Men and women being “equal”

Discussion in 'Democracy' started by WomenPower, Mar 26, 2021.

  1. stormountainman

    stormountainman Soy Un Truckero

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    In Liberal states like California and Colorado women can go topless. It is the Republican Trump states which are conservative and religious and stand against freedom for women. You should consider moving. Liberal states support equal pay for equal work for women. The Republican states have always voted for less pay for women and minorities. The Christian Right Wing Extremists in the Republican states think they have entitlement to free labor from women and Blacks. They enforced slavery against Blacks and did not allow women to vote. These southern extremists and Christian extremists are a terrible people. You should not live among them. Just move to a good place where people are nice.
     
  2. WomenPower

    WomenPower Members

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    So women in California and Colorado are just walking around topless anywhere they please?? I don’t think so.
     
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  3. Balbus

    Balbus Senior Member

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    WomenPower

    Not sure what you mean?

    What is your definition of equality?

    In what way do you think men and women should be treated unequally?
     
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  4. TrudginAcrossTheTundra

    TrudginAcrossTheTundra Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    You're looking for problems that aren't there. Women and minorites have the advantage when it comes to jobs. White males are at the bottom of the list. If you don't realize that then you simply haven't been paying attention to what's happening on the ground. Maybe your head is buried in social justice hysteria. Go visit any institution and find out what's really happening. Your lack of real world observation is embarrassing. But it's something you could easily fix.

    Everyone knows life isn't fair. It's not your fault that your parents didn't teach you real world skills. You could be born to parents who thought their own instant gratification was more important than preparing their child. That splitting up was better for everyone. There's a ton of bad things that happen and could happen to you. You're never going to be a Bill Gates, an Elon musk, a Jeff Bezos, etc. That's okay, get over it and do your best. People who do less than their best tend to turn out bitter. Don't be that guy. Do the best you can with what you've got and accomplish something. Stop comparing yourself to others. We're all unique.

    "Fairer Society" - how do you accomplish that? Is it fairer to force communism such that nobody but the elite own anything? Or is it fairer to allow everyone to be free to follow their dreams and potentials? What is "fairer" in your imagination? Nobody could say NO to the word "fairer". Asking if someone is for fairer is completely meaningless. It's not even a question. That's why we have so much trouble communicating, much less agreeing; you fail to abide by "The Four Agreements".
     
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  5. TrudginAcrossTheTundra

    TrudginAcrossTheTundra Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    Actually, if it excludes anyone it would be you because you discriminate and you're exclusionary.
    We're tolerant and there's room for everybody.
     
  6. TrudginAcrossTheTundra

    TrudginAcrossTheTundra Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    Check it out. "The Republican states have always voted for less pay for women and minorities." -- that should tell you all you need to know about this guy. You've seen the kind of people who'd sell their own mother if they could benefit. Nothing is sacred.
     
  7. Flagme15

    Flagme15 Members

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    the diatribe of an insecure person.
     
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  8. stormountainman

    stormountainman Soy Un Truckero

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    Republicans are not tolerant.
     
  9. stormountainman

    stormountainman Soy Un Truckero

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    On a side note -- and related because it covers the Republican regard for women -- Matt Gaetz is being investigated for a relationship with a 17 year old girl. It sounds like they picked up lots from Jefferey Epstein, huh?
     
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  10. Flagme15

    Flagme15 Members

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    Just saw where Ghislaine Maxwell has another charge against her. Providing a fourteen year old girl for Epstein.
     
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  11. Balbus

    Balbus Senior Member

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    Trudge

    I ask again - if any person is doing the same job and not getting the same pay then do you think that fair and equitable? That where gender or race is a factor then would it be fair or equitable. Were someone is on the same grade as someone else and getting paid differently due to them been of a different gender or race then would it be fair or equitable.

    And any rational and reasonable person would work toward making it fairer and better.

    Why would you not want a fairer society? It made society fairer to give women the vote would you have opposed that? It made society fairer to stop slavery would you have opposed that?

    So did your parents teach you to just accept things and not try and improve your and others lives?

    I mean if you have an attitude of ‘life isn’t fair’ then you are likely to just accept your lot whereas if your attitude it that things should be better and fairer you are likely to want fight to improve not only your own life but society in general.

    And any rational and reasonable person would work toward mitigating them and making society fairer and better

    As said any rational and reasonable would try to improve things including looking at the society they life in and wanting it to be a fairer and better place to live in.

    Sorry but the one that is coming across as bitter is you – its you that growls that ‘‘life isn’t fair’ and is constantly comparing yourself to others and seems to think they are doing better than you so shouldn’t be helped.

    As said any rational and reasonable would try to improve things including looking at the society they life in and wanting it to be a fairer and better place to live in.

    By supporting the things that would make your society better and fairer – by not just accepting that ‘life isn’t fair’ and therefore accepting unfairness.

    But again we have been through this - As stated my vision for the future like many lefties is for a place where people can live healthy, prosperous lives and everyone can fulfil their potential. And the policies and ideas I often talk about explain and promote are about bringing that vision about such as universal healthcare, welfare, education, training, and a new green deal amongst others.

    We have been through this before as well – I’ll repeat it is often easier to ask what is unfair

    People can decide which side of history they want to be on.

    Do people want a fairer society or not - slavery was not fair, women not having the vote was unfair – these things may seem obvious now but there were many people that were against them.

    There are many cases of institutional and societal inequality today in the US, are you on the side of there been a fairer society or not?

    But this is the thing you do seem to be saying NO to a fairer and better society.

    Sorry but it seems to me that the difficulty here is your refusal to debate honestly

    Is the "The Four Agreements" from the self-help book?

    If so - isn’t the first rule about been honest and taking responsibility for what you say - and how does that fit in with your refusal to answer questions or address the many outstanding criticisms of your views in any rational or reasonable way?
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2021
  12. Balbus

    Balbus Senior Member

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    Trudge

    And this seems to be it – you seem to have a world view that sees anything to the left of your own position as ‘communism’ and since you seem to have been indoctrinated into believing ‘communism’ is the big EVIL then anything to the left of you own position is by definition EVIL.

    It’s like you feel you have to attack anyone that has view even slightly to the left of your own as devils that need purging from the world, while keeping you fingers firmly stuck in your ears so you cannot be tainted by evil.

    Its like you have to attack what’s said not because you have a better or even coherent argument but because it is EVIL communism – you don’t seem to care if what is said makes sense or holds up to scrutiny while yours doesn’t.

    But is wanting a fairer and better society evil?

    Look I keep asking you this – why is it you seem unable to defend your ideas in any rational and reasonable way – I mean if they were any good wouldn’t you be able to?
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2021
  13. wrat1

    wrat1 Members

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    what is fair?
    Fair | Definition of Fair by Merriam-Webster (merriam-webster.com)
    adj
    b(1): conforming with the established rules : ALLOWED
    (2): consonant with merit or importance : DUE a fair share

    If the above is true then who made the rules for 1b?
    Also who made the rules for 2?

    Equal | Definition of Equal by Merriam-Webster (merriam-webster.com)
    Noun
    1: one that is equal
    insists that women can be absolute equals with men— Anne Bernays

    is that the definition that would be agreed on?

    Is everybody absolutely equal?
     
  14. Balbus

    Balbus Senior Member

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    Wrat1

    Well I’ve already explained what I mean by equality in the context of the thread, twice.

    As to definitions of what is fair – I’ll ask again - was slavery in your view fair? Were women not having the vote in your view fair? Is someone getting less pay for the same work because of their gender or race fair in your view? Is voter suppression in your view fair?
     
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  15. stormountainman

    stormountainman Soy Un Truckero

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    I want to know about her provisioning to Donald Trump!
     
  16. stormountainman

    stormountainman Soy Un Truckero

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    People who sell their own mother are exactly like Donald Trump. Go and ask Mary Trump.
     
  17. TrudginAcrossTheTundra

    TrudginAcrossTheTundra Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    All this to say "I can't tell you what's FAIR, but I can toss around examples of UNFAIR". Brilliant. Let's get YOU into office to solve all our woes.

    About the only substantive statement in all those paragraphs is:
    "the policies and ideas I often talk about explain and promote are about bringing that vision about such as universal healthcare, welfare, education, training, and a new green deal amongst others."
    Which can be translated to "let's take all that excess money from those evil rich fuckers so they can pay for our bad choices and we can continue to be lazy unproductive slobs with no accountability - oh, and let's cripple their ability to travel and produce while we're at it. That's fair!"
    "Yes, c'mon man, I know that disincentives production, will ruin the military, leave our country starving, and begging to be taken over by a country who was smarter, but I'll be long gone by then and will have gotten mine. They won't blame me for being mean, they'll say I had a big heart, and no brain. Stood for more fairness, meant well, just very selfish and nearsighted."
     
  18. wrat1

    wrat1 Members

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    What I think does not matter in the context of agreeing upon the definition of what is being discussed.
    who decides what is fair? is it the same in everybody's eyes?
    so what you mean by equality is not the same as the dictionary?
     
  19. stormountainman

    stormountainman Soy Un Truckero

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    I just saw an article which told Matt Gaetz was the lone vote against a human trafficking bill back in 2017. Human Trafficking is the usual term for the business of selling and renting the human flesh of underage girls. It's what Maxwell is being charged with, it what Donald Trump's friend Epstein was charged with. Now it seems that Matt Gaetz had a buddy by the name of Goldberg - also a Florida guy - who was financially supporting a troop of people including a 14 year old girl ... in exchange for sex. The new evidence now shows Matt Gaetz was paying for this 17 year old to fly and travel with him. The article wasn't clear about if he had met her through Goldberg. Several articles are reporting that he announced that he would not run again, after he was caught with his pants down. So much for Republicans and their idea of EQUALITY FOR WOMEN, huh? Maybe Republicans think women have equality when they work in the sex trade because of severe poverty?
     
    Flagme15 likes this.
  20. Balbus

    Balbus Senior Member

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    Trudge

    LOL wow man a lot of BOLD type there

    You really do seem to want to fight the corner of those ‘evil rich fuckers’ don’t you

    And why do you seem to hate everyone else – I mean to you everyone other than the very wealthy are lazy slobs – why do you direct so much hate toward the majority of your fellow citizens but have so much love for the super-rich?

    In what way would higher taxation for the wealthiest in society ruin your military and leave you country starving?

    Again, its that over-the-top exaggeration about anything left wing - that indoctrination that seems to have you equating any view left of your own as all out communism

    Oh and I’m sure I'm not the only one thats noticed you still are not answering questions or address the many criticisms of your views.
     
    Tyrsonswood likes this.

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