Is it ever permissable? I know the women will come on ,to talk about something they know absolutlely nothing about, but basically only guys would know thiu s. Actually, Im beggining to belive that it has to be. I was fortunate to ever avoid grovelling till this year, when i was 48. This is a great track record- almost unheard of, and kept me young and fresh and in the market for young chicks, but i finally fell , in a natural progression of a mid-life crisis to a beautiful 20 year old who i loved.well, i grovelled till the bitter end to her, and lost all my self pride. But it was something i would have been sorry if I had not have done. Thats because i would have said, what if i hadnt given every chance possible to this? the fact that it was irrational , untenable and absurd to begin with makes little diffrence. Everyone advised me from the begiining that this was wrong and neededd to be stopped in its tracks immiditaly after the initial sexual liasons began to develop into fear and insecurtiy to me, and everyone said I needed to stop contact with her immidiatly. All i am saying is, when you find spomething that is of ultimate importance to you, then a mans worst humiliation, which is being led on and used by a woman who could care less for you, may be natural.basically, im loved something within myself, which was love for something that never had materialised, and I transmogrified that need into a cheap, slutty little riff-raff slut. Not hthat she was a worthless humman being, only that i invested my psyhce onto something that was immmaterial. In other words, I cast my pearls before swine. maybe its Karma.I certainly used and abused women before, however i am NOT a user and abuser.If a man would have treated me the same way this women treated me, if he would have treated me taht way for 5 seconds, i would have said to shit wioth him, yet a wowman does that to me for 4 motnhs, and i acquiese. Its the power of the pussy babay! I try and take away something from this that would prevent being humiliated by , basically a piece of ass, but yet, you gotta wonder if there is any immuity to this shit.