Vegetarians - would you eat meat if it did not entail killing?

Discussion in 'Vegetarian' started by walsh, Feb 20, 2012.

  1. zengizmo

    zengizmo Ignorant Slut HipForums Supporter

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    It's not actually by choice...
    It was actually I who cited the info about needing supplements. Somebody needs to tell the people who run the vegan site I quoted, cuz they don't think you can get B12 from plants or that B12 can be absorbed by the colon from the intestinal flora there.
     
  2. walsh

    walsh Senior Member

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    Doesn't that just confirm what i'm saying? LSD isn't found naturally. It can be synthesized from alkaloids found naturally.

    I don't think you know what you're arguing.
     
  3. machinist

    machinist Banned Lifetime Supporter

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    iron and aluminum are natural. automobiles are not natural.

    fungi is natural. lsd is not natural.
     
  4. FreeExplorer

    FreeExplorer Member

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    Today I went down the stairs in my house late at night to fetch a water bottle in the kitchen. Everyone was sleeping so the lights were off and as I crossed the door into the kitchen area I stepped in something squishy. At first I thought it was a marshmellow because it felt soft and it made a wimp sound that pierced in my ears. However, it wasn't a wimp caused by friction with a rubber like substance against the ground. No, it had a distinct painful spirit to it, more like the shocked shriek of something that was in terrible agony. This quick note, along with the wet feeling left between my toes, made me realize I might have stepped in something that was alive, likely a large bug or something. Then I flipped on my lights, looked down, and saw a little baby gecko moving away limp. It was a cute creature: pale, with buggy eyes and about a inch long. Closer look showed that its right arm was all bent and pretty much ripped out to the point it was hanging loosely by some skin. The other limps also looked broken or strange. Yet it kept moving, so I let it get away as I felt horrible. On my way back, i saw the gecko lifeless, its eyes still wide open and head straight but nevertheless dead.

    This feeling of pity for the animal has led me to attempt being vegetarian. i imagine the suffering I felt for the creature above would be similar as if I had to kill another animal in the wild for food. Yet, I don't feel this guilt when Im eating plants or mushrooms, and even fish--but that may be because I dont have experience killing fish. This emotion might not be a factor for say an Indian who dwells in the amazon jungle and lives off hunting their whole lifes for survival, who knows...

    As far as you question, come on man. That is like asking "would you bang a guy if he had a vagina and tits?" Obviously it wouldn't be meat if it didnt involve killing.
     
  5. walsh

    walsh Senior Member

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    The animal whose meat it is isn't suffering, isn't conscious. Since that seems to be your main reason for not eating meat, there's no reason for you not to eat lab-grown meat.
     
  6. FreeExplorer

    FreeExplorer Member

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    ^ True, I hadnt read the article portion of the question lol
    Personally, if it had the same taste and texture of the meats I like I would definitely be into it. But if it just tastes like a weird processed muscle mass, that would gross me out.
     
  7. storch

    storch banned

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    Zengi,

    Yes, someone should tell them that their information is incorrect. The problem is that when new information doesn't jibe with old information, it takes a long time for people to adopt the new information.

    As a case in point, people are still talking about the necessity to combine this and that in order to make a complete protein, even though the one responsible for putting it in their heads has recanted and said that she was wrong.

    I've told many people about this. And they nod their heads. A year later they're back to explaining to me how I have to properly combine beans and rice and wheat.

    Takes a long time for a previously accepted idea to die in a mind that's already accepted a previous "truth."
     
  8. zombiewolf

    zombiewolf Senior Member

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    Not completely true...yes, B12 is produced by those bacteria, but its not available to us unless we eat our own shit! :ack2: lol

    I remember reading about this years ago
    It took me forever to find some reference.... here ya go...
    http://www.veganhealth.org/b12/int


    ZW :daisy:
     
  9. storch

    storch banned

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    it's cobalt we need.
     
  10. Willy_Wonka_27

    Willy_Wonka_27 Surrender to the Flow

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    As far as B12 is concerned, there is no reason to supplement unless your blood test shows you need to. Everyone should get tested. Of all people with diagnosed B12 deficiency 99% are meat eaters. B12 deficiency mostly comes from lack of ability to absorb B12.
    So even if you supplement you will still be deficient.

    If you have no absorption problems, don't lack intrinsic factor, then you should have no problem keeping an appropriate B12 level regardless of diet label. Unless you are unhealthy which a lot of people are. There are so many people in the u.s.a. with undiagnosed B12 deficiencies that could benefit from a low fat vegan lifestyle and/or B12 injections.
    If you find you are deficient, forget useless OTC supplements, get B12 injections. They are a quick foolproof way to get you back to where you want to be.
     
  11. zombiewolf

    zombiewolf Senior Member

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    so? less than 7% of people polled (2006) in the US claim to never eat meat.
    Most people eat meat.
    Its like saying " 99% of people diagnosed with b12 deficiency are bread eaters"...
    it's fucking meaningless
     
  12. Willy_Wonka_27

    Willy_Wonka_27 Surrender to the Flow

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    That's not what I am saying. I was saying that B12 deficiency is not exclusive to vegans. It effects people of all diet styles. If eating meat = getting b12 than there would not be so many B12 deficient meat eaters. If going vegan = deficiency, there would not be so many vegans with optimum B12 levels. It has less to do with diet than body chemestry.
     
  13. wisp

    wisp Member

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    The human body can preserve stores of b12 for up to 30 years and reuses the vitamin without destroying the substance.
     
  14. aesthetic

    aesthetic Z

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    Its possible to ingest ergot and experience a trip equivelant to LSD. You dont like to read do you?


    :) you claim to know a lot about LSD
     
  15. zombiewolf

    zombiewolf Senior Member

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    a'ight I getcha, can you cite? :)
     
  16. Perilless

    Perilless Member

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  17. Willy_Wonka_27

    Willy_Wonka_27 Surrender to the Flow

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    I encourage everyone to read "Could It Be B12?: An Epidemic of Misdiagnoses".
     
  18. sunfighter

    sunfighter Hip Forums Supporter HipForums Supporter

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    The daily requirement for B12 is very low. Vegans can get plenty from nutritional yeast, fortified soy milk, and fortified cereal. Plus there is some in miso, altho I just read in Wikipedia that there isn't as much as we used to think.
     
  19. zombiewolf

    zombiewolf Senior Member

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    Thanks 'Wonka, I'll give it a look.:cool:

    P.S> found some good exerpts...looks good to me.
    this popped out..lol
    "..Nitrous Oxide (laughing gas) depletes B12 stores" did not know that...:(:p
     
  20. eggsprog

    eggsprog anti gang marriage HipForums Supporter

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    my wife and i both went vegetarian a few years ago, and while my B12 has always been fine, she had to start taking supplements because hers was very low. i think it has a lot to do with the individual person, but the diet can definitely contribute.

    i actually take B12 supplements a couple times/week now (helps keep depression at bay, apparently), but it was fine before that too.
     

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