Discussion in 'Politics' started by Balbus, Jan 26, 2017.
I don't care where you're from. Go play your head games with someone else.
Scratchy was right! There are radical M&M's!
Yep...the Revolution is right Meow!. Lol...
Oh puff you cutie pie did you miss me?
I suppose you didn’t know that the UK has just had a general election?
Oh well anyway you really have to realise that you are not that important, I come here for fun because I’m a politics and history geek, and its interesting to see the themes and currents in the US.
I pop in virtually every day as I’m the moderator and like to check on things but I don’t always post do so only when I have the time, feel like it or if it seems worthwhile [or when i'm drunk LOL] and you are not that interesting, of a type you are in fact I’m sorry to say rather boring.
M. you need a serious reality check!
AMERICA CAN MOST CERTAINLY BAN PEOPLE FROM COUNTRIES, and it most certainly can be based on an Ideology. The constitution does not apply to them nor do those entering the USA recognize it as their belief.
I seriously wonder about people in this country and their view on reality.
I am quite sure that there are more than 7 Muslim Countries in the world. But lets just take a look at this.
These are Countries classified as Muslim that have a Ban on Jewish People. Not just Israelis, but Jewish people.
MUSLIM COUNTRIES THAT BAN JEWISIH PEOPLE OR ANYONE WHO HAS ISREAL STAMPED ON THEIR PASSPORT. YOUR RELIGION MATTER WHEN APPLYING FOR A VISITORS VISA!
And people of any other faith are second class citizens.
OH the stupidity and hypocrisy of the LEFT! Why are you not outraged at the banning of good Jewish people? Trump needs a bigger list so that he can achieve what the left accuses him of.
BAN ON JEWS BY MUSLIM COUNTRIES: 16 of them!
United Arab Emirates
Countries where Gay or Bisexual is punishable by death: 13 of them.
all of them are classified as Muslim Countries or areas.
Parts of Nigeria, the majority of muslim parts
Parts of Somalia, Muslim Parts
TOTAL NUMBER OF OFFICIALLY CLASSIFIED MUSLIM COUNTRIES IN THE WORLD.
Country, Number of Muslims, Percentage of the population that is Muslim
Indonesia 204,847,000 (87%)
Pakistan 178,097,000 (96%)
Bangladesh 145,312,000 (90%)
Nigeria 75,728,000 (48%)
Iran 74,819,000 (100%)
Turkey 74,660,000 (99%)
Egypt 73,746,000 (90%)
Algeria 34,780,000 (98%)
Morocco 32,381,000 (99%)
Iraq 31,108,000 (99%)
Sudan 30,855,000 (97%)
Saudi Arabia 30,770,375 (100%)
Afghanistan 29,047,000 (100%)
Uzbekistan 26,833,000 (97%)
Yemen 24,023,000 (99%)
Syria 20,895,000 (93%)
Malaysia 17,139,000 (61%)
Niger 15,627,000 (98%)
Ethiopia 25,525,200 (33%)
Ok have a couple of minutes…
I find it amusing how things change and how they remain the same.
I’ve been involved in campaigns against harassment, persecution, and abuse that has was is happening around the world for the last 40 or so years, I’ve been a member of Amnesty International for over 30 years.
The persecutions has my guises most were about politics, but there was also sexuality, race and religion, and it was happening in many countries with regimes of the right and left, with dictatorships and democracies and mixtures of many types.
The people I meet in connection with that were no the whole lefties of one type or another, when righties did raise their voices they were on the whole rather selective about what they wanted to highlight and often attacked those that raised issue in places that didn’t fit in with their agenda.
In their thinking it was very important to spotlight abuses in sat Soviet Russia or Castro’s Cuba but often seemed to diminish, disregard or just reject evidence of abuse in other places of say Saud Arabia or the Latin American right wing junta’s and woe betide if you said anything about abuses perpetrated by say the UK or US.
You see at that time the main agenda for the majority of right wingers was anti-communism (often translating into anything left wing).
And as part of this political agenda they seemed less interested in social persecution or things like gay and women’s rights. In fact the main opposition to the advancement of such rights was coming from the conservative right and especially the Christian right and although in some places this has diminished it is still strong in an number of places (for example Russia and some states in Africa). Even in the Britain the Conservative Party are joining up with one of the most homophobic political party in the UK the Democratic Unionist Party to rule the country.
As I say how things change and how things remain the same.
We now have a new right that wishes to push its own agenda that is now spotlighting the actions of its chosen enemy. They are making the same mistake as their processors on the right, it’s not about trying to find rational solutions it’s about creating a ‘them and us’ attitude.
Entry to the U.S. can be limited as per:
ACT 212 - GENERAL CLASSES OF ALIENS INELIGIBLE TO RECEIVE VISAS AND INELIGIBLE FOR ADMISSION; WAIVERS OF INADMISSIBILLITY
They can be denied for health reasons, if they are a drug addict, if they have been convicted of certain crimes, if they traffic in controlled substances, if they are entering for the sole purposes of prostitution, if while they were a member of a foreign government participated in severe violations of religious freedom, if they were involved in or profited from human trafficking, if they have laundered money, if they are known to be gaining entry to commit sabotage, violate export laws, overthrow the government, or has or wants to engage in terrorism, if they will be detrimental to foreign policy, if they are or have been a member of a totalitarian party inducing the Nazis, if they engaged in torture (which would exclude many of our own citizens), if they recurit child soldiers, if they are likely to become a charge of the state...
...and things like that, there are some others.
Bush denied entry to Haitian boat people:
Trump admitted that national origin was an excuse for banning Muslims in repeated campaign rhetoric, Rudy Giuliani said that Trump was seeking a way to legally ban Muslims, when Trump signed his executive order he stated "We all know what that means", the 9/11 terrorists countries were not included, and it prioritizes certain religions over others.
In short the problem is Trump has not established that his Muslim ban would be detrimental to the U.S.
Are you people completely clueless?
Illegal Aliens are Immigrants. Just because you have a visitors visa you are still an Immigrant and especially if that visa expired and you remain, you are considered an immigrant, illegal immigrant but still an immigrant. The B1 is used to gain access to a country you want to remain and then not leave, over stay your welcome and establish a residence. Meagains list was very misleading as well as other statements it makes. Many of these people had been in the USA for over 5 years. I am calling you an IT because I don't know what you are and don't want to offend in getting your gender wrong.
Oh wait, I forgot, Balbus is not American, is he? but feels he can speak and accurately portray how things are here, as if he knows first hand, same goes for meagain, so why exactly are they looking from the outside in and stirring the pot?
Balbus still has not named his christian slaying Homosexuals and witch hunting countries and meagain supplies a list of immigrants.
I will just close with this.
Remember when Obama told Illegal aliens/immigrants, non citizens to vote and that they can. Yet he called them "citizens" because citizen CAN also mean, as a secondary meaning: an inhabitant of a particular town or city.
I wonder why Obama was not charged with treason? this was treason! Why wasn't he impeached?
LOL – it is amazing it’s basically forum Chinese whispers
Do you actually know what I said? Can you find the quote?
If you are going to make blanket statements Please provide a link to this 2015 event that you simply take the word of the United Nations as gospel.
And "THERE ARE Numerous christian countries that are persecuting homosexuals ", as you said, you claim to be the righteous one and state that this change came from the Democrats, the left.
Where is this evidence? Yet another blanket statement and lie. Those homosexuals that are being persecuted in christian countries, where are they, is the persecution carried out by Christians or people of other faiths within the numerous countries you claim are out there? Links please?
True to your form you pretend you never said such a thing, or implied it and try to sweep it under the rug. I agree that you need to do what other do on here and back up your statements, if this is at all possible..
Gay marriages became legal in the UK in 2014. HUH, this happened under David Cameron who was a Conservative? Conservative is the LEFT?
USA - Gay Marriages - The 1st State to make it legal was Massachusetts in 2003 and at the time the governor was Mitt Romney who signed it, OH guess what? he was a Republican!
I'm sure your emotional appeal to my lack of outrage or whatever makes you feel as of you are scoring points on a forum, but it doesn't stand up in a court of law. No judge worth his position would take the argument that middle eastern countries ban Jews so therefore we should disregard our constitution and ban Muslims.
If you want to start a thread about unjust laws in various countries I'll be happy to muster up some outrage for ya -
But here I am specifically addressing immigration law within the US and how it works within the framework of the US constitution
Immigration *can* be limited on a case by case basis as Meagain addressed, and short term travel and immigration bans can be put into place for people coming from countries that pose a security risk, as you addressed
But I was responding directly to the sentimemt expressed within this thread by a few different people that we need to stop the flow of Muslims, specifically, from coming into our country.
Placing restrictions on immigration due strictly to religion is unconstitutional and in order for any kind of travel ban to be upheld within a court of law in the US, it would have to be proven that the ban was instituted for other reasons and is not a blanket ban on one particular religion.
If you dont want to take my word for it, if you think I'm out of touch with reality as you say, you can double check with an immigration lawyer or some other legal expert.
pats Meliei on the head
if I was looking to win any points, wouldn't I be catering to people such as yourself who pretend to be a bleeding heart on this message board? I can only be me, take it or leave it. You on the other hand seem to gather only where you find support and get angry when you are proven wrong, throw a tantrum which has been witnessed before. Inability to admit when wrong. It is fine though, I accept you for what you are. You start out by insulting me, claiming I am looking to fit in on this message board. I have bigger goals, but thanks for your veiled insult and clear hostility.
This is hardly a ban on a religion, if it was the list would be a lot longer. You feign to care about something I do not believe you truly give a shit about. You just want to Virtue Signal and it is clear that you have no clue as to the reason for the ban. Might it have to do with a certain civil war and the potential risks to Americans as a whole? No, it couldn't be that. You Alt Leftist need to blame someone for your failures in life and who better to blame than your opposition? Hey your own party failed you but lets give them another chance, just like other Fascists groups that failed in history, you have to keep trying to make it work.
I am simply proving that Trump Supporters have listened to the warnings, which is why they are not listening to the left anymore. This thread is about Trump Supporters and warnings. I am proving that Trump supporters have listened to the warnings of potential risks from refugees.
8 years of lies and broken promises was enough listening. This is not about listening to Obama.
This thread is not about trumps ban. It is about Warnings. What warnings are trump supporters suppose to take from your talk about the ban list? A ban list that includes banning christians from Syria as well as Muslims. Same goes with the other countries. There are people from other faiths, Just not in the majority. Your constitutional argument holds no water and what warning are you trying to give trump supporters with this false statement?
If Trump wanted to restrict the flow of a religion there would be a lot more countries on the ban list. That simple. Muslims will still come in, just not from those countries. No reason to worry. But what we should be concerned about is a country that Bans a religion regardless of location like Muslim countries do to Jewish people and what these countries view as ok with regards to ones sexuality. Hypocritical if you don't make this an issue.
I believe that this has been asked of you before. Do you want this thread to consist of only people who agree with you? It appears to be the trend with you, with regards to people who have a different view from yours. They are not welcome in a thread where ever you tread and you tell them to leave.
Oh cool so you're not interested in reasonable debate, you only want to be insulting.
I enjoy discussing issues in a reasonable way but people like you are honestly ruining hipforums for me. Take your insults back to the yahoo comment section, is it really that hard to respond to the perfectly reasonable and factual points I made without insulting me?
Didnt even read the rest of your post, dont care
^ there she goes again, telling people to leave the forum.
It's OK Psymon-star
Balbus will never swallow his pride and admit to being wrong.
Well, it's clear you choose to redefine the word immigrant to mean illegal alien.
So nothing I can do about that. If you choose to believe that overstaying a non-immigrate visa makes you an immigrant, have fun.
A B1 visa is a non-immigrate visa. But don't believe me, here's the State Department site that tells you all about it, how to attain it, how much it costs, etc. Or don't you believe your own government's statements on visas?
My list was very accurate, it identified every known actor in the 9/11 attack, their nationality and status in the U.S. at the time of the attack.
The length of time any of them were in the U.S. is irrelevant, what is relevant is their immigration status...there wasn't any.
Here are some sources:
Identity and Immigration Status of 9/11 Terrorists Where America's Terrorists Actually Come From
I'm a male.
I don't know what you mean about looking from the outside and not having first hand knowledge.
I try and do research to find answers.
Are you suggesting my research is bad? If so please provide your own research which would contradict what I have found.
Also, what first hand knowledge are you claiming in these matters?
Balbus must be busy.
Here is one source that may be the one he is referring to.
REBELS in the Central African Republic have abducted women and burnt them as witches in order to cement their hold on lawless areas, a leaked United Nations report has revealed.
Here is a report of genocide:
Christian Militias In The CAR Give Muslims A Choice: Convert Or Die
Here's the Reuters witch report.
That's an easy one.
The video is not shown in its entirety. Here it is.
Obama is saying that if you have family members or friends who are illegal aliens, you as a person who can legally vote, have an obligation to have your views expressed on the status of illegal aliens by voting.
Ok I went back and read it, I'm bored
Off topic but - you seem pretty familiar with me for someone with 145 posts -
and very antagonistic towards me, have you been here before under another name and I pissed you off or something?
I dont recall telling anyone else to leave, I wasn't really telling you to leave but I forget how seriously people take me sometimes. I was just making a barbed remark about how your insults remind me of people who troll the comments section elsewhere on the internet.
I don't want people to agree with me, like I said I enjoy reasonable debate. Reasonable being the key word. You're getting a bit personal, especially with someone with only 145 posts who couldn't be THAT familiar with me. There are people here with whom I don't always agree but I get along with perfectly fine. I can get along with anyone who possesses intelligence, logic, and a sense of humor. I do admit I have less patience with people than I used to which is maybe why people like you get a bad impression of me, oh well.
ANYways, back on topic. I was responding directly to the anti Muslim immigration sentiment echoed by many on this thread. People were suggesting a Muslim ban, I reminded them this would be unconstitutional. I wasn't really referring to Trump's ban although obviously a judge did rule it was unconstitutional. And I wasn't trying to issue a warning, I realize that is the topic of the thread but threads here do tend to meander along with the tide of conversation, hope that clears up your confusion.
In conclusion I think it is important, when discussing immigration, to keep in mind what can and cannot be done within the framework of the constitution.
Nations that have a majority Christian population and criminalize consensual sexual acts between adults of the same sex.
Antigua and Barbuda
Saint Kitts and Nevis
Saint Vincent and the Grenadines
Trinidad and Tobago
Now I'll get yelled at for being off topic.
Lefties are funny.
As soon as they hear anyone criticize Islam, they get on the offensive and say "but but but Christians do this, and this, and fucked up shit like this!"
Sure, you can criticize Christianity all you want. I'm not a Christian and I don't care what kind of smack you talk about it. But I do strongly believe that some religions are better than others.
First of all, Balbus already tried the Christian Militias example in the CAR; it's already been addressed and he couldn't defend it from scrutiny. You see, the difference here is that these Christian militias are NOT a country, and Angela Merkle is not trying to forcefully integrate these people into European society. They were formed when Selekas [muslim militia] invaded the south from the north. And tried to overthrow the Christian leader François Bozizé
Unlike your Mint Press News source, which is heavily biased towards Islamism, and social justice warrior activism. Here's a better source that gives a more fair report of the fighting going on in that region.
Now the animists are jumping in on this with the Muslims and Christians. Muslims originally attacked from the north. Also, this Christian militia you speak of, isn't really much of a Christian group anymore, they are Anti-Balaka.
By the way, where are these homosexuals being attacked by Christians in the CAR? It wasn't even mentioned in your article
Separate names with a comma.