Can we move past money?

Like anything you want in society you can just have (within reason with respect to others needs) there is no need to pay. You can just have it since you are a human and part of some future society.

Go to the store and pick your food. Need new cloths? Go get some. This is how it works on Star Trek. I feel like a lot of modern people would get upset over this. They are stuck in a us vs them mentality. They don't think it's possible. So they need to rank and compete.

Money is what people in a capitalist system hoard to feel successful. It really has no value other then we have agreed it can be traded for what we really want. So what if we just decide to trade that stuff anyway.


Please someone counter this with something besides the classic "people are lazy, only I work hard" argument we so often to counter the Bernie style politicians who suggest a "free" service like I also suggest. Free since as a citezin you can have it.

They are still counting on money I am not. Long term I think societies of the future will not have cash and will not rank themselves by it.

Without money I guess things like welfare don't need to exist. Everyone has a house, they have food, no one needs to fight over this. So some cons would love it right? Taxes don't even exist and it's just human bonding and pack mentality that house us.

 

maybe some free things within reason.
get all the free food you want, but does not eat it.
get all the free clothing, and destroy them faster than wear.
I like the concept but need to have some kinda rules.

Even the Star Ship needs supplies and trade..

 

I don't understand completely why it isn't that you can't just present evidence that you've worked a reasonable amount of hours and not pick up clothes or food. It wouldn't be free, exactly. You'd have to contribute something to society.

But then there would be all kinds of questions as to what kind of contributions warranted what kind of benefits.

 

I've cherished another concept, where money continues to exist as a mean for trade, but we simply change the rules and revise the doctrines to eliminate this ridiculous idea of hyperinflation, and release the creation of currency, keeping it always frozen at a fixed value, so that we could simply print (or digitally create) as much as we need, and there'd be no drop in value/worth. Among other things, this system could be used to finance basic income for all, without debt.

All citizens would get paid a minimum amount per month, but you could also still accept jobs to earn higher pay, amount which would depend on your skill level, and the demands of your job. To me, this current system where money is only valuable, if we only allow limited creation is stupid, because it deliberately enables and maintains extreme poverty. By freeing the creation of cash, we could still maintain traditional trading, while eliminating debt at least partially, if not even completely. This would make things like the Greece debt crisis a thing of the past, and help to eliminate the need for austerity, which I've never seen as anything more than a way to sadistically bully the little guys.

 

I think people are capable of being compassionate when it comes to money, but when they try to intellectualize about it they falter. For example, I'm perfectly able to give a dollar or two to a homeless guy begging; and I do so with relative frequency. But when it comes down to it, I'm really afraid I'm going to spend my last dime giving and be left with nothing. I have trouble in that department. If there were some sort of fair way of redistributing wealth, I'd be a considerate participant. But then again... what's to say you won't lose everything doing something like that. It feels risky. Lol... I'm truly ranting here.

 

It's possible for sure. And yes, of course there needs to be certain rules in order to get there.

 

I dont think we'll move past money until our economic system undergoes a drastic change and I dont think that will happen until we are forced to look at the economy and our livelihoods beyond what we can consume as consumers

In other words as long as there are material things to buy, money will exist to buy them

 

A moneyless society will be trading goods and services from one to another.

The convenient thing about money, is that you can trade money for the good or service you wish to acquire. If you were in a moneyless society, and you desire an item from a vendor, and you wish to trade with that vendor for an item you're willing to give up, and that vendor doesn't want anything you have to offer, then you're stuck. Money is also an easy metric to determine the worth of a good or service.

So no. I don't think we'll ever achieve a moneyless society.

 

I wrote a book about this very thing. And it's here, in the Writer's Forum. I considered it for many years as I was writing. Barter only goes so far. So people in my story opted for livestock papers for larger trades. For smaller trades things like thread, nails and bullets became small trade fodder. I de-emphasized marijuana trade since anyone can grow it. Liquor is also a great trading medium and of course prostitution is legal in my story, because sailor!

 

I don't think we can, as things currently stand. While there needs to be the rules that have been mentioned, it won't work. When we have collectively evolved so that we would follow the rule without the rule being made, that's when we'll be capable of it.

 

How would the rich wield power over the poor?

 

What can I get for my packet of magic beans?

 

A burger.

 

Deal.

Pfff money. Who needs money. I just got something to eat and you got something to grow and produce more food.

 

I watch little house on the prairie almost everyday. Its kinda crazy how they struggle with money whoa in the middle of nowhere..

 

i'm not going to say it's impossible, but i'm very confident none of us will live to see anything like it.

 

That is what I mean. There is someway to label yourself as serving the society so we know you can have the goods you want.

If people don't work and give nothing of value that gets into social welfare. I think we should still have that like we do now. Just because people don't work at the moment we can not cut them off.

I see all contributions as equal in this utopia. Like a doctor offers value just like the janitor at the hospital. We have decided in modern society some jobs have more value. We encourage people to pick certain jobs if they want to own material goods.

If there is no money the only reason to do a job is your interest in it.

I love the movie Office Space. A quote from that is "if everyone had a million dollars there would be no janitors because no one would clean shit up". This is a quote based on the value of money itself. This is what I want to avoid.

 

We will move on to galactic credits.

 

Who gets out of bed to open the store? Who produces the electricity for lighting the store?
Who delivers the products to the store? Who puts them on the shelves?
It just wouldn't work..

 

^
It worked in stalinistic Russia.

But all kidding aside: If basic needs are secured nobody would do the neccessary work anymore is always an argument that comes up in these convos.
I don't think running a store is the primary kind of job for which this would count: its more like very physically demanding stuff or filthy demeaning work.
Obviously people would still need to get some kind of sense of contribution to society and satisfaction from their daily actions. The good thing of a moneyless society and non profit labour is that everything can be done in cooperation. Nobody would need to clean toilets for 8 hours or pave streets on their knees whole days. If everybody shares and contributes everything menial job related will be very bareable.

 

Aside from the bed, automation can do the rest and we already have examples. Even ditches and roads are made by robots and trash collection is also going robotic. We have a weird future ahead folks.