Civil War II (Coming to American in 10-20 years)

Discussion in 'Protest' started by topolm, Jun 16, 2006.

  1. topolm

    topolm Member
    A review:

    The topic is very deserving of discussion. Those who try to dismiss it as silly are either closed-minded or uncomfortable about the topic for hidden political reasons. The concept of a turmoil-ridden America is indeed legitimate and possible. Chittum recognizes that racial identification & racial wars are an absolute. It's not about racial superiority, nor about 'hatred' or lack of interest in one another, it's about differing ideologies and few societies will not dismiss their beliefs without a fight (except perhaps the currently passive white American population). Walk into any multi-ethnic city, look closer beyond just the exotic restaurants and giddy commercialism and you will see there is indeed racial division, businesses and institutions regularly are heavily weighed with one culture and one ideology and those not of the same skin color must always succomb to conformity; neighborhoods are often the same and voting trends are noticeably xenophobic; local-based newspapers especially newsletters also focus on only one or a few very similar races of people and act as political voice (i.e. AsianWeek in San Francisco), and the topics of their discussion are seemingly of antipathy towards other differing cultures and groups and the survival, pride & betterment of their own race. A group culture -- a race -- forms automatically and race-groups do indeed war with each other. Racial conflict and violence based on one race against another is and always has been a fact of life -- different skin colors, different histories, and differing ideologies lead to conflict and war, and this is the reasoning behind Mr. Chittum's literature. The idea that the actual determinant of human collaboration is 'class' or 'wealth' and not race is an absolute hoax -- one need only look at their own workplace or group gathering and ask, "do the various ethnic workers who are all in the same level positions really see eye-to-eye? Can they really let their guard down and speak their minds without hesitation in the same way two people of the same race can?" The answer is obviously "no." Further asking the question "does it usually seem that a conversation between two people of different races is almost always superficial?" Yes. Thus we have the simplest of explanations of human & societal emotions, and when tensions rise which they always do, race-groups war with each other unless one group decides to back down and towards extinction (current white society). Chittum recognizes racial wars far beyond the average person and his book will not let it escape you.

    In my opinion America is held together because the white population is remaining politically submissive and being taken advantage of, but compromise will only last so long before the races reach war.

    Mr. Chittum is a smart man but his book is not commercial and he is not a fluffy PhD academic -- he doesn't take any sides, he wholly admits for example that whites did indeed drive indians into near extinction until compromise was reached, and his focus is always on the reality of such ruthlessness. Interestingly he discusses almost no contemporary politics (except cleverly how affirmative action would bloom into racial preference and divide many institutions in America such as law enforcement), Bill Clinton's name not mentioned once, and focuses his thesis on: the development and reason of war tensions, some historians and military leaders' explanation for battle, the danger a disorganized Mexico poses, other nations and empires both recent and past and their experiences which coincidently mirrors each others' and how history always does repeat itself. He explains militias, gangs, and guerilla tribes.

    I think his reasoning was very fair, I learned that indeed guerilla tribes are much more savage and fight-till-death than 'orderly' government military branches, that our current military bases are designed more for international war and not domestic and are only guarded by a few security guards which could easily be overthrown in the middle of the night by a band of 20 savages who have nothing to lose; furthermore he discusses how he actually witnessed this in Yugoslavia. I agree with him that there is a steady rise of untrained young males in America who would find nihilistic uprising as their only path to happiness, especially as opportunity and economy wither significantly. He does well to explain direct evidence showing even blatant racial division inside the US military.

    I was overwhelmed by his incredible command of knowledge of the depth of corruption in Mexico and how it is a disfunctional govenment. I learned well from his section of "Mao-Tse Tung's three conditions for revolution." One must agree that police are often biased towards the majority population in their region and often let crimes go, as well police departments growing towards the same skin color and ideology of the population to the point of corruption, all learned from reading Mr. Chittum's book that the government will be in a complete bind when at war with it's own citizens because if the government decides to obliterate a large segment of the rebellion they would be viewed negatively, thus increasing political turmoil, but if not using such massive weapons the large uprising would be out of control.

    Chittum proposes that America will continue to grow into disorder because of numerous races, immigrants, and ideologies like that of an empire, and unlike the first Civil War which was mainly North-whites against South-whites, the second Civil War will be about races against each other, and against the government.

    Mr. Chittum gives numerous checklists to keep 'watch' for, as well as discussion of what regions will experience what. His book is only about 200 pages, is quite unorthodox in nature, and is primarily focused on battle and war related tensions, as he served in the militaries of three different countries, all of them during wartimes. The only problem I have with the book is that he did not discuss how a Civil War 2 will put America at risk of international attack, otherwise it is useful. A real life homework task.

    Download the pdf book and read
  2. zeppelin kid

    zeppelin kid Member

    Very unlikely.
  3. topolm

    topolm Member

    No.... Highly likely. You must be a young kid with very little life experience. Its ok, time will teach ya ;-)

    How To Destroy America
    by Dick Lamm

    [​IMG] (Editor's note: A 2004 speech on the dangers of multiculturalism in the United Stated titled "I Have a Plan to Destroy America", became famous after being frequently forwarded as an email. With the immigration debate again heating up, it is time to revisit the speech. Reprinted with permission.)

    We know Dick Lamm as the former Governor of Colorado. In that context his thoughts are particularly poignant. Recently there was an immigration overpopulation conference in Washington, DC, filled to capacity by many of American's finest minds and leaders. A brilliant college professor by the name of Victor Davis Hansen talked about his latest book, Mexifornia, explaining how immigration - both legal and illegal was destroying the entire state of California. He said it would march across the country until it destroyed all vestiges of The American Dream.

    Moments later, former Colorado Governor Richard D. Lamm stood up and gave a stunning speech on how to destroy America. The audience sat spellbound as he described eight methods for the destruction of the United States. He said, "If you believe that America is too smug, too self-satisfied, too rich, then let's destroy America. It is not that hard to do. No nation in history has survived the ravages of time. Arnold Toynbee observed that all great civilizations rise and fall and that 'An autopsy of history would show that all great nations commit suicide.'"

    "Here is how they do it," Lamm said:

    "First, to destroy America, turn America into a bilingual or multi-lingual and bicultural country." History shows that no nation can survive the tension, conflict, and antagonism of two or more competing languages and cultures. It is a blessing for an individual to be bilingual; however, it is a curse for a society to be bilingual. The historical scholar, Seymour Lipset, put it this way: 'The histories of bilingual and bi-cultural societies that do not assimilate are histories of turmoil, tension, and tragedy.' Canada, Belgium, Malaysia, and Lebanon all face crises of national existence in which minorities press for autonomy, if not independence. Pakistan and Cyprus have divided. Nigeria suppressed an ethnic rebellion. France faces difficulties with Basques, Bretons, and Corsicans."

    Lamm went on: Second, to destroy America, "Invent 'multiculturalism' and encourage immigrants to maintain their culture. I would make it an article of belief that all cultures are equal. That there are no cultural differences. I would make it an article of faith that the Black and Hispanic dropout rates are due solely to prejudice and discrimination by the majority. Every other explanation is out of bounds.

    Third, "We could make the United States an 'Hispanic Quebec' without much effort. The key is to celebrate diversity rather than unity. As Benjamin Schwarz said in the Atlantic Monthly recently: 'The apparent success of our own multiethnic and multicultural experiment might have been achieved not by tolerance but by hegemony. Without the dominance that once dictated ethnocentricity and what it meant to be an American, we are left with only tolerance and pluralism to hold us together.' Lamm said, "I would encourage all immigrants to keep their own language and culture. I would replace the melting pot metaphor with the salad bowl metaphor. It is important to ensure that we have various cultural subgroups living in America enforcing their differences rather than as Americans, emphasizing their similarities."

    "Fourth, I would make our fastest growing demographic group the least educated. I would add a second underclass, unassimilated, undereducated, and antagonistic to our population. I would have this second underclass have a 50% dropout rate from high. school."

    "My fifth point for destroying America would be to get big foundations and business to give these efforts lots of money. I would invest in ethnic identity, and I would establish the cult of 'Victimology.' I would get all minorities to think that their lack of success was the fault of the majority. I would start a grievance industry blaming all minority failure on the majority population."

    "My sixth plan for America's downfall would include dual citizenship, and promote divided loyalties. I would celebrate diversity over unity. I would stress differences rather than similarities. Diverse people worldwide are mostly engaged in hating each other - that is, when they are not killing each other. A diverse, peaceful, or stable society is against most historical precedent. People undervalue the unity it takes to keep a nation together. Look at the ancient Greeks. The Greeks believed that they belonged to the same race; they possessed a common language and literature; and they worshipped the same gods. All Greece took part in the Olympic games. A common enemy, Persia, threatened their liberty. Yet all these bonds were not strong enough to overcome two factors: local patriotism and geographical conditions that nurtured political divisions. Greece fell. E. Pluribus Unum -- From many, one. In that historical reality, if we put the emphasis on the 'pluribus'. Instead of the 'Unum,' we will balkanize America as surely as Kosovo."

    "Next to last, I would place all subjects off limits; make it taboo to talk about anything against the cult of 'diversity.' I would find a word similar to 'heretic' in the 16th century - that stopped discussion and paralyzed thinking. Words like 'racist' or 'xenophobe' halt discussion and debate. Having made America a bilingual/bicultural country, having established multi-culturism, having the large foundations fund the doctrine of 'Victimology,' I would next make it impossible to enforce our immigration laws. I would develop a mantra: That because immigration has been good for America, it must always be good. I would make every individual immigrant symmetric and ignore the cumulative impact of millions of them."

    In the last minute of his speech, Governor Lamm wiped his brow. Profound silence followed. Finally he said, "Lastly, I would censor Victor Davis Hanson's book, Mexifornia. His book is dangerous. It exposes the plan to destroy America. If you feel America deserves to be destroyed, don't read that book."

    There was no applause. A chilling fear quietly rose like an ominous cloud above every attendee at the conference. Every American in that room knew that everything Lamm enumerated was proceeding methodically, quietly, darkly, yet pervasively across the United States today. Discussion is being suppressed. Over 100 languages are ripping the foundation of our educational system and national cohesiveness. Even barbaric cultures that practice female genital mutilation are growing as we celebrate 'diversity.' American jobs are vanishing into the Third World as corporations create a Third World in America - take note of California and other states - to date, ten million illegal aliens and growing fast. It is reminiscent of George Orwell's book, 1984. In that story, three slogans are engraved in the Ministry of Truth building: "War is peace," "Freedom is slavery," and "Ignorance is strength."

    Governor Lamm walked back to his seat. It dawned on everyone at the conference that the future of our great nation is deeply in trouble and worsening fast. If we don't get this immigration monster stopped quickly, it will rage like a California wildfire and destroy everything in its path, especially The American Dream.

  4. zeppelin kid

    zeppelin kid Member

    Maybe you don't understand but there is a thing called the Police and Military that will easily stop any fighting in the streets.
  5. zeppelin kid

    zeppelin kid Member

    Even if what that governor says comes true, why would there have to be a civil war. What makes it even worthy to start a fight over some immigrants or a multicultural society. Its inevitable for a country to keep going without a little diversity. But that doesn't mean that there has to be a civil war following it. Why couldn't there be peace and prosperity?
  6. topolm

    topolm Member

    WHat's happening is MUCH bigger than you, me or anyone else here for that matter. Its important to be a realist, to be aware of why the system is broken, and why and how it will fall apart. You can pooh pah all you want, wring your hands, get frustrated mad and upset. It will have no effect. You are experience cognitive dissonance: an uncomfortable collision with reality that is forcing you to feel emotional angst. Its a growing process. You need to feel it. I used to be a blind idealist like you too. You will overcome it, dont worry ;-)

    "It is an uncomfortable conclusion from happiness research data perhaps - but multicultural communities tend to be less trusting and less happy...."
  7. zeppelin kid

    zeppelin kid Member

    "It is an uncomfortable conclusion from happiness research data perhaps - but multicultural communities tend to be less trusting and less happy...."
    Thats a huge stereotype and generalization. I believe that people can live in peace even if its diverse in every way. You just look at it as a something drastically new that most people can't handle. But look at Europe, most every country in Europe doesn't really have a major language or religion because its so diverse over there.
  8. topolm

    topolm Member

    Did ya read the article??????????
  9. NaykidApe

    NaykidApe Bomb the Ban

    If the world were comprised solely of reasonable people diversity (religious, ethnic, sexual,...) wouldn't be a problem.

    Unfortunately we're not there yet.

    The human race, for the most part, is still stuck in the "survival via dominace" mindset and as long as we are we're going to keep using our differences as an excuse to attack each other or demand special treatment for ourselves.
  10. topolm

    topolm Member

    Forget about ever reaching that place. Unfortunately, reality does not pan out with our idealistic vision. That time in now long gone. Efforts to achieve harmony at this point have been completely in vain. Our society is extremely polarized and the tension will build and build and build until....

    I have a house in Argentina, so I wont be around when the shtf.
  11. zeppelin kid

    zeppelin kid Member

    So negative.....
  12. topolm

    topolm Member

    Relative to idealism, realism is negative. I wont disagree. However, look at the positive: when we all have a realistic view of what's happening, we can find a truly workable solution that is not based off of wholly unworkable blind ideals that have thus far been a complete failure. Smile ;-)
  13. NaykidApe

    NaykidApe Bomb the Ban

    Lol! Believe me, I'm not expecting to see the human race reach true adulthood in my lifetime. I'm thinking more in terms of a few dozen milleniums worth of evolution.

    the good news is, I think, if you look at the big picture (all of human history and what little we know of prehistory) we actually are evolving (slowly).

    At least we have an idealistic vision now. And, even with all the oppression and atrocities we still have going on in the world, one thing we have that's more or less a modern anomilie is that there are concerned third parties now, ie, people protesting/fighting oppression who aren't direct victims of it.

    What I'm saying is there's evidence that the world is growing a conscience, and, with the world getting as crowded as it is and as interactive as it's being forced to be it's either going to have to grow a conscience or destroy itself.

    I think america, as diverse and divided as we are, is the perfect place to watch this scenario play itself out.

    Maybe we'll wind up serving as a lesson (or a cautionary tale) to the rest of the world.
  14. paulfreespirit

    paulfreespirit Senior Member

    right on brother .....maybe if more were as commited as you fua ....taken back the country you onced loved " would"nt be that far away .......down with capatalist nazis .
  15. paulfreespirit

    paulfreespirit Senior Member

    could somebody please tell me this .....with bush has the poverty gap between rich and poor gotton any better ? worse ? ..........thanks
  16. topolm

    topolm Member

    brah, its not just Bush. Its both republicans and democrats. Under Clinton there were more than 27,000 corporate mergers which is nothing more than a means by which to consolidate capital, and reduce competition. All the politicians are rich. Ya think Hillary Clinton gives a shit about the middle class? Shes a multi-millionaire limousine liberal that lives in a multi-million dollar home in a gated community. Would you be suprised if I told ya that lots of wealthy democrats in NYC voted for Bloomberg, a republican, because he was good for their investment portfolios...THis is about the top 1% of Americans screwing the rest of us over. I think Americans need to let go of this idea that small business owners who are wealthy or physicians who may good money are part of the problem: they're not. They are peasants just like you and me. Its the mega rich who are worth tens of millions who decide public policy to the detriment of the most IMPORTANT class in America: the Middle class. These scum bags in the top 1% who are destroying our country, raping the economy, raping the middle class financially, passing laws that allow for the enivironment to be destroyed etc etc etc should straight up ELIMINATED. Foolish Republican and Democrat constituents quibble over insignificant wedge issues that wouldnt even be issues if our constitution wasnt ignored.
  17. paulfreespirit

    paulfreespirit Senior Member

    thanks for explaining that to me .......cheers
  18. I hope i can clear something up. I have visted these formums on the recommandation of a friend, and have seen the words "facist" and "Nazi" used to describe capitalism. However, a Nazi is a member of the National Socialist Party of Germany, circa-1930/40. Facism is a form of government where the entire populace works to benifit the whole. Do not mistake me for a skinhead. I am mearly stating that Facism is a form of government, and that in some respects, is perfectly acceptable if controlled.

    Moving on to other matters, another Civil War is unlikely, seeing as there are not two seperate parties with tensions boiling up and finally exploding. The South secceded from the Union because they wanted State's Rights, not because they hated the Constitution, or wanted hash legal.

    Also, the United States military, the most competent and formidable fighting force in the world would quickly put an end to any rebellion. That's not including the para-military force SWAT, and the police force, of which my sister and brother-in-law are proudly apart of.
  19. topolm

    topolm Member

    Tensions will eventually boil over here. The blacks and mexicans will incite riots and take over cities, and the military will have to intervene. Those in the military will be incapable of being unbiased though, and mutiny will occur. Militias will form along racial lines and it will be all out chaos until one group has claimed victory. Its gonna happen unfortunately. I predict ground zero will be in LA.
  20. zeppelin kid

    zeppelin kid Member

    Life really does suck. We live in a world in which no one truly knows why we are here or what our purpose is as a race. Why do we still have war and hate and violence. Why are guns still being made. Questions that need answering.

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