Britains Independence Day 31st January 2020. Bring Brexit On!

This is why I don't bother with you. You don't really understand do you?

What the hell are you talking about here? UK can't sell more stuff to China and India because Germany already sells them stuff? All markets are saturated and UK exporters can't compete with anyone? There will be 14 million more Chinese, 12 million more Indians in 12 months time compared to now

 

VG

LOL and this is just more of your bullshit

I could ask the same thing - what are you going on about?

The UK could trade when in the EU - could the UK could sell more – but that is my point - it doesn’t - so again - what is the UK suddenly going to manufacture, create and sell to these places when we are not part of the EU that we didn’t and couldn’t have done when part of it?

 

Mystic

Well leaving the EU is not going to stop non-EU immigration some analysts think that could actually increase.

As for EU migrants taking away work that could be done by British workers what figures are you basing that on? Many of the jobs been filled by EU workers are seasonal others are specialist or skilled when there isn’t a big enough pool of British workers (often due to cuts in education and training by UK governments).

Could I ask what work you are doing?

 

So the bullshiter comes up with some answers put out by who we ask.

 

Mystic

May I ask where you are from as I’m find the idiosyncrasies of your speech hard to place

Can you explain what you mean by that?

Basically you seem to be saying that the majority of jobs in this country are filled by immigrants that you do not consider to be British but that is plainly not true.

 

Research from the centre for economic performance at the London School of Economics says “the areas of the UK with large increases in EU immigration did not suffer greater falls in the jobs and pay of UK-born workers. The big falls in wages after 2008 are due to the global financial crisis and a weak economic recovery, not to immigration.”

Several studies have shown a small negative effect of migration on the wages of low-skilled workers in certain sectors in certain parts of the country, particularly care workers, shop assistants, and restaurant and bar workers. The effect has been measured at less than 1% over a period of eight years.

The LSE’s Jonathan Wadsworth said: “The bottom line, which may surprise many people, is that EU immigration has not harmed the pay, jobs or public services enjoyed by Britons. In fact, for the most part it has likely made us better off. So, far from EU immigration being a “necessary evil” that we pay to get access to the greater trade and foreign investment generated by the EU single market, immigration is at worse neutral, and at best, another economic benefit.”

Guardian 20/4/16

 

Barry

What, thats gibberish

LOL, can you try and write that in English

 

I was told way back in 2006 that staff at the job centres was told to bend over backwards for foreign workers and give UK claimant's as little help as possible and I would say its still happening.

 

Don't make excuses.

 

Barry

Sorry mate you really need to write a bit clearer if you want people to understand you

What do you want?

 

Barry

And the proof for that is?

I friend of a friend that heard some guy down the pub….

 

Barry

OK this is what you said and since you seem unable to explain what you meant, I’ll try and decipher its meaning

So the bullshiter – well I’d just called VG a bullshitter so this must mean VG

So it goes - VG comes up with some answers

But VG didn’t come up with any answers in fact he is famous in these parts for nor coming up with answers

Then it continues - put out by who we ask

So the answers that VG hasn’t given have been put out by someone else?

*

Sorry Barry still hard to fathom, would it make sense if I got drunk?

 

Socrates felt that humans only have one thing to consider in any action, whether it is acting right or wrongly. Are we acting in an acceptable or unacceptable manner? Ethics are the norms by which we measure acceptable and unacceptable behavior.

IE stop picking holes and come up with some good answers that make sense and logical, remainer's come up with bullshit to baffle people or so they think.

 

Barry

Again sorry mate but that comes across as opaque bullshit.

Can you please explain clearly and plainly what you are going on about.

What are the questions you seem to want the answers for?

I mean so far I’ve been the one that has been asking the questions and for which I’m not getting answers.

The main one being - can any leaver come up with rational and reason arguments for why Brexit is a good idea for the UK and its people?

 

Because we voted that way, remainers will never see that you lost and that's all there is to it. Bye.

 

If Britain must choose between Europe and the open sea.

She must always choose the open sea.

Winston Churchill

 

Barry

But which leave did they vote for?

You need to remember that the leave vote was split

Many on the leave side didn’t know what kind of leave they were voting for while ALL those that voted to remain knew they were voting to remain.

People voted for differing version of Brexit that were often incompatible with others, so one type of deal that would be acceptable to one or two groups would be vehemently opposed by other groups of leavers. And a leave without a deal (that wasn’t even canvassed for in the referendum) that some want is strongly opposed by many other types of leavers. Also remember that some people voted because they were bamboozled by the lies been told by the leaver leadership.

 

Barry

You can celebrate a win but what have you won?

How does Brexit benefit the country and the people in it?

Again has any leaver put forward any rationally based reasons for thinking Brexit will be good for the UK? I’ve been in multiple threads involving thousands of post and NOT ONE leavers has been able to explain why Brexit would be a good thing in any rational way NOT ONE.

 

Barry

In 1932 the German electorate voted for the Nazis and Hitler putting them into power – because that was the vote, was that by definition a ‘good’ thing?

Now I am in no way saying those pushing for Brexit were Nazis but I am pointing out that elections don’t always return the ‘good’ choice and there were many who warned against the Nazis just as many warned against Brexit.

Democracy cannot succeed unless those who express their choice are prepared to choose wisely. The real safeguard of democracy, therefore, is education. FDR

If people choose badly the outcomes can be bad.

You can often tell if an idea is good or bad by if it can be defended in a rational and reasonable way – but as I keep pointing out NO leavers seems able to do argue that Brexit was a good idea and i would point out that repeating over and over that - we won you lost - is not a rational argument.

 

Winston Churchill

The post-war, Churchill is recognised as one of the founders of the European Union and consequently has a building named after him at the European Parliament in Strasbourg. Churchill led the call for a sort of, ‘United States of Europe’; he promoted the concept of a ‘European Convention on Human Rights’ and a ‘Court of Human Rights; he envisioned the free movement of people across the continent; he perceived a ‘Union of Europe as a whole’, to which all the continent’s states would eventually join; and before he died, he supported the UK’s application to join the European Economic Community (later to be re-named, the European Union.)