How Come People Think When They Die They Go To Heaven?

Discussion in 'Christianity' started by thefutureawaits, Jun 26, 2017.

  1. ~Zen~

    ~Zen~ Ancient Mariner Administrator

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    We'd like to hear more about that!
     
  2. Angelmama

    Angelmama Angel Lifetime Supporter

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    Preach it, Zen! I would too, though I do believe the 'religious' stuff.
    I believe in Heaven, but not a literal Hell. I believe that if you don't go to Heaven, you simply cease to exist, because a loving God wouldn't torture people and the words for Hell literally translate to 'the grave'.
     
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  3. scratcho

    scratcho Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    How come people believe pigs can build houses? That bears eat porridge?
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2021
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  4. Tulsa

    Tulsa Members

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    A Near Death Experience or NDE happens when a person dies and is later brought back to life. They tell us what they experienced while they were dead. There are thousands of them on the Internet. The experiences range from being fully aware of what is happening while they were dead to seeing deceased loved ones, a light, and even a glimpse of "Heaven." My NDE was short but it lead to many other experiences and research. I love to help others with the information. The big difference from Religion and NDEs are no judgments or punishments in the spirit world, You are surrounded by a compassionate bright light.

    I hold a small candle
    in the darkness to
    light the beginning
    of their path.

    Soon they will
    follow, bringing
    within them the
    brilliant light that lasts . .

    One of my poems.
     
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  5. Mountain Valley Wolf

    Mountain Valley Wolf Senior Member

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    Why would a loving god allow some people to live eternally in a paradise, but condemn others to nonexistence. God's love is supposed to be unconditional. Many Christians have told me that it is so deep and great that it is beyond human understanding. Then they place all these human conditions of what is good or bad upon this so-called unconditional love. Would an unconditionally loving god be petty and vengeful?

    God gave us free will and put us in a physical realm where we are to experience life. But if we use that free will, and do something he doesn't like---then our whole being is erased. Perhaps there is another way?
     
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  6. Piobaire

    Piobaire Village Idiot

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    ATTENTION EVANGELICALS!
    The notion of spending all eternity in your company is not the selling point that you think it is.
     
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  7. themnax

    themnax Senior Member

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    i think heaven is a name people made up for the bardo/limb/wherever if any, the soul may reside before being born into another random physical life.
    now if there's such a between lives and awareness of being in it, our perspectives aquired by how we've lived will make it seem a heaven or hell,
    even if its really just the one same place. you know expecially if you have any kind of problem about people not looking like you, because it isn't just from this world,
    but from billions of different ones, on which life evolved each in its own way, so maybe if you think people can only look like humans, that would be pretty scarry.

    i'm not sure "going to" is even the right word for what might be a kind of parallel universe in the same place as our own, though occupying no space in it.

    its all, there may be absolutely anything, don't get me wrong about that, but what people tell each other, may not, more likely then not, not have, anything at all to do with it.

    and can i fave what piobaire just said, times infinity.
     
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  8. ~Zen~

    ~Zen~ Ancient Mariner Administrator

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    I like poetry, that's good!
     
  9. Tulsa

    Tulsa Members

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    Thank you very much.
     
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  10. themnax

    themnax Senior Member

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    this was my experience of the one time i flat-lined. near is more the word for it though, my brain did not seem to completely stop functioning. what i saw was like when an old analog tv was tuned to a channel no signal was being transmitted on. there was a feeling of not unwelcome, but of "go back, it isn't yet your time". it happened when i was trying to give blood while i was suffering a prolonged malnourishment.

    also why i believe that while there may very well be gods, or not as the case may be,
    there doesn't have to be for there to be "heaven/bardo/limbos"

    nor does karma, in any way depend on there being judgements, judging or judges.
    nor beliefs nor lack of them.
     
  11. Tulsa

    Tulsa Members

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    Yes, it is very common in NDEs to be told "go back, it is not your time." Especially in attempted suicide events.
    On the God question: In the spirit world God does not seem to be an individual. There are two ways spirits think of God as I know now. One, God is Love, and two, God is All-There-Is, the sum total of everything. I prefer God is Love. Jesus taught that God is Love. I like to call the other side "The Spirit World." We are created there and return there when we die.
     
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  12. DrRainbow

    DrRainbow Ambassador of Love

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    Earth also later carries us to various other galaxies and maybe even in to a black hole.
     
  13. DrRainbow

    DrRainbow Ambassador of Love

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    Why is space never regarded in the question of everlasting life or reincarnation? Excuse me ladies and gentlemen! Have you ever died? Please educate me with your actual experience in death to strengthen your facts a little!!
     
  14. Tulsa

    Tulsa Members

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    One good reason is that in the spirit world there is no time or space.
     
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  15. DrRainbow

    DrRainbow Ambassador of Love

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    Can you please prove that to me?
     
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  16. Tulsa

    Tulsa Members

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    I can't prove it, I can't even imagine it. Just telling you what I was told by my Spirit Guide. He said there were no male or female either. Jesus said there were no marriages. I am thinking Jesus knew what He was talking about. That was before the interpreters got it all messed up.
     
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  17. Tishomingo

    Tishomingo Members

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    Why ask why? Because the Bible sez so!

    What part of the Bible? Revelation 7:4, of course--at least the reference to the 144, 000. That almost didn't make it into the official canon and Martin Luther downgraded its status because the vindictive God it portrayed was too difficult to reconcile with the Father of Jesus, and he relegated it to an appendix. Who wrote it ? John of Patmos. Who was he? Nobody knows. He was some early Christian dude who ended up exiled on the island by Roman authorities and vented his ire in an apocalyptic vision that is a thinly veiled symbolic diatribe against Rome. There must have been good drugs on Patmos. Either that or he was batshit crazy. Actually, though, it follows the pattern of the Book of Daniel, the non-canonical Books of Enoch and Jubilees,and other specimens of apocalyptic literature which were in vogue at the time he wrote it. The 144,000 is derived by multiplying the 12 tribes of Israel by !2000. Presumably, Christians who believe it don't think only Jews are going to heaven. And unfortunately the other gazillion souls are not condemned to nonexistence. OWB takes the Jehovah's Witness view that they will remain on earth forever--an earth presumably degraded by their own misdeeds. Other fundamentalists think they will be tortured and roasted for all eternity because they got it wrong. Does any of this make sense to you? This shows the dangers of taking Scripture too literally.
     
  18. Tishomingo

    Tishomingo Members

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    Does your Spirit Guide tell you these things directly or does (s)he operate through a human medium?
     
  19. Tishomingo

    Tishomingo Members

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    The new HF 10 minute rule for editing posts are too quick for me. In Post 123, when I said John of Patmos wrote Revelation, I should have qualified it for the benefit of the fundamentalists to say that some think he was just taking dictation.
     
  20. Mountain Valley Wolf

    Mountain Valley Wolf Senior Member

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    Space is how we understand physicality. Kant demonstrated that space and time are a-priori concepts of our physical reality. We could say that space-time is the underlying structure of physical reality but all we can ever physically perceive is the present. Therefore space-present is the foundation of physicality. Even Einstein had to use imaginary numbers in order to incorporate time into his calculations.

    We have the three dimensions of space, and the present---that is the totality of the physical realm. The whole concept of mind does not fit very well into the constraints of physicality, and in fact, by definition, the realms of the mind are not physical. Therefore we can remember a past, anticipate a future, and conceive of things that are beyond rationality in a physical sense.

    If there is life after death, obviously it would be mind (a nonphysical) that survives the death of the body (the physical). There is no physical place we can point to and say that is the spirit realm, so clearly what we are referring to is a nonphysical reality. So space, in other words, the reality of our 3 dimensions, is very unlikely to be a significant aspect of life after death.

    There are different possibilities, for example, life after death could represent a higher dimension enveloping our 3 physical dimensions, and then our physical reality would represent only an infinitely thin slice of this higher nonphysical dimension---just as if a 2-dimensional world existed within our 3 dimensional space which would mean that one of our dimensions would be infinitely thin too them, and therefore they would have no concept of it. For example, time would represent that infinitely thin slice of a higher dimension as our only perception of time is the infinitesimal present moment.
     
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