What's The Real Deal With Buddhism And Reincarnation?

I know that it is to do with what branch of Buddhism that you are following with whether Reincarnation is believed in or not, but how can any Buddhist believe in Reincarnation and yet also not believe that there is a Soul?

 

My understanding, which has been heavily influenced by the writings and recordings of Alan Watts, is that the Universe is an indivisible whole which experiences itself through every living being, however partially, so It is what reincarnates over and over. With that said, there may be subtle energies or various forms of patterning which do somehow leave the body at death and sooner or later hook up with another body, so It could have the experience of a lifetime, then death, then possibly something in some space after death, and then another lifetime which bears some similarity to, and in some way is a continuation of, the one before. We could give any name to those subtle energies but they are waves of the Universe, like everything else. Enlightenment is then realizing, experientially, that you are more than just those energies, which we experience as thoughts and feelings, the entire ocean as opposed to the wave.

Make any sense?

 

Just renaming it as Rebirth doesn't mean it's not still Reincarnation.

 

What's the debate?

Buddhist are probably simply opposed to that there is an afterlife. I for one believe in spiritual worlds/communities and purpose/karma.

Buddhist simply want to get to the enlightenment? Isn't the destination the journey?

 

Tibetan Buddhists do.

 

Guess whatever you want. Maybe you're right, maybe not. You'll find out soon enough.

 

Interesting side note; You guys see that Castaneda shit I posted in the consciousness wars thread? Well, I've got a Brother who has been heavily involved with Tibetan Buddhism, I mean not just studying but actually hanging out with Rinpoche's and Nuns...so he tells me recently, more and more he's seeing in his studys where Castaneda stole the entire 'Naugalism' concept, practically word for word in some cases (translated obviously), from the ancient Tibetan scriptures. Casteneda might be a plagiarist, but the message remains the same. In all forms of Buddhism there is the core concept of erasing the self, or the concept of the self and to settle the mind to see through it's illusions. To give up ambition and pride, achievement and goals, etc, all the things our everyday mind and indeed pop culture tells us are good things... In Castaneda series, Don Juan tells Carlos there's nothing we can do about the predator that has taken over our minds...or actually has taken siege by giving us their minds, so the only chance we have is through certain techniques to practice a complete silencing of the mind "stopping internal dialogue". Since the 'predator' is after our emotional energy, it squeezes us by projecting things in our minds that will cause high emotion, weather it be elation or violence or anything in between. The idea is that if we practice emptying the mind and keep increasing the time we can keep it empty, after many years or perhaps a lifetime of prolonged effort, it will begin to deny sustenance to the predator and it will little by little get frustrated and eventually leave you alone forever. Nirvana, baby!


Did the Ancient Tibetan (and Taoist, I suspect) masters know about the predator, but simply could not speak of it, for obvious reasons?

Food for thought

edit; also parallels with Gnostic writings
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/cienciareal/esp_donjuan13.htm

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rebirth_%28Buddhism%29

there's lots of schools of buddhism and the theravadists hold to the notion of the human, any sentient being, is made up of aggregates - which dissolve upon death - the forces which gave rise to those aggregates are as based in 'dependent origination' - or the wholeness of life as ongoing and so the aggregates will continue due to karma

the theme of dependent origination is where buddhists mistakenly think that eschewing desire is the root to nirvana - but in fact the four pillars or four noble truths do not specifically mention desire as any root cause for nirvana or lack thereof https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pratītyasamutpāda

some schools like cintimani or mind only consider there to be a subtle repository which holds karmic residue which rebirths

tibetan buddhists consider along the lines of mahayana buddhist with stream enterer to an unheard of 15th bhumi beyond the mahayanists where one can have the jalu or body of light and live in an afterlife benefitting beings throughout many universes and planes

in general if you spent much time in a good form of meditation and in retreats as well as living practically then ones definitely defined self stops holding precident and one starts to feel more 'one,' more unchanging, more vast, less obscured by changing values - this is when the aggregates stop developing as vritti (habit) or samsara (ongoing identification) - at that time it is more difficult to reincarnate because reincarnation depends (as based in dependent origination) on desire and if desire has little specificity then there is not really any place to go to

this was an oversimplification

a deep meditation of calm abiding can explain better than words - if your future womb is the transcendent then most likely you will be reborn one with the substratum of existance

on the other hand if you're a rank materialist your agggregates can be easily subsumed by any common person and so an individual personality in a new existance will be unlikely

 

buddhists believe in reincarnation, but their aim is not to reincarnate.. to come back again to this world is not their goal.. they want to be enlightened and become a buddha...

 

If you believe in reincarnation, then I would suggest that you follow the Noble Eightfold Path, as it accrues spiritual merit leading to an auspicious rebirth.
If you do not believe in reincarnation, then I would suggest that you follow the Noble Eightfold Path; as it demonstrably ameliorates suffering in this life.