By Srila Prabhupada : http://www.krishna.com/main.php?id=316 Chanting the transcendental vibration Hare Krishna, Hare Krishna, Krishna Krishna, Hare Hare/ Hare Rama, Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare is the sublime method for reviving our transcendental consciousness, or Krishna consciousness. As living spiritual souls, we are all originally Krishna conscious entities, but due to our association with matter from time immemorial, our consciousness is now polluted by the material atmosphere, called maya, or illusion. And what is this illusion? The illusion is that we are all trying to be lords of material nature, while actually we are under the grip of her stringent laws. When a servant artificially tries to imitate the all-powerful master, he is said to be in illusion. We are trying to exploit the resources of material nature, but actually we are becoming more and more entangled in her complexities. Therefore, although we are engaged in a hard struggle to conquer nature, we are becoming ever more dependent on her. This illusory struggle against material nature can be stopped at once by revival of our eternal Krishna consciousness. Krishna consciousness is not an artificial imposition on the mind. This consciousness is the original energy of the living entity. When we hear and chant the transcendental vibration Hare Krishna, Hare Krishna, Krishna Krishna, Hare Hare/ Hare Rama, Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare, this consciousness is revived. This simplest method of meditation is recommended by learned authorities for this age. By practical experience also, one can perceive that by chanting this maha-mantra, or the Great Chant for Deliverance, one at once feels transcendental ecstasy coming through from the spiritual stratum. In the material concept of life we are busy in the matter of sense gratification, as if we were in the lower, animal stage. A little elevated from this status of sense gratification, one engages in mental speculation for the purpose of getting out of the material clutches. A little elevated from this speculative status, when one is intelligent enough, one tries to find out the supreme cause of all causes, within and without. And when one is factually on the plane of spiritual understanding, surpassing the stages of sense, mind, and intelligence, one is situated on the transcendental plane. The chanting of the Hare Krishna mantra is directly enacted from this spiritual platform, and thus this sound vibration surpasses all lower strata of consciousness—namely sensual, mental, and intellectual. There is no need, therefore, to understand the language of the mantra, nor is there any need of any mental speculation or intellectual adjustment for chanting this maha-mantra. It springs automatically from the spiritual platform, and thus anyone can take part in the chanting without any previous qualification and dance in ecstasy. We have seen this practically. Even a child can take part in the chanting and dancing. Of course, for one who is too entangled in material life, it takes a little more time to come to the standard point, but even such a materially engrossed person is very quickly raised to the spiritual platform. When the mantra is chanted by a pure devotee of the Lord, it has the greatest effect on hearers, and therefore this chanting should be heard from the lips of a pure devotee of the Lord, so that immediate effects can be achieved. As far as possible, chanting from the lips of nondevotees should be avoided, just as one would avoid milk touched by the lips of a serpent because it has poisonous effects. The word Hara is a form of addressing the energy of the Lord, and the words Krishna and Rama (which mean "the highest pleasure eternal") are forms of addressing the Lord Himself. Hara is the supreme pleasure energy of the Lord, and when addressed as Hare in the vocative, She helps us to reach the Supreme Lord. The material energy, called maya, is also one of the multienergies of the Lord, and we, the living entities, are the marginal energy of the Lord. The living entities are described as superior to the material energy. When this superior energy is in contact with the inferior energy, an incompatible situation arises, but when the superior marginal energy is in contact with the spiritual energy, Hara, the living entity is established in his happy, normal condition. These three words, namely Hare, Krishna, and Rama, are the transcendental seeds of the maha-mantra. The chanting is a spiritual call for the Lord and His internal energy Hara to protect the conditioned soul. This chanting is exactly like the genuine cry of a child for its mother. Mother Hara helps the devotee achieve the grace of the Supreme Father, Hari or Krishna, and the Lord reveals Himself to the devotee who chants this mantra sincerely. Therefore no other means of spiritual realization is as effective in this age of quarrel and hypocrisy as the chanting of the maha-mantra: Hare Krishna, Hare Krishna, Krishna Krishna, Hare Hare, Hare Rama, Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare.
I like this , but then I think every name of Krishna is the same , it reveals the Lord to the devotee, because his name and him are not different from each other, they are one and the same, so he is there in every name of God.
That's a great SP quote...I used to have a recording of him speaking it and I'm sure it's still available...in fact, it was on the very first recording produced of Prabhupada chanting Hare Krishna and other standard temple songs and bhajans. Yes, SP did state that God has unlimited names and the chanting of any of them is spiritually effective...but always stressed that the Hare Krishna Maha-Mantra was the most powerful of all and instructed his followers, initiated or not, to chant it regularly as their primary sadhana.
You can listen to it from this page: http://realaudio.krishna.org/ You might notice that the piece Jedi pasted is not word perfect. (not that Jedi is to blame).
there are all equal but one may have particular affections for which name to chant much like one may consider many of the opposite sex attractive but one will choose but one to fall in love
And also, the word hara means that which removes or takes away. Except by inference, it is not a reference to the divine energy as SP translates it. Hara is a name for Lord Shiva. The word Hare, however, is a form of the word Hari. Hari also means the same as Hara essentially and is the name of Narayana. And through the word Hare, we are again only repeating the name of the Lord. The whole spiel about internal energy and mother Hara (Hara is masculine gender, and so cannot be used for mother) is purely contrived, for what purpose I don't know. Such blatant linguistic errors are the biggest reason why I refuse to accept SP as a scriptural authority. It is the same reason that George W. Bush could never be seriously accepted as a Shakespeare critic.
::giggles:: Oh wow...I had a bad mental image there...I blame it on the Shakespeare class I'm in this semester....hehehe... I don't know Bhaskar, I mean, ok...the man may not have been the best with English or what have you or even at Vashnavism...you know...but his intent was sincere...he wanted to bring people back to God...and you know...if anything, he did spread the word about Krishna far and wide and got people to chant/do japa...and served as a gateway for many, myself included. If I give him no other credit...I give him that that he got people on the way to spirituality...if it weren't for SP...who knows what kind of person I'd be...or if I'd be in this forum right now (or at this uni, or my mental state...)... How about the rest of us who weren't born into Hinduism...where would we be? I'm sure I am not the only one who has used SP as a gateway (and there are some who are still his followers)...::shrug::
Nicole, you got right to the essence. Bhaskar, you had the good (karmic) fortune to be born, obviously well, in India and brought up with all of this, but...look at the big pic, if it weren't for Srila Prabhupada, odds are incalculably huge that none of us Westerners would be on this board discussing the glories of Krishna and the Hare Krishna Mantra with you. He was a preacher, not a pandit, and he succeeded astoundingly well with the mission that his guru charged him with, to bring knowledge of Krishna to the entire world...only a liberated soul with Krishna's direct blessing could have done what he did. If SP took a translational liberty here and there, big deal, the mantra and the message got across. Don't use SP's texts as your sources if you don't agree with translational points in them..but dumb ol' George W as a Shakespeare critic is not a good analogy to SP and the Vedas.
'There are more things in heaven and earth than are dreamt of in your philosophy Srila Prabhupada' In fairness, I agree with Spook and Nicole that Prabhupada has been instrumental in kindling the interest of many in Indian philosophy and yoga. My understanding gleaned from his books is that the word Hara is supposed to represent the yogamaya or 'internal potency' of Krishna, rather than the external maya in which we are ensnared. How accurate a translation of the word it is, I couldn't say. But in general, I think it's important to remember that the philosophy of language, esp that of Saussure, says that language is not fixed in it's meaning - it changes and evolves over time. In the end, although the orthodox may not accept it, I think ALL words are a man made phenomenon - one can get too pedantic about it all. Really, with chanting, the words are not that important. If a given word represents God or Divine Mother for a given individual, then so far as I can see, thats ok.
I never denied any of things you guys said. Sure he did a lot of good things, Ive credited him for that before. All I'm saying is I could never accept him as an authority on scripture because of his wild mistranslation. Now Bill, what you say about language evolving is well and good, but that is how the meanings of original scriptures get lost and confounded resulting in Jehovah's Witnesses and the like. Yes, the words are not that important, in the sense you say, but it is definitely more meaningful if done with knowledge. Music is pleasing to all, but it is a source of much greater joy to the one who clearly understands the play of ragas and the intricate systems of timing and rhythm.
Yes Bhaskar -what I mean is that God sees beyond the form of words used - the sincere cry of the soul is what matters. The inner devotion and aspiration. Even if one were just to say 'God, God, God' that would be enough if one was sincere and focused enough. It might even be better for some, as I've read in several places that the way a Mantra is pronounced is important, and any irregularity can lead to bad results. Even our friend SP warns against offences while chanting the Maha Mantra - so unless one can get the Mantra from a qualified and realized guru, it could just lead to anxieties etc if someone felt they had to be absolutely correct in the words used. Many young western people though will get Mantras from books or even wbsites. Fully agree that the changing meaning of words leads to all sorts of trouble. Incidentally, Sri Aurobindo said that it was on this basis that he'd rediscovered the true inner meaning of the Rig Veda.
I think it would be wrong to think that there is only one translation to a mantra, just because you are unaware of one meaning does not mean necessarily mean that it is not true or that it is mistranslated. Anyway, no matter what the translation might be, the essence of it will not and does not change just based on who is saying it. What will you do if this person that you dislike and so willingly slander turns out to the be greatest devotee of God? It is not enough to meerly say there is no duality, one has to try to seek to destroy the demons with in his own mind (and sorry for the preaching , but I just felt like saying it) .
There are manyt ranslations, but I would be very surprised indeed if you could come up with a plausible etymological derivation for his version of it. If he were a great devotee, he would not go around making racist misogynistic comments. Nor would he go around name-calling great masters like Ramakrishna. Further, I never said anything other than "I cannot aCCEPT HIM AS AN AUTHORITY ON SCRIPTURE." I even gave my reason for the statement. Yes, there is no duality, but there is utter confusion the moment you confuse standpoints. If you wish to take this discussion to the absolute standpoint, there is no prabhupada, jedi, or Bhaskar, there is only brahman. Therefore no discussion remains. However, since the discussion is based in the world of vyavaharika satta (relative reality) which si dualistic in nature, it must of necessity conform to those parameters. You cannot describe a sunrise from the standpoint of the sun.
This is from 'The Cloud of Unknowing', an anonymous 14th century christian mystical work. "Just as the meditation of those who seek to live the contemplative life comes without warning, so too do their prayers....their own personal prayers rise spontaneously to God, without bidding or premeditation, beforehand or during their prayer. If they are in words, as they seldom are, then they are of very few words; the fewer the better. If it is a little word of one syllable, I think it is better than if it is of two, and more in accordance with the work of the Spirit. For a contemplative should always live at the highest, topmost peak of spirituality. We can illustrate this by looking at nature. A man or woman, suddenly frightened by fire or death, or what you will, is suddenlky in his extremity of spirit driven hastily and by neccessity to cry for help. And how does he do it? Not, surely, with a spate of words; not even in a single word of two syllables! Why? He thinks it wastes too much time to declare his urgent need and his agitation. So he bursts out in his terror with one little word, and that of a single syllable: 'Fire!' it may be, or 'Help!' Just as this little word stirs and pierces the ears of the hearers more quickly, so too does a little word of one syllable, when it is not merely spoken or thought, but expresses also the intention in the depth of our spirit. Which is the same as the 'height' of our spirit, for in these matters height, depth, legnth and breadth all mean the same. And it pierces the ears of Almighty God more quickly than any long psalm churned out un-thinkingly. That is why it is written 'short prayer penetrates Heaven'. Why does it penetrate Heaven, this short little prayer of one syllable? Surely because it is prayed with a full heart, in the height and depth and legnth and breadth of him that prays it. In the height, for it is with all the might of his spirit; in the depth, for in this little syllable is contained all that the spirit knows; in the legnth for it should always feel as it does now, it would always cry to God as it now cries; in the breadth, for it would extend to all men what it wills for itself...................if he through grace were to cry such a short syllable in the height, depth, legnth and breadth of his spirit, he would always be heard because of this anguished cry, and be helped by God."
Actually, let me take back what I have said and let me rephrase it: I think it does change the essence of something based on who is changing it, however, it does not change in essence if it remains unchanged through out. How does one know whether something is true in essence? - well, this is when one should turn to GURU, SHASTRA and SADHU. A guru does not make up stuff, he bases it on shastra and he can't just do that because he feels like it- there is a sadhusanga that correlates to what he says. Don't accept him as an authority I dont' care but don't dare deride him , because the things he says correlates to what Sri Vaishnavas say and to what Gaudiya Vaishnavas say, and he only talks about God.
And you Spook had the fortune to listen to an authentic Gita with out getting slapped by millions of 'not a clue' translations.
