mentally disabled ppl , heaven or hell

if either exist then how do ppl who mentally cant think for themselves or dont know what sin or good is or how to pray or any of that stuff end up in heaven or hell ?


always wondered

 

One more reason not to believe in the black/white concept of heaven and hell

But maybe (if that does exist) is about how people live their lives according to their own capacities.. even if those capacities are not 'normal'.. or sth like that..

 

God knows our heart. Even if our bodies are disfunctional and our minds are wrong, Jesus still knows our heart. He knows what decisions we would have made if we had not been mentally ill. This is because he lives where there is no time. He can be in the past, present and future all at once.Pretty mind blowing but true all the same...ain't he awesome!

Roly.xxx

 

But, according to the bible people who are not "normal" are not children of god. This is what I was told by a Christian friend. (She was chatting with a woman about her autistic child)

 

Some Christians believe that a 'non-normal child' (like spastic, down-syndrom or otherwise physically or mentally handicapt) is a curse from God.. on the family itself (because a familymember did or didn't do something). Other Christians believe that such a child is a test of faith from God.. or that God gives them such a child because He knows that they are good enough parents to deal with it.

People who believe in reincarnation and karma however, believe that being handicapped is either a punishment for something you did in a previous life.. or an experience you have to go through.

 

Can totally understand that. My brother has learning difficulties* and a friend of my parents explained that special children are only given to special parents.

I think the creator made disabled people to teach lessons to the rest of us (about compassion for example). And they are learning too in some capacity.

For me everyone goes to 'heaven', if only be default because I don't believe in hell.

*kind of a mild for of autistism.

 

Thats not true...you've been lied too (probably not intentionally)

Much love, Roly.xxx

 

Special people are just that. It's like they are a gift from God. Have you ever partipated in volunteering for the special olympics? They are such a joy to work with. They can teach you a lot about life. And they have huge hearts. I truly think that God made them as a gift. They will go to heaven, even if they don't quite grasp concepts. It's all part of God's plan.

 

nothern....i love your sig!!!!!

 

Ahh I was there durring the conversation. Then I questioned my friend about what she ment.

 

Awwww...thank you...

 

That's what it's all about. My grandmother's cousin was mentally disabled. We took care of her for a while. It was like seeing the innocence of a child in a senior's body. As a child, she always made me smile. I think I'm a better person as a result of her being in my life. If heaven exists, she's there.

As a small boy, I've learned to recognize and embrace those who are mentally as well as physically disabled. If God hadn't put these people in my life growing up, I have to wonder if I would feel any different.

 

they should know to believe and that should be enough

 

No, aint he a fictional Jewish character is some big long book that's full of rubbish.

 

Gosh, I wonder what explanation makes more sense. I've been stonewalled by Christians with "we're not meant to understand some things" or "some people are supposed to endure such and such to bring them closer to God" or "God can do whatever he wants!"( spoken very emphatically, when they're cornered with a question they can't begin to answer).

 

I can not speak for the judeo-christain answer on that but I do know the muslim one as said by our prophet(peace and blessing of Allah be upon him):
Anas said: the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Four (kinds of people) will be brought forth on the Day of Resurrection: the infant, the insane, the one who died during the Fatrah (the period between two prophets) and the very old man. All of them will speak in their own defence, then the Lord, may He be blessed and exalted, will say to a neck of Hell, ‘Come forth!’ and He will say to them, ‘I used to send Messengers to My slaves from amongst themselves. Now I am the Messenger of Myself to you. Enter this (i.e., the Fire).’ Those who are decreed to be among the doomed will say, ‘O Lord, how could we enter it when we are trying to escape it?’ And those who are decreed to be among the blessed will rush to enter it. And Allaah will say: ‘You would have been more disobedient towards My Messengers.’ So those will enter Paradise and those will enter Hell.” Narrated by Abu Ya’laa, 4224.

 

cabdirazzag:

Very interesting... but would you maybe rephrase it yourself so it makes a tiny bit more sense? I've never read the Koran/Quraan so I'm not too familiar with it..

I does remind me of a passage in the Bible.. which I don't know by heart but is something along the lines of that God makes a difference between people who do good and people that don't. But then that's the initial question here.. what is 'good' and how to mentally disabled people know that? Well.. if you believe in God you might think that he's the only one who truly knows and we simple humans are making all kinds of laws for the obvious ones.. but only when we will be judged we'll know for sure if we lived ok. So pure of heart may be the most important.. and who are more pure than infants, mentally disabled, animals etc? Since they live by instinct.. if you don't have a clear moral.. you don't have a wrong moral either.. or sth like that.

I was raised Catholic by the way but lived in a rural area with a lot of fundy-protestants for a while so that how I know some of their ideas. I'm neither of the mentioned religions now by the way.

 

You have to excuse me, I have this thing where I [sometimes] post alot of quotes and perhaps even confuse people.

Secondly, what I quoted recently was not Quran but a hadith- a narration from the prophet(peace and blessing be upon him) which was observed by his compansions and those generations following them while the Koran is extremly different and written in a whole other way, sense it's recited and memorized in a completly different style. I recently finished memorazing half of it and I have around 14 chapters left out of 30. Theres a quite wide difference, an example of a hadith is for instance:

"The most perfect believers are the best in conduct and best of you are those who are best to their wives." (Ibn-Hanbal, No. 7396)

while the example of koran is this:

Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things.[sura(chapter) Al-Baqarah(The cow) 2.256]

But it should also be noted that this is only and intrepation of the quran in english and can never replace the quran in arabic

I can agree to much of that, you will only get to know what you receive as results after the test has been corrected by the teacher and the teacher hands it over to you, before this event you can only hope[a good result] or fear[a bad one].

It wouldn't make sense to most people if all infants were told that they were to be given hell because of lack of good deeds but on the other hand, where would the justice be if all infants would be given heaven even though there could be a possibility that they would grow up as murderers, rapers or what ever. A pure heart for the moment, but how would this hold in the future?
Just interesting to know what you think...[/quote]

What are you then If I may ask, asking quite kindly, curious and rude at the same time?

 

What I am? Hehe.. oh my.. ehm.. basically.. I'm interested. I'm interested in religions and their philosophy.. for me, I find a lot of things that I recognise from my own values and morals in Zenbuddism (the 8 folded path is something that I totally agree upon.. plus zen isn't really a religion it's more of a way of life, since there are no gods that are worshipped).. and on the other hand I'm pretty much into paganism lately.. the whole 'one with nature' thing is some I'm very attracted to spiritually.. also because a lot of things like tarotcards and runes can be seen as a way to reach your own subconscieus .. it's a great tool for introspection.

I think the combination of those two, plus me being a vegetarian and a 'people pleaser' etc. make 'hippie' the best definition for me. The long long hair does help a bit with that as well

It's more a way of life than a true religion.. but then again.. in the end I think every individual has their own unique (view of their) religion.

I'm pretty much openminded so I'm always interested in reading/hearing about other religions.. but it helps a lot if the person where it's coming from isn't trying to convert but is just sharing information.

Hope this answers your question a little.. if you want to know/share/ask more, feel free! If it's too offtopic for this thread feel free to PM me