Question about court-ordered AA/NA slips-A Good Story

Hey all. One of my friends' little brother recently got busted, right, and so my friend called me up all worried as shit and wanted my opinion since i'm the 'expert'....naturally I figured I'd come to HF and see who's had some experience in this area, since I don't really condone of this kinda behavior to begin with, u gotta hear..lol.... but he does really need y'alls advice.

lil bbackground on this dumb fucker for ya:

anyway, so my friend is really worried about his bro, right. He recently got popped for various shit, but a couple felonies in partic- (ouch)- still he got off pretty easy and did right at 1 yr of prison, out of a 2 yr sentence, on two separate charges that both carried 2-10yrs, before he got paroled. ran em together. he came out at exactly 1 yr with an ankle monitor on, pissed clean and didn't break the rulz or party, or go outside when he wasn't supposed to, and he only had that bad boy on for like a little less than 3 months.

so he was doin good and shit, got a job and everything right out, and the only thing he had to do once he had his job was go to AA/NA twice a week, ordered as condition of his 'supervised release'. well, he's young, a lil hardhead, a "ruffian" some might say... hehe. he went, and he went, and he went. and he should have kept going. well, then some shit in his life got really wrecked up, according to his bro- who was actually pretty upset about it too, but like he got all depressed, his mom tried to kill herself, he lost his job, and it looked like he was going to lose the address that he originally paroled to.. not sure about if/where he could change to, nowhere to go, right borderline homeless, the whole bit. his brother said that diz little guy was really depressed, and just at the edge.

Anyway, as of just recently he'd been on parole for about six, maybe seven months - almost halfway though the 1yr that he needed to finish. this little bastard never once pissed dirty, never violated, caught another case or anything, either. nothing. but the thing was that for like maybe...oh, at least two or three months, he'd been just forging the signatures. using the same names from the first sheet, and they were good from what his bro says...altho we both think he's a fukkin dumbass for not just going, but shit.

now we all live in a big town.. and his PO obviously has a overworked case load, he was a good kid (surprisingly for him too), etc- and his officer never said anything, or even looked at the sigs- he said he just xeroxed and threw em in a folder. so what was meant to be just a once-in-a-while deal....turned into him just straight not going as his life deteriorated around him.

so he says he went in this last time a day or two ago and his PO seemed normal at first and then asked him right off, "do you have the address or phone number of a next of kin other than who you're staying with?", and it sorta threw him off, even though it was prolly just for his file. It threw him to the point where he actually said his dad's number had just changed & didn't remember it...and he said he recited the physical address of the gated homes, but claimed to not remember the house/unit number itself ("that part was true, at least!", he exclaimed) well...he may have seemed a little more nervous than usual (but not sure because he's always fukin nervous when he goes in there, even when he hasn't done anything wrong)... because after he'd already scanned the signature sheet, he was like, "oh yeah, let me see your AA/NA again". Ok, so I can just see this little fucker squirming in there, ...thinkin he was going to not even make it home that night, right off the bat. And his PO was inquiring about a letter of the abbrev. of the group's name, and he thought it stood for a word it didnt.. and anyway, when he was asked about it, he was just vague and told the officer he wasn't sure, it was always abbreviated. he told me on the phone almost hysterical (well, not really) that he just couldn't get a read on the PO and couldn't tell if he was real suspicious or not. but anyway, he said somethin like, "oh, yea,lemme get a couple of these names.."... but not real accusingly....and started clicking away and typing from the sheet, like he was copying it.

At first, he thought his PO was actually looking it up right there, and he said he almost just broke down and blurted it out, but anyway....he got his sheets back, got the dates for his next office visit & home visit, and then... "that's it. cya."

he didn't even piss-test him, which.. that's not all that unusual, because he said he gets tested about every other month, or maybe even a little less.. but he's obviously pretty freaked the fuck out about this--and so angry with himself for possibly going back to prison, for not going to a few months worth of pain in the ass (and IMO immoral and just wrong for being mandated) meetings.

he told me he ALMOST broke his own rule which is basically "don't ask, don't tell"-- if they don't specifically come at you with something you don't offer ANY info, etc-- but since he did make it home, he's glad he stuck to that rule and didn't crack. but now you can see the dilemma he wanted ME to come check on with yall (they always come to ME!!). he's heard so much about the 'honesty is the best policy' fork in the road getting people fucked over while he was locked up, but he pretty much is torn, and i'll sum this up for you guys, cuz I got my own problems. one thing that he said is playing on his head with all this is the date of "home-visit", coming up in less than 1 wk. (normal)....three weeks before his next scheduled office visit.

1) this ordeal was just something his PO hadn't done before (like he hadn't piss tested him til he saw him the 3rd time or so), and will just end up in one of this guy's many files, just like everything else. do and say nothing. not so sure..

2) he was acting a little nervous due to the abrupt first question and prompted just a little bit further inquisitiveness -- but, it will still get lost in the shuffle -- at least for a while. definitely do nothing without feeling him out first, making all the AA/NA meetings between now & his next meeting, etc...

3) It was indeed a routine type of check, but he will be found out prior to his next meeting 1 month from now, or sooner rather than too much later, and either arrested on violation or reprimanded etc...if the warrant isn't already out, and it's just a matter of time. In this scenario he's mentioned he thinks it might be better to 'man up' and just tell the TRUTH as soon as he ties up his few loose ends,the truth being that he doesn't wish to insult his PO's intelligence or waste anymore time than necessary..

OR, 4) he basically got called out, and will definitely not make it to his next meeting, and there's probably already a warrant out.....and he thinks it very unlikely that his parole officer will be coming by alone in 1 week (well, 5.5 days) for his 'home visit'...

anyway. I will end this here because i could drone on about the multitudes of scenarios, and the fact is that the truth probably lies somewhere in between. He wanted me to ask 'my friends' here (lol) in particularabout anyone who has experience with this type of situation with parole or probation AA/NA paperwork either firsthand or otherwise, but also welcomes opinions and related stories. He really feels like a total idiot and extremely remorseful for taking for granted what he swore he never would again.

 

I have some experience with this. I got three felonys and had to go through a program for first time felony offenders called Drug Court to stay out of prison. PO, piss once a week, go before a judge once a week for evaluation, rehab, and meetings.

I went to meetings but I now a lot of people who signed there own papers. Some got away with it and others didn't.

The way I see it is he could fess up and hope his PO takes pity on him or make something up.

Here is a good and true excuse for why the same name is on his papers. Anybody at the meetings generally will sign your paper. If he was friends with a person at a meeting then he could just get them to sign his paper every time. Theres a reason its called Alcoholics Anonymous and Narcotics Anonymous, because its Anonymous. They cant expect you to give the persons full name or telephone number to them to verify the meetings because of personal anonymity.

The only reason this could backfire is if someone from the PO's case load is asked if he was there and found out he wasn't. Even if the signature is different then another persons that went to the same meeting the excuse is still valid.

Take it or leave it, its just my thought on it.

 

Not very experienced with such situations, outside of highschool, that is.

But the way I see it:
He's already fucked, he's going to be fucked, or nothing

If he's already fucked:
Best to fess up, beg for forgiveness

If he's going to be fucked:
Best to start going to meetings to see if he can avoid consequence, and probably best to fess up so the PO is on his side

If nothing:
Best to start going to the meetings to avoid any future problems, and fessing up is probably a bad idea

My advice - go to the meetings again, feel out the PO

Strictly from a logical stand point - also, I suspect you of being the 'he' in this story, and don't like liars +_+

 

Well, here's the way I see it:


If he confesses...then right there, they have written proof and documentation of forgery of a court document/state document, whatever.

This goes back to the ol "don't ask, don't tell'' thing. Basically what Freed was just talking about with anonymity.

If he just claims that he's BEEN going, and that he was just having random people there sign them at random because that's what he saw most of the other people doing, then...there's really no way to prove that he wasn't there... (esp. due to the anonymous nature of the programs, right?)

so the worst that could happen in that situation is he'd maybe get chastised and told that he HAS to have a particular chairperson sign off, and start going for real from now on, but unless he comes right out and comes clean, they would have to literally GO up to the aa/na club in question, and start questioning a bunch of people in a program about someone....when they all believe in the anonymous nature of the group to begin with. I told him, hey dude- don't say anything. feel 'em out.


oh, hey- I hate liars, too. I wouldn't do that type of shit to yall.

 

Yeah, that's how I feel too, but I don't think it could hurt to start going to the meetings again either.

Did he ever mention how big the meetings are?

Okay, I believe you, I think I'm less cynical today =P

 

My advice is talk him into going to the meetings. Their only usually 1 hour.

 

They usually have the same chairperson at a particular meeting. So the PO may be looking for the same sig. If he's going to the same two meetings each week the PO may be seeing if the same sig is on there. The meetings anonymous so the PO cant verify iiif the sig is legit.