To do it or not to do it?

This is a very complex issue. But I need to seek advice. Please do not flame me.

I am in a Long distance relationship (LDR). Now I am beginning to feel the difficulties of it in a sexual way.

I want to remain faithful to her, body and mind.

But to my amazement, she actually told me without me mentioning anything at all "Listen, you can have sex with your friends or anyone... but just don't fall in love with them."

I was loss for words. "You also want to have fun right?" I said.

"Haha, how did you know?" she replied.

She is an extremely liberal woman. Sometimes she likes to go to parties with a lot of guys. At times I did not trust her at all, but I don't know why I just love her so much that I can forgive anything she does. She trusts me very much too, but she did not love me as much as I do.

Sometimes I am just feeling the urge for sex but I tried to curb it time and time again.

She told me "Hey, you must be a little 'bad' (go pubs to drink, flirt with women, have sex, be mean and naughty towards people). Please don't be such a good guy."

She can go wild and crazy when she is in the mood. I was always the one more worried and concern for her.

Another issue: Is paid sex morally better than casual sex?

I know this is debatable. I met a woman before who told me this "If you engage in paid sex, you are not exactly betraying your partner because you paid for the service, there are no strings attached, no emotions involved. Just like a transaction. If you go for free sex with friends, you are betraying your partner because you are emotionally attached to your friend."

I thought it was a weird way of thinking. it made sense but in a weird way.

My girlfriend also believes that it is normal for men to stray and have sex outside. - I find that unbelievable but she says it is completely fine.

She also thinks it is sad for sex workers to be selling their body but if it really helps them in a practically way, it should be fine.

It is also incredible that she is able to bear with it (boyfriend having sex with another girl) as I think it happened to her before. So long as she knows nothing about it, it is ok with her.

Here comes the all important question:
Should I be engaged in sexual activity at all? I am struggling inside... maybe my morals have gone wrong. I told myself if I am going to do something, it will just be a handjob, no sexual intercourse at all. Is this remaining faithful to some extent? Or am i trying to lessen my guilt?

Confused.

 

Firstly, excellent grammar. And paragraphing.

Also, sweet gf! Unfortunately... I told my bf the same thing a few summers ago (now my ex of course). He didn't do it, he was very loyal to me, but my decision to "allow" him to cheat, screw around or whatever, was because I myself did not feel completely emotionally commited. I really didn't love him.

I myself would have more respect for you if you didn't cheat, but then again... I'm not your girlfriend She seems okay with it. As for the hooker aspect? Well, I think any sort of sexual act with anyone other then your significant other is cheating. However, in this case it seems like cheating is going to be accepted by your girlfriend.

Do what you think is right.

 

Your situation is very interesting. When I was in my mid teens, I was faced with making some very difficult Values decisions and I only regret one of them. A few years later, I was challenged by a very wise and mature man to establish moral and value standards and to associate them with a reference source that does not change and has held steady through the ages.

During that time, I made many decisions and established my "Values" and listed them according to priority. Now, decades later, when I am presented with a situation the decision for me is very easy, I already answered those questions years ago.

Two Morals or Ethics I set for myself are 1.) I will not cheat, no exception, no way, no how. I have never cheated even when given numerous opportunities. 2.) I will never pay for sex or use a prostitute. I have never done this either.

I challenge you to set your standards, morals ethics, whever you want to call them and use those values every moment of your life.

 

Haha... Thanks Vana for the compliments. My teachers taught me well.

And thanks for voicing out your opinions.

Skoolie7, I congratulate you on holding steadfast to your morals. You must be a very determined and strong person.


Here is what happened:

Somehow my urge was growing very strong. I decided that I seek some place to relieve my inner desires. But honestly, I was in great confusion and pain. My morals and needs are engaged in a furious battle.

On that faithful day. She made a rare call to me. I was totally surprised, but pleasantly surprised that she called. I was always the one making calls to her. Was chatting on the phone about those normal stuff.

When I put down the phone, guilt nearly consumed me. I felt sick of myself.

Unfortunately, I went ahead with my plans to seek relief.

My footsteps got very heavy. I was nearly in tears. I think back of words she said, the times we spent together. I felt extremely miserable.

I am not too sure what happened, but my legs gave way. Both my calf muscles were in cramp. I can hardly walk.

I decided to return home...

Hours later, she went online and we chat via webcam as usual.

And as usual, we talked for hours but I somehow cannot recall what we have talked about. But she said something towards the end of the conversation.

"I miss you a lot and I love you."

I wanted to cry, but I held back my tears. "I love you too." I replied.

I was so glad I did not make a mistake, I felt very relieved.

You may think this is over. But the knock-out punch has yet to come. We talked about fidelity the next day and she delivered the ultimate shocking revelation.

Will post another thread soon to continue the story.

 

Dude why are you leaving us with the cliff hanger!!!

 

from what it sounds like she is already bangin other dudes, and she doesnt want to be the one "cheating" per say so she is telling you to go have fun.....I would be doing what she is telling you to do.....rock out with your fucking cock out...the prostitute thing, stay away you dont want to fuck around with a chance of getting an STD, you wanna be able to use it for the rest of your life..I dunno how old your are but you are under 25 you should partying like a rock star

 

I have decided against having paid sex. I hope my will can last.

I don't know if I should be posting the shocking revelations. I just feel bad about myself doing it. I'll just give a short abstract version of it.

We were talking about fidelity the other day and I told her I wanted to remain faithful. I asked her what would she do if she has to urge to have sex.

"I will go and find guys to do it." she giggled.

"Are you sure? Why?" I questioned.

"I'm sorry, but I will find man to have sex with. I am sorry mbln."

"Oh man... I wanted to remain faithful to you and you will make out with other guys?"

"I am really sorry. I am a bad girl. Nevermind, you can also go and find someone to have sex with, I am ok with it."

"I insist I only want you..."

"Thank you so much, but i am really sorry..."

This has taken me aback. I know she is promiscuous but I am not prepared to hear it from her.

"Did you put yourself into your boyfriend's shoes? How would i feel and how would your ex boyfriends feel?"

"Oh... last time I also had affairs with other guys. it is exciting. I don't know why but i love men so much. Last time my boyfriends treated me very well but i don't know what happen to me, i still had affairs and flings. They discovered my misdeeds and all of them broke up with me."

"Then you should change! imagine your boyfriend making out with girls behind your back! How would you feel?"

"Never mind. as long as i do not know it is ok."

I know no matter how much i try to say, i cannot change her mindset. I don't know what happened to her...

BUT... THERE IS A TWIST TO THE PLOT.

There are some suggestions that indicate she is lying about her fidelity issue. I still believe she is not as promiscuous as she described herself.

Actually quite a lot of times, she told me she is going out to meet some 'dubious' male friends. She wanted to get drunk and party all night. Obviously, i cannot stop her, but i nagged about the precautions she has to take to protect herself but she always tells me "never mind about it".

Nights like these i simply cannot sleep. I tried to call her sometimes and realised that she was sleeping, instead of partying. When she told me she was going to meet guys and possibly have sex with, she stayed at home as i was still able to chat with her via webcam all night.

I have absolutely no idea what she is trying to do.


I believe she has built defenses and mazes around her. it is difficult to know what she is thinking. Some guys did not break through the defense, while others are lost in her maze.

But i do know that if you have money, you can bulldoze your way to her heart. Unfortunately, i have none.

I feel so sad bad-mouthing about her. but this is just an outlet to express my grief.

There are worst matters about her but i think i should stop here.

 

So many words for such a problematic girl

Listen dude ....she's not worth it !!!

save your time and love for somebody else.
You seem like a guy who has a lot of love to give.
Don't waste it on the wrong girl.

There are so many cute girls in this world who're gonna be more than happy to have your love and be all yours. Why waste your energy on a girl who can't give you what you want ?

If you were the type of guy who's looking for open relationship and wants to bang anything around, she could have been perfect for you. But since you're not that kind of guy, then this girl only means trouble for you.

It's time to move on !!

 

I agree sweetie, don't stay with her if she is just gonna cheat on you. I don't care if both of you gave promission to do this. It is just not the right thing for either of you to do. I would not be able to trust her if I were you. If I women cheats the first time how do you know she won't do it another and another, until she has fucked the whole town. I have met tons of women like this and they are just bad news.

 

She seems to be slightly disturbed.

Also, perhaps she acts this way because she is afraid to get cheated upon, fear of intimacy (on the emotional level) or something like that?

 

LDR = Pointless.

 

I read this entire thread, but will quote from the first post because it has so many points to which I can relate from experience. Experience, BTW which includes that sexual liberation of the '60s and '70s.

This was the feeling between my wife and I. Once, while away and having met this really intriguing girl on my trip, I was very exuberant about how turned on I was with her. Who else to share this with but my best friend, my wife. Her first reaction was "how does this affect us?" I assured her that I could not live with this other woman, it was just an infatuation. her response to that was "go to her and get it out of your system."

What our cultural mythos fails to consider is that we are not a monogamous species - that is a construct of our religions and laws which goes against nature. And we also fail to realize that sex can be separate from relationships. My wife and I enjoyed sex and had a loving relationship. She understood that I could have sex with others without sharing a bond that we had between us.

First off, do you think this girl would be interested in an adoring old grampa? Sounds like my kinda woman.

Also, she sounds like a mismatch for you. You seem to have bought into that monogamy bullshit that has been foisted on us by our social controlling religions. That is good if it works for you and you can go thru all the contrivances and disciplines to thwart all your natural urges. Go find yourself another girl who can flagellate herself with you. That would be the most practical thing as stated by others in this thread - but don't disparage the lib girlfriend who seems to have a handle on the reality of her sexuality and relationships. (The only flaw I can see in her is why she continues to hang with you, knowing your hangups. But love can blind one so.)

Again, you say you are confused but you seem to be conflicted. I highligted some parts there because I found them amusing, trying to define "sex" like Bill Clinton saying "I did not have sex with that woman." Some ppl consider handjobs and suckjobs not sex. But if you get off, it was sex and if another person's hand or mouth got you off it was sex with someone else.

I follow the definition of hiring a prostitute as non-relationship sex. It is a contracted service and very tidy as there is no relationship involved except for the service paid for. However, having partaken of prostitutes in my youth, I had feelings for the hired woman at the moment of humping her. It is a natural occurence to be momentarily into the body you are fucking, but there is no pretense of loving her.

Likewise, men are capable of having fuckbuddies who are just there for the gratuitous sex and no pretense of having long-term relationships. I suppose some women are the same way - I've had enuf one nighters with many women in my youth.

So, I guess I agree with all those who say you and this very sexually liberated woman are not compatible and you should look elsewhere.

 

Forget about her man. She is not worth it.

 

Okay this is SOO true, you are wasting all your time and energy on someone who wouldn't do it for you.. She WANTS to cheat on you and fuck other guys. When you are in a relationship.. YOU DON'T DO THAT.. it's horrible and disrespectful.. If you stay with this girl she is only gunna keep hurting you, tearing your heart apart, you don't seem like a guy who will willfully go and fuck other women, even if she told you it was ok, you seem liek the type of guy who wants a stable relationship, one woman, which is how it should be, all im saying is she is playign around with ur heart as if it were a toy. Don't let yourself be walked all over liek this.. that's not healthy.

 

Don't let her screw up ur morals on havign a relationship because you don't want to cheat but she is makign you think about it since she is sayign it's alright with her, but it's a trap you'll just end up hating yourself afterwards..

 

I agree!

I think that if I was to say to my boyf that it was okay to sleep around,
I would secretly be hoping he wouldn't.

Just a passing thought.

 

Thanks for all the responses and replies. Really appreciate them.

Yes, I know the general consensus is to ask me to give her up. I have asked quite a few people online, all advising me to just heck care about it.

Sometimes ignorance is a blessing. Sometimes not knowing anything is good, but is it really good? I don't know. She could have cheated behind my back, but she chose to openly tell me about how she feels about about the issue.

And at times I do believe that she is just joking with me. Yes, she jokes a lot about sex and love. Sometimes so much that I have absolutely no idea when she is telling the truth, when is she lying.

Any guy in my position would have entered a mental institute. Just take a look at some examples of our conversation. You will be shocked!

Because she jokes to such an extent that would make you go berserk.

mbln: How are you today?

she: Good! How about you?

mbln: fine too. So what did you do today?

she: i don't want to tell you...

mbln: why?

she: why should I tell you?

mbln: because I am your boyfriend.

she: oh really? Haha... I don't know.

mbln: *sigh* Yes. So how did you spend your day?

she: Me? Oh, I go out with a man.

mbln: Where did you go with him?

she: We talk in bed.

mbln: (I am not too please...) Why? What are you doing?!?! I don't believe.

she: Up to you... if you don't believe that's your business.

she: (she heard me sighing.) Hey, mbln! Just kidding! Oh, you are so stupid! What makes you think I am so stupid? I make you sad huh?

mbln: OK, then tell me what did you do?

she: mbln, don't talk so much! You have such a foul mouth. (I have no idea why she said that)

mbln: OK, I shall not talk so much.

she: so what did you do today?

mbln: blah blah blah (I always tell her everything, the truth)

she: why did you tell me what you do? I don't want to know.

mbln: You asked for it!

she: did I? haha... (Yes, sometimes she can be so... arrghh...)

she: I miss you so much! I want to hug you...

mbln: I miss you too. I love you.

she: I am joking. I don't love you and I don't miss you.

mbln: why?

she: because you are not handsome and rich. Sometimes you talk like a child, asking too many questions. (look who is talking without sense here)

mbln: *sigh* OK, never mind. Please take care of yourself, remember to eat.

she: haha... MBLN!!!!! (she screams my name)

mbln: Yes?

she: Why are you so stupid? I love you, you are my only one!

mbln: Haha... I know you are joking (I tried to sound sarcastic)

she: I am serious, I only love you...

mbln: I love you too, darling. OK, you go do your stuff.

she: I don't love you, heehee...

And she hangs up the phone.

Other times, this happens:

mbln: what did you do today?

she: don't tell.

mbln: did you eat?

she: don't tell.

mbln: plans for tomorrow?

she: don't tell.

mbln: why you don't tell me anything?

she: I don't have the feeling to talk.

mbln: OK then, good night and...

Before I even finish my sentence, she hangs up.

Sometimes I think there is something wrong with her mind. Just read this:

she: mbln, I need money... I am broke!

mbln: OK, when I have money 3 days later, I try to give you some.

she: that's a very long wait!

mbln: *sigh* sorry but you need to wait.

she: Then I don't want your money.

mbln: ???? Are you sure?

she: Yes, I have a lot of money, even if you want to give me, I also don't want.

mbln: I know you have some financial problem. I will send the money over.

she: Thank you so much! I want to go the this country next week!

mbln: I thought you don't have money?

she: who says so?

People, is there something wrong with her?

Judging from this, most people would say she is crazy and she does not love me at all. However... her actions tell another story.

She tells me all her passwords to her MSN, emails, social networking accounts. I have permission to access all her accounts. She even wants me to help her talk to her friends in MSN.

And from chatting with her male friends, whom I thought are very close to her, I realise one thing - all of them do not know her well at all. I was quite amused when they ask very simple things like "is this person your sister?" when I knew it for ages already. She is obviously extremely weak in written english. When I chat with those guys using slightly bombastic words, they do not feel anything weird at all. This shows that they are in fact not close at all.

She tells me her darkest secrets too. Of course I do not want to say them here. She was bluffing a lot of guys about something and they actually believe her. I am the only one who knows what is going on.

She asks me to call her a different name instead of the usual name all her friends call her. I find it really weird as I am the only person to call her by a different name. If I call her by her real name, she would get annoyed.

She showered gifts for my family every time I visit her. It looks as if she is trying hard to leave a good impression for my parents.

I have long conversations with her siblings whom she is close to. Her sister gave me a vote of confidence. She introduces me to her cousins, aunties, siblings friends etc, something that she did not do with other guys. So the family do know of my existence as her boyfriend.

She treats me exceptionally well when I am physically with her. It is only on webcam chats and phone calls that she suddenly turns a bit crazy and starts to talk about booze, sex, guys and those stuff.

So, where are we now? Does she love me at all? Or is she playing with me, teasing and torturing me?

Which is her true self? What can I believe?

Sometimes I just cry in my bed... Sometimes she just makes me so sad. But other times, she makes me feel so loved and happy.

I am not giving up on her... I don't know if this is a crazy decision.

Thank you once again for reading my posts.

 

I agree with everyone who said not to stay with her like that. =/

 

Sometimes the things she says make me feel very disrespected. But other times the things she says just melts me away.

I think it is disrespectful when she hangs up before I finish my sentence. When we talk online in skype. I was always placed in the lowest priority.

Eg: When we talk and there is an incoming call for her. She would ask me to wait while she receives the other party's call. Then when she is talking to another person and I ring her, she would just close my call, with no explanation at all.

I don't know what she treats me as. I know the other party must be guys because I have seen her skype contacts before.

However, the thing is, she only has brief conversations of 5-15 min with other guys and we chat for hours.

So am I placed in a low priority? Or she thinks she just talk with the other guys for a short while so we can talk for a longer time?

She has the ability to make me confused...

Then when she says "talk with you later", most of the time she did not call back. leaving me waiting only to see her log off without informing me. I have to call back to ask what happened.

In general, she is giving me mixed signals. There are clear signs that I am the one, but there are also other signs to say she does not really treats me as someone important in her life.

I wish I could tie her to a chair and interrogate... Even if I do so, she may not tell me the truth.

AAAAARRRRRRGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!

But at the end of the day, I don't know why. I will still forgive all her wrong doings. I still pray for her well being everyday. I still work hard for her. I still help her if she needs me. I still love her...

 

Oh dear she is clearly mentally challenged. God knows why you are wasting your life talking to the headfuck. I'm sure everyone would agree, stop wasting your life.