five-year prison sentence.[citation needed]

Cuban dissidents who commit crimes face arrest and imprisonment. In the 1990s, Human Rights Watch reported that Cuba's extensive prison system, one of the largest in Latin America, consists of some 40 maximum-security prisons, 30 minimum-security prisons, and over 200 work camps.[99] According to Human Rights Watch, political prisoners, along with the rest of Cuba's prison population, are confined to jails with substandard and unhealthy conditions.[99]


Yea, sounds awesome doesn't it?

 

RooRshack:

Looking back, Ho asked for aid from the U.S. at the end of WW II to get the French out of Viet Nam, but was refused as the U.S. didn't want to disgrace France further, which caused Ho to seek aid from China, which he received. I don't know if our aid would have brought about a different form of government or not, but likely would have at least prevented our involvement in a war. Those we were fighting could be both friend and enemy, depending on the circumstances, and more than once I was told that "we don't hate American soldiers, we hate your government", and that was something heard from both the Asians fighting with us and some of those fighting against us.
Peaceful societies are creations of individual people, NOT creations of any form of government. It is irrational to think that a single society, encompassing ALL humans can be formed under any form of government, without oppression which eventually leads to outbreaks of violence.

 

Junglejack

State's are pushing thru laws to stop union struggles. Wisconsin and now Indiana. I hear Ohio is next. Republican majorities are pushing thru anti right to union laws. Collective bargaining and the political strength of union workers are seen as a threat to some people.
The lone workers vote aint worth a shit. Add a block of workers votes and a little bit of power is achievable. Businesses have their organizations and the BBB to buy lobbyists to get their voices heard. They have a collective voice. The worker only has their union and now it's being shredded by Republican senate majorities. Are the middle class workers not supposed to have any political power?

 

I dont know? Is it rational to think all societies must have oppression?

 

Yeah, they call it a "Right to Work" bill...... it's actually a right to work for LESS! But they left that part out. See what they did there?

 

Who made that claim?

 

Everyone should have a right to work and earn what they are worth, but no one has a right to a job that they are incapable of performing or do so at a loss to their employer. My experience has shown that unions do not promote "equal pay for equal work", but instead simply "equal pay for a job title".