Jesus LIVED for you!

Discussion in 'Christianity' started by BlackBillBlake, Jan 4, 2005.

  1. BlackBillBlake

    BlackBillBlake resigned HipForums Supporter

    Why does no-one evr say this?

    Jesus lived for you -or lives for you even.

    Why the focus on death? It's as if what he actually said whilst living on earth were somehow less important than the fact that He died.
  2. Sera Michele

    Sera Michele Senior Member

    I have wondered the same myself. When traveling over the holidays I came across a billboard that said something like "Jesus paid the price" and it looked like it was written in dripping blood. I thought it was pretty distasteful.

    But I assume that guilt and fear is the best way to spread the meme (the idea). More people will believe in the religion if they feel obligated, or fearful. Christianity has always been aggressive in the spread of it's beliefs (and even more so in the past than today), and that is likely the reason for it's success.
  3. Good point! Since I don't believe Jesus was here to save us from original sin and stuff, but to show us the way to God, I think his life was far more important than his death.
  4. roly

    roly Senior Member

    Yes he did...HE IS ALIVE (in a non-elvis way :p )
  5. thumontico

    thumontico Member

    If you knew that everything in the Bible was true except that you would not live on after death how committed would you be to the Christian message?
  6. mosaicthreads

    mosaicthreads Member

    I agree that to focus on the fact that he lived is much more positive, as John does in John 3:16 (I believe) when he says that "God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten son..." (my paraphrase from memory, sorry if it isn't accurate to the letter. :) )

    I think the fact is that the scriptures were written in a culture that is very foriegn to our western minds. They understood the concept of a blood sacrifice be necessary to cleanse one's self before being able to approach a god, because it was very much a part of thier culture. We do not have anything like this in western culture and are appalled by the concept. Also the modern organized church has gone to great lengths to popularize the concept of an individual/personal relationship with God, so we have lost the concepts of a communal relationship and the need for any communal atonement.

    I think this cultural difference between the way of thinking of the original/easteren writers and the modern/western reader has let to a lot of confusion, misunderstanding, and abuse of the scriptures by the modern church and especially by the popular fundemental televangilists.

    Just my 2 cents. But what do I know, I'm just an old hippie Jesus Freak. :rolleyes:
  7. BlackGuardXIII

    BlackGuardXIII fera festiva

    My commitment would not change one iota. But I don't know that, and I believe in an afterlife, so it is a moot point.
  8. TrippinBTM

    TrippinBTM Ramblin' Man

    What, should you only try to live right because you think there's a reward for you? Is that the right way to live? Give to give, love to love...don't give to be given to, or love in order to be loved.

    And anyways, why does the reward have to come after death? If we all really lived like real Christians (or Buddhists, or whatever), wouldn't the world be a more peaceful, enjoyable place? Isn't that much of the point? Making a better world for us and others to live in?

    Also, Jesus taught to live for the moment, not to obcess over the future...that includes the afterlife.
  9. BlackBillBlake

    BlackBillBlake resigned HipForums Supporter

    I don't see that focusing on Jesus death would make us believe in an afterlife any more than Him simply telling us it is so.

    Also, what is 'the Christian message'? Is it that this world is screwed, so we may as well hope for a better existence in another place later on, or that we can live in harmony and peace here on earth? Or a mix of the two?

    If we believe that in Saint Augustine's words we should just 'wait for death', then why, for example should we feel pity for tsunami victims etc?

    Jesus said God is a 'God of the Living' - not of the dead.
  10. arlia

    arlia Members

    jesus still lives for us!
    his body may have dies,but he conquered death and rose from the dead,and his spirit lives here on earth in gods children
  11. thumontico

    thumontico Member

    Everything that the Bible says. Its validity itself. Would it be so defended if you would get nothing from it [afterlife]?

    However, you answer my question in that 'wait for death' bit. Your entire life is pointless if not for the next life. I would live my life to live it, not to die eventually. I pity those who cannot live their life longer than they could have naturally. I also pity those whose life is turned upside down. I will not live on after I die, yet I still have compassion.
  12. Kharakov

    Kharakov ShadowSpawn

    Yes, because for many people, the afterlife is the only hope they have. Why would you hold on to a miserable earthly existence of serving the rich and powerful if you did not get conned into it with the promise of a good life in the future?

    Rich people perpetuate this myth because it salves their conscience (they do not feel any guilt) and keeps the peons in line.
    Peons perpetuate this myth because it is the brightest hope they have and it causes some rich people to give to the poor (although this is a farce as well).

    Logic: If God wanted to give you riches, God could give them to you now.
  13. thumontico

    thumontico Member

  14. Spinor

    Spinor Member

    This is all true, and it is not true.
  15. Kilgore Trout

    Kilgore Trout Senior Member

    Jesus peed for us.
  16. atropine

    atropine Member

    1. the main problem is, what is the true definition of real Christians. many people are very good, peaceful people, and follow the words of the bible. many people would see them as real christians. then there are other people, slightly more extremists, who damn people to hell and tell people how evil they are. to them they are real christians, and some of the first catagory dont come close. to me, the religion itself has nothing to do with it, but if people can live to try to make the world a better place, by being nicer and more helpful to others, then wouldnt THAT make the world a more peaceful, enjoyable place. problems with anything..

    2. jesus was an essene (sp?). ie, a somewhat apocalyptic jew.(am i right..) if im correct he spent his whole life waiting for the apocalypse. i consider that obsessing over the future, not living for the moment..

    just my 2c
  17. BlackGuardXIII

    BlackGuardXIII fera festiva

    I feel pretty good about the chances of my soul escaping this flesh when my last breath and last heartbeat have happened. I am not at all sure of it, just have seen things that I consider strong evidence that death is not the end.

    Material things are impermanent, even galaxies do not last forever.
    Spirit is what I feel is the only eternal reality, and therefore the rest is just a temporary illusion.
    I have no recollection of past lives, nor have I had a near death experience. I have met those who have though, and they are very honest people. So I believe them.

    Isaac Asimov is a well known atheist, and I admire him a lot. He once said that he tries to be a good person in order for society to be a better place, and in the hope that others will be good to him. A post mortem goody bag for being nice was not needed by him, and it was also strongly believed to not be a real possibility by him.
    Gertrude Stein said, "Dead is dead."
    I like these writers, but my belief is different, and that is great, I think.
  18. TrippinBTM

    TrippinBTM Ramblin' Man

    Seems that someone who lives like Jesus would be a true christian. Not someone who believe in the salvation, but someone who lives it. That is a major difference.

    I agree religion has nothing to do with it. Thats why I added that bit about "Buddhists, or whatever". To be a true christian is to go beyond religion, same with being a true anything, Buddhist, Hindu, Muslim, etc. It's about breaking down walls, not building them (like rhetorical ones based on scriptures).

    I just remember Jesus preaching about not worrying about tomorrow because if God provides for the lilies and birds, he will surely provide for us. Worry doesn't add a day to your life so don't worry.
  19. Rhythmdevil

    Rhythmdevil Member

    I've struggled with this question for a long time. It was always hard for me to see why He would die for all the people on earth. It is a very selfless act to give up life to save all of humanity. Jesus would have been above any of us to make such a decision. But this brings up another question. If Jesus is the son of God, even if He is God Himself, then how is it that man was created in God's image in Genesis?

    The way I have looked at this question is in parallel: If man is created in God's image, then why isn't God in man's image? With this in mind I have been thinking for a while that Jesus wasn't simply the only son of God, but perhaps that He was the first to realize it. Kind of like the Buddha was the first person to achieve enlightenment. Many believers of Theravada Buddhism don't believe that the Buddha was a God, but a man who achieved much. It is possible that Jesus was like the Buddha in that he achieved a notion that no one else had; that we are God's children, and possibly that we all have God inside of us, or God-like qualities about us. For example, God is thought of as an all-knowing, all perfect being, but then again all of us at some point in our lives have believed that we know everything and are perfect people.

    I think the reason that the death of Jesus is looked at with more imporatance than his actual life and teachings, is that people need something to look to. People need to have leaders. People are less afraid of the world and everything in it when they look to something that will right all the wrongs. I'm not saying that Jesus DIDN'T die on the cross for all of our sins, but I am saying that we all need something to look up to for guidance.
  20. BlackBillBlake

    BlackBillBlake resigned HipForums Supporter

    I agree peolpe need something to look up to, but still I don't see why they can't just look at His life and teachings. This is what followers of the Buddha, Krishna and others do; they don't seem to need a symbol of intense suffering and death to get benefit from the teachings of these beings.

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