Are Transgender People Really Trapped In The Wrong Body?

Ok, so pretty much everyone has heard about the saga of Caitlynn Jenner, and I think the issue causes the need for a serious and thoughtful debate about a number of issues. First, what are gender roles in modern society, and what does it mean to be male or female? Is it purely genetic, and about what sex organs you possess? Is it more emotional like the instinctual ability to raise children, or the urge to kill and hunt? Perhaps some combination of both, or something I failed to mention? I believe these are important questions to be addressed going forward as we appear to be entering a time in our society where the answers to these questions, as they have traditionally been held, may be changing. I want to take the time here to clarify that I am not talking about hermaphrodites or transexuals who are born with both male and female body parts and thereby may experience confusion as to which gender they identify with more strongly. This thread is about those that are born perfectly genetically one gender but claim to relate as the opposite gender and the validity of those claims.

Before I get in to the bulk of my argument i want to express some concern over the level of discourse about this issue in the mainstream media. Right now if one went on national television and posed the question I asked they would be labeled hateful and unaccepting. I think this is a tragic case of political corectness run amok, as I believe this is a debate that needs to be had especially considering that the suicide rate among transgenders is alarmingly high (more on that later.)

Another issue I have is the fact that because of political correctness if one doesn't refer to "Caitlynn" as "she" you are also labeled as hateful and unaccepting. i find issue with this also, because if someone who is born a man and then undergoes extensive plastic surgery to physically resemble a woman, is a woman, would you, as a heterosexual man, be willing to date or have sex with them knowing they still had a penis? Even if they had the full surgery would you be comfortable knowing you were inserting your penis into another man's inverted penis? I for one would not as the thought of the fact that i was being intimate with someone that was genetically, and up until a certain point physically, a man would be a difficult one to get over.

At this point I also want to say I don't mean to single out just men that have undergone surgery to become women, as all the same questions i pose apply women who undergo surgery to become men. However, because of my perspective as a male and the media's treatment of the Caitlynn Jenner issue my arguments will be made from the perspective of a man becoming a woman.

Now, to the question posed in the title: Are transgenders really trapped in the wrong body, or is there some type of psychological disorder at play here? Now before your head explodes with anger, and your fingers hit the keyboard to tell me I'm a hateful bigot, I want you to read the reasons why i pose this question very carefully, and please THINK before you respond. Issues like these tend to be rather emotional and people tend to react sharply from the gut, and understandably so. However as i stated before this is a discussion that needs to be had especially with the lives of these people potentially at stake. I also want to make very clear at this point that i believe every one should be able to be who they are, or are meant to be, and be given the best possible opportunity to flourish regardless of how they are born. What i want to achieve from this discussion is perhaps a better understanding for all of what transgender is and what the best way to help them lead a normal healthy life is, be it through surgery or therapy or medication.

There are two main reasons i pose the above question. First, if someone born a man identifies as a woman then why do so many, or any, choose to keep their penises? Wouldn't it be far more logical to want to look down and see the sex organs they feel they were meant to be born with? I for one would be quite disquieted if I felt I was supposed to be a woman yet looked in the mirror to find male genitalia everyday. It seems to me if someone spent their lives pining to be freed from the prison that was their own body they wouldn't cling to their male genitals. Yes, I know many also choose to have their penises removed and undergo hormone therapy to completely make the change, which brings me to my next point. Why do so many men who undergo even the full surgery then choose to have "lesbian" relationships? Once again if the people undergoing these procedures really didn't identify as men why do they choose to have a more traditionally male relationship? Two examples, one is cathouse the series, where a transgender man came in to have one of the prostitutes make love to him with a strap-on, and throughout the episode the working girls made comments about how all the transgender men that came in wanted to have sex with women and how they felt it was rather strange and counterintuitive. Second, I recently worked in a convenience store that had a regular transgender customer, after a time working there i found out that this customer had a make out session with a female employee there. This particular person had also not chosen to surgically remove their penis, doubly raising the question of how much they truly identify as a woman.

It also bears pointing out that the surgeries to switch genders are incredibly expensive. Is becoming one's true self a privilege only reserved for the ostensibly wealthy?

Now, I don't want to come off as totally dismissive of their claims, however, I feel there is far from enough scientific evidence on the subject to make a conclusion yet. For example it is known from brain scans that men and women's brains are wired and work differently. Now, if i were to see brain scans that show female thought patterns in the brain of all transgender men or vice versa, I for one would consider the debate over. However because of the above reasons I highly doubt that to be the case most of the time. Not necessarily in every case, but most cases.

In summation, why is having this discussion openly and honestly important? As I mentioned in the opening paragraph the suicide attempt rate is alarmingly high amongst transgenders both pre and post-op. One would think that receiving the surgery they so desperately wanted to be the person they felt they were born to be would reduce the suicide attempt rate. Yet this is not the case. This suggests to me there may be deeper problems at work than just a mistake of genes. Now, some will argue that it's lack of acceptance that leads to this flatline in suicide rate. However, i believe that in a society that just legalized gay marriage, people are more accepting than ever of non-traditional sexual lifestyles.

All that being said, if these people aren't trapped in the wrong body and have some sort of disorder that causes them to improperly identify with themselves as they were born, I believe that feeding their delusions of which gender they were actually supposed to be may be more dangerous in the long term. For example if someone suffers from schizophrenia and hears voices talking to them no one sees telling them that the voices are real and should be listened to is the proper way to deal with their condition. Also under any other conditions if someone claimed they were something they clearly weren't, i.e. claiming they were really a duck in a human's body, they would immediately be labeled as crazy. So I'm not sure why having the delusion of being the opposite gender is becoming mainstream acceptable, let alone medically viable.

So after all that, am I right on target? way off base? I look forward to hearing your opinions about it.

 

too long, did not read...

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUJjLS8CDWU

 

I agree with what you are saying. This nation has become so fucking pussified that if you dare don't accept someone saying that are transgender you will be attacked relentlessly by social justice warriors.

I was flipping throug the channels a few days ago and came upon a show called "i am jazz" or some shit like that. It's about a 13 or 14 year old boy who now identifies as a girl. I guess its another way for people to make money as well by promoting it.

 

That's another point I didn't get to in my OP, the fact that "Caitlynn" Jenner is getting to become a reality TV star out of all this. By that token doesn't everyone who's transgender deserve to be on TV?

They gave "her" a courage award as well. In my book simply being oneself doesn't necessarily count as an act of bravery. One could argue that it takes courage to publicly go through a transition like that but:

1. Bruce Jenner could have kept his transition private, yet went out of his way to be as public as possible about it.

2. As I mentioned before we currently live in a society more accepting than ever of non-tradional sexual lifestyles and i don't believe that finding acceptance after going through with the surgery is as hard as we're being led to believe.

 

He actually tried to keep it private. He went out of his way to make sure the media didn't find out. When he went to get his Adam apple removed, one of the people working at the place actually leaked the story to the media. He almost committed suicide when things went public. He told Diane Sawyer all of this during her interview with him/her.

 

Why would he do a reality tv show if he wants to keep thing on the down low? Obviously his little secret is out but why does he need even MORE attention?

 

accept what you are born with and deal with it. This catilynn is a selfish piece of shit.

billions of people around the world wish they could change their life for the better. they don't have money and are living a hard hard life.

but some mental crazy shit with money wants to cut his dick off for publicity because he believe what?

just go fucking die.

You are fucked in your head.

We don't give a damn that you wish you were someone else.

I wish I had money. He and yes he is a GUY has money to get tits and say no dick. Fucking mental shit.

Accept who you are and be thankful you are alive.

Selfish sick sadistic twisted MAN.

 

Hopefully I don't sound too ignorant in my response. Honestly, I don't know, and I don't really care. I just want people to be happy. It isn't my place to judge ANYONE on how they want to live their life, and if someone born as one sex actually identifies with the opposite sex, and chooses to "transition", then so be it. More power to them. I don't see any big deal in this, except that resources should be available to this person, just as resources are available to women leaving abusive relationships, homeless people, rape victims, gay teens who have run away from home, ect.

 

I don't know why. Maybe so she can be the one to control/tell her story?

 

This is mean and unnecessary. It makes me sick. Even if I strongly disliked someone from the bottom of my heart, I would never wish death upon them. Why do you let someone have so much control over your life, that you actually wish them to "go fucking die"?

 

He is not a she.

He was born with a fucking dick and balls.

 

Well reality tv is scripted, so idk about that...

 

Travel to parts of the world where people have to carry water to live and see if they give a shit he wants a pussy.

Lots of people deserve better.

fuck him.

 

Some of it is.

 

I'm sure he is happier than you will ever be in your entire life.

 

You don't lkno

You don't know anything about me.

You are backing up a mental person who cannot except himself.

This has nothing to do with personal freedom.

People do what they want, and they should.

Don't put some rich guy who cuts his balls on the newspaper and give him a award.

If you agree what he does you are as sick as him.

 

I know you're a negative Nancy who is caught in the body of downstairs Dan.

 

I think the whole "transgender" issue is only an issue because it's been made into one, and one I have chosen not to give much thought to other than regarding the obvious agenda that's behind it.

It's another one of those politically correct things that everyone is just supposed to accept as "normal" as they shove it down our throats via the media. After all, that's tolerance, and of course tolerance is open-minded... and open-minded is of course "intelligent," "cultured," and "worldly." Disagree, and you're a fucking bigot. Yes, political correctness is just such a wonderful thing as they confuse the living shit out of everyone.

 

You also wont quote the rest of my post cause you can't argue.

People who are gay can now marry. That is awesome. I am glad for them.

But some shit who wish he was a girl gets a award?

Throw his ass on the street and see what happens.