Technique or Genetics???

How did the pot of today get to be so powerful? The anti-pot crowd claims that breeders have created this "Killer Cannibis" out of thin air!!! Back in the mid 70's, Thai Sticks (debatably adulterated with hash oil or opium) were the strongest variety I ever tried. The stuff you can get today makes them seem mediocre.
On the other hand, it is said that good growing techniques and a lot of T.L.C. is what produces the increase in THC that we find in todays best sinsemilla. I'm guessing that the truth lies somewhere in between.
I remember in the mid 70's, "Columbian Commercial" was a big improvement over "Mexican Dirtweed". At about the same time we had Acapulco Gold, Maui Whaui, etc., at a slight additional fee (of course!). Then came Humbolt Sinsemilla, at the outrageous price of $100/oz. I Never tried it so I can't really say how good it was. Did things just keep getting better - and - more expensive, over the years?
I quit smoking in the ealy 80's and started again in the early 90's. For the quality I was used to, the price went up from about $45/oz. (in the 80's) to $75/oz. (in the 90's). Now we have this $4oo/oz. "Super Shit" - so were did it come from? Let's hear from some of you other old timers!!!

 

Probably both genetics and technique. I did my first grow in 1970 with bottom of the bag seeds tossed into the dirt. Now it's more like $10 per seed in a hydro setup. I think good weed is still a bargain after you factor in inflation and quality. Used to have to choke down a Bob Marley sized j to get where a hit or 2 of today's dope will take you. If cigarettes were .75 per pack then and 6 bucks now, and wine can hit 6 bucks per glass, I don't see the cost of intoxication that much out of line. How did it get better...all of those Ag school graduates putting their education to work with selection and breeding techniques. Think what they could do if they were out in the open. maybe we should put Ed Rosenthal on a coin.

 

A lot of commercially grown weed outdoors is left to dry in the sun. Theres no manicuring and curing of buds. When bud is grown and dried with proper care and attention as done by many growers especially these days the weed is a lot nicer. About twenty years ago I smoked some Columbian whilst travelling in South America and it was equally as potent as todays varieties. Can't comment on weed before this though as I was still a glint in my fathers eye.

 

My thanks to Fishheadbob and Buffoonman for chiming in!! I have to agree with everything you guys said. I never rolled a "Bob Marley Party Joint", but I hear ya. Three or four of us used to have to chain smoke the old Dirtweed,for awhile, just to catch a buzz. When everything is factored in, todays "high" cost is reasonable; imagine if it were legal, controled and taxed - but that's another story.
I know that sun drying just eats up the THC. I have heard that the older methodes of storing and shipping sucked too. Combine these things with "less than ideal" growing techniques (at least for the commercial grade/mass quantities), and we can account for a significant drop-off in THC. But come on now: a ten-fold decrease? I'm assuming 1 1/2-2% THC in the mid 60's, and, 15-20% THC for todays fine herb. That's a ten-fold increase in potency over about 40 years - based solely on better techniques (growing and post-harvest). WTF!!!
I don't really know that much about breeding cannabis - come on - let's hear from some of you breeders!!! Is it even possible to "breed-up" the THC content by 1,000% in about 40 years? OK, to be fair - there were some strains, available to breeders, back then that were more potent, let's say about 7% THC. That's still about a 300% increase in potency in just 40 years; is it possible to breed-up that much? Maybe the "G-13 myth" is true, but for now, let's just say I aint buying into it!!!
It doesn't make sense to me, that you could triple the THC content just by breeding alone. I think some of those Ag school graduates also taught us that better growing and drying techniques can contribute to more potent weed!
Yea, Ed Rosenthal for president - that cracks me up!!!
Hey, Buffoonman, was that "gourmet quality" or "garden variety" Columbian that was so strong? If it was regular "Columbo", we're just losing a lot of THC to bad shipping techniques.
Let's hear from some breeders - have the genetics really improved the THC content that much in the last 30 or 40 years? At this point, I'd say it is more about "better techniques" and less about "improved genetics".
Are we growing better pot - or are we just growing pot better?

 

The finest pot is grown organically indoors and that wasn't so easy long ago. I was one of the first indoor growers before HID lights were invented. Under lights sinse can be grown in perfect conditions creating buds as high as 32% thc which was unheard of back then.

Thai sticks were sprayed with opium and they were good but outragously priced.

The truth is that given a batch of a bunch of seeds from many strains a person could select a fine mom. Its more technique than genetics to a point but its real luck when a breeder finds a super mom like my sour bubble. It is rare and as time goes by and more people work in breeding the more chances for these super clones to come along.

I bet the ancients had great shit and the knowledge and genetics were lost and found many times. People just need to keep rolling the dice and recombining the genetic pool until even better ones are selected. My life has been devoted to cannabis and breeding for many years now. What I have done isn't special and many have done likewise as could you. BOG

The power is within us all. The athletes keep getting better because what has been done can always be exceeded by someone someday. It's our expectations that limit us.

 

Thanks for the input BOG! Wow, 32% THC, you're starting to scare me a little bit here (LMAO)!! It's all starting to make sense now. In the last thirty years or so we have seen the more exotic growing techniques, like hydroponics, become very popular and widespread among cannibis growers. With better lights, MH and HPS, we can get even better results from our controlled environments. So we have much better growing techniques combined with much better equipment, widely available to a highly motivated (when not stoned) bunch of experimenters. I think that funny little box I'm sitting next to (the computer) might have had something to with it too. With all of these improved techniques; we are also able to pass out the information to the whole world and share in thier successes too, thanks to the internet.

I think I see where this is going!!! We can thank God for the good, strong, basic cannibis plant. We can thank our better techniques and technologies for allowing us to grow the plant at nearer to it's real potential, nowadays. And we can thank the breeders for giving us the best of the best to work with.
The mythical "G-13" plant was only 27% THC and we have surpassed that by five points. I just cracked myself up, "only 27% THC" - I'm drooling just thinking about it. Back to the point - have we just about topped out? Or will the breeders keep finding that mutant with a wee bit more THC?

 

I'd like to chime in here.
I think there is such a thing as weed that is TOO potent.
It's all very fine to strive for super-high THC content, but to me--well, I still like to be able to function.
About 10 years ago I had s strain that was called Kavorkian. 3 hits and you forgot how to talk.
Kavorkian was one of the few strains that had no "ceiling". The more you smoked the higher you got. And there was no "getting used to it". Everytime you smoked it you got a super head rush. It was truely heroin of the pot world (maroin?). A friend would come over and I'd say something like "if you can smoke 1/2 this joint without it going out I'll give you an oz of this free". I never gave away an oz because no one0--and I'm talking about long-time stoners here--could do it. They'd get maybe 1/3 of the joint finished and forget they were smoking a joint. They'd just stare off into space glassy-eyed with the joint still in their even though it went out 10 minutes earlier.
Anyway, although I still kept growing this starin for another few years before I unfortunately lost if, I started growing another less potent strain for my head.
Because Special K as I called it was simply too potent. If you smoke for both recreation AND medical reasons, you still need to function. Go places, do stuff. With K that was almost impossible. For instance I'd preheat the oven to cook something and forget I had it on. I'd micro something or get some fast food with the oven still preheating forgotten several hours later, or the next morning when I'd walk into the kitchen and wonder why it was warm. I might want to go somewhere but was too stoned to drive. And even if I could drive more than once I'd set out to go somewhwere and forget where I was supposed to be going.
And there was no smoking to get just a mild buzz with K. Even 1 hit would fuck you up.
I look at it like this: if you drink alcohol you could drink straight Everclear which I believe is something like 175 proof. But no one I know does. Most folks prefer an evening of drinking beer or wine or scotch on the rocks, etc. over doing shots of Everclear.

I remember when someone told me of the supposed secret gov't pot G-13. 1 hit and you'd be blitzed all day they said. I thought about that for a few minutes and there is NO WAY I would want to be blitzed all day. To me that would be like being mentally ill. I'm not a Dr. or scientist but I still have stuff to do. I don't want to be incapacitated all day long.
And, when I had K, I found I was not enjoying my highs any better than with less potent (but still kick-ass) weed. To me, part of the fun of being high is getting high, going from straight to stoned.
I'd rather have a variety of strains. Some Afgani, some NL, some active sativa, rather than a stain of kick-your-dick-in-the-dirt 1-hitter shitter quitter to use 70's terminology. I like the different tastes and aroma's and effects of different strains of weed, rather than smoking a bowl and writing off the next 4 or so hours.

 

I quite agree. To me taste is the most important factor. I have never had yummy pot that wasn't potent enough as long as I had plenty. Growers always have plenty so be a grower and have your own harem.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder RangerDanger. While breeders often strive for one very potent strain they know what they like best as well. Give me a nice Bogglegum in the morning and a Sour Bubble when I want to just get real doped.

Despite my love for Sour Bubble I love all my strains and many others. We breeders are biased however and we all thing our strains are best. It's a pleasant delusion we all realize is difficult to overcome. Sour Bubble took first for taste in the Breeder's Indica Division of the last ICMAG Cup 420 Amsterdam and it was third for potency.

Huh, go figure! I thought it would be first in potency and third in taste because I have several strains that taste even better. The trouble with sour bubble is that it made the judges cough and sufferred in appearance due to shipment. It did well 2 years running and it really is my hash plant anyways. BOG

 

Hey, i got 2 cents! I long for yesteryear when every week brought a different weed with a different psychothrill. Me mate and I used to save back a cornicopia of different flavors! Not one of them caused anyone paranoia or to drool. To wit; there was giggles galore, Psychadelic kaliedascope, MMML ' make mad monkey love', lazy layback lumbo, and of course the always popular Deity Divine 'let one see God as whatever one perceives it to be!

 

I have a couple thoughts on it, while I am new to growing I think there is part of this puzzle that no one has looked at in depth. 40 years is a long time for growing. It's not really that long to us, but for a plant that has a normal life span of well under a year, that's 40 generations. Look how much different humans were 40 genertions ago. And with the new tech in lights and hydro and of course our beloved internet we can grow a few generations a year, rather than just having one grow and one harvest a year. Since we can germ seeds soon after the harvest and not wait till the next grwing season to see if any of them are any good, we can make more selections for the desired effect. add to that more cloneing to preserve genetics from a favorite plant, something that was a lot more difficult 40 years ago, or keeping a mother plant for years, and you end up with more choices when breeding. I love the different varieties that give very different highs and affects. I would love to get a clone of that special K ranger, not for everyday use but for those occations that ya just wanna forget how to talk. (yes I have everclear, and it is good) So that's my take on it, 40 years is a long time for pot, hell people domesticated a fox in 20. (I think it was the silver tailed fox, look it up) So breed on oh great ones, we love your work.

--Dash

 

Indoors 4 crops can be done per year or more so there has been many more generations of breeding than you can imagine with each doing his or her own breeding.

I feel this is lost and regained knowledge like all things we come to know. There is no way to keep it forever. Until now perhaps if all the info is archived? Nah. BOG

We will have to do it over again I suppose...

 

BOG That's what I'm workin' toward! Every plant harevsted is catalogued by symptom instead of potency, thatis if I don't fall off the the darn limb and forget what I was doin'-\

 

No doubt about it - thanks to better techniques, four generations per year can really accelerate the breeding proccess.

The Ranger brought out what I thought was a good point - pot can be too strong, especially if you want to function (or remember how to talk). It seems that the breeding emphesis, now, is more on "gourmet" flavors and physical attributes as opposed to bringing out the raw potency. I realize that someone will always be on a quest for the "one hit zombie maker" - but for the most part - has the public demand for more potent cannibis been met and surpassed already?

BOG, you mentioned the 32% THC level as being about maximum for marijuana at this point in time (that just blows my mind - I had no idea). I just have three questions for ya:
1. Do you see it going much higher in the near future?
2. Is that for a "private stock variety", or for a strain that's on the market?
3. Just out of morbid curiousity, if it's available, where would an interested party find such a kick-ass strain and what name should they ask for?