~a modern day parable~

There was a certain Professor of Religion named Dr Christianson, a
studious man who taught at a small college in the western United States.
Dr. Christianson taught the required survey course in Christianity at this
particular institution. Every student was required to take this course
his or her freshman year, regardless of his or her major.

Although Dr Christianson tried hard to communicate the essence of the
gospel in his class, he found that most of his students looked upon the
course as nothing but required drudgery. Despite his best efforts, most
students refused to take Christianity seriously.

This year, Dr. Christianson had a special student named Steve. Steve was
only a freshman, but was studying with the intent of going onto seminary
for the ministry. Steve was popular, he was well liked, and he was an
imposing physical specimen. He was now the starting center on the school
football team, and was the best student in the professor's class.

One day, Dr. Christianson asked Steve to stay after class so he could
talk with him. ! "How many push-ups can you do?" Steve said, "I do about
200 every night." "200? That's pretty good, Steve," Dr. Christianson
said. "Do you think you could do 300?" Steve replied, "I don't know...
I've never done 300 at a time."

"Do you think you could?" again asked Dr. Christianson.
"Well, I can try," said Steve.
"Can you do 300 in sets of 10? I have a class project in mind and I need
you to do about 300 push-ups in sets of ten for this to work. Can you do
it? I need you to tell me you can do it," said the professor.

Steve said, "Well... I think I can...yeah, I can do it"

Dr. Christianson said, "Good! I need you to do this on Friday. Let me
explain what I have in mind."

Friday came and Steve got to class early and sat in the front of the
room. When class started, the professor pulled out a big box of donuts.
No, these weren't the normal kinds of donuts, they were the extra fancy
BIG kind, with cream centers and frosting swirls. Everyone was pretty
excited it was Friday, the last class of the day, and they were going to
get an early start on the weekend with a party in Dr. Christianson's
class.

Dr. Christianson went to the first girl in the first row and asked,
"Cynthia, do you want to have one of these donuts?"

Cynthia said, "Yes."

Dr. Christianson then turned to Steve and asked, "Steve, would you do ten
push-ups so that Cynthia can have a donut?"

"Sure." Steve jumped down from his desk to do a quick ten. Then Steve
again sat in his desk. Dr. Christianson put a donut on Cynthia's desk.

Dr. Christianson then went to Joe, the next person, and asked, "Joe, do
you want a donut?"

Joe said, "Yes." Dr. Christianson asked, "Steve would you do ten push-ups
so Joe can have a donut?"


Steve did ten push-ups, Joe got a donut. And so it went, down the first
aisle, Steve did ten pushups for every person before they got their
donut.

Walking down the second aisle, Dr. Christianson came to Scott. Scott was
on the basketball team, and in as good condition as Steve. He was very
popular and never lacking for female companionship.

When the professor asked, "Scott do you want a donut?"

Scott's reply was, "Well, can I do my own pushups?"

Dr. Christianson said, "No, Steve has to do them."

Then Scott said, "Well, I don't want one then."

Dr. Christianson shrugged and then turned to Steve and asked, "Steve,
would you do ten pushups so Scott can have a donut he doesn't want?"
With perfect obedience Steve started to do ten pushups.

Scott said, "HEY! I said I didn't want one!" Dr. Christianson said,
"Look, this is my classroom, my class, my desks, and these are my donuts.
Just leave it on the desk if you don't want it." And he put a donut on
Scott's desk.

Now by this time, Steve had begun to slow down a little. He just stayed
on the floor between sets because it took too much effort to be getting
up and down. You could start to see a little perspiration coming out
around his brow. Dr. Christianson started down the third row. Now the
students were beginning to get a little angry. Dr. Christianson asked
Jenny, "Jenny, do you want a donut?"

Sternly, Jenny said, "No."

Then Dr. Christianson asked Steve, "Steve, would you do ten more push-ups
so Jenny can have a donut that she doesn't want?" Steve did ten....Jenny
got a donut.

By now, a growing sense of uneasiness filled the room. The students were
beginning to say ! "No" and there were all these uneaten donuts on the
desks.

Steve also had to really put forth a lot of extra effort to get these
pushups done for each donut. There began to be a small pool of sweat on
the floor beneath his face, his arms and brow were beginning to get red
because of the physical effort involved.

Dr. Christianson asked Robert, who was the most vocal unbeliever in the
class, to watch Steve do each push up to make sure he did the full ten
pushups in a set because he couldn't bear to watch all of Steve's work
for all of those uneaten donuts. He sent Robert over to where Steve was
so Robert could count the set and watch Steve closely.

Dr. Christianson started down the fourth row. During his class, however,
some students from other classes had wandered in and sat down on the
steps along the radiators that ran down the sides of the room. When the
professor realized this, he did a quick count and saw that now there were
34 students in the room. He started to worry if Steve would be able to
make it. Dr. Christianson went on to the next person and the next and the
next. Near the end of that row, Steve was really having a rough time. He
was taking a lot more time to complete each set. <
Steve asked Dr Christianson, "Do I have to make my nose touch on each
one?"

Dr. Christianson thought for a moment, "Well, they're your pushups. You
are in charge now. You can do them any way that you want." And Dr.
Christianson went on.

A few moments later, Jason, a recent transfer student, came to the room
and was about to come in when all the students yelled in one voice, "NO!
Don't come in! Stay out!"

Jason didn't know what was going on. Steve picked up his head and said,
"No, let him come."

Professor Christianson said, "You realize that if Jason comes in you
will have to do ten pushups for him?"

Steve said, "Yes, let him come in. Give him a donut"
Dr. Christianson said, "Okay, Steve, I'll let you get Jason's out of
the way right now. Jason, do you want a donut?"

Jason, new to the room, hardly knew what was going on. "Yes," he said,
"give me a donut."

"Steve, will you do ten push-ups so that Jason can have a donut?" Steve
did ten pushups very slowly and with great effort. Jason, bewildered, was
handed a donut and sat down.

Dr. Christianson finished the fourth row, and then started on those
visitors seated by the heaters. Steve's arms were now shaking with each
push-up in a struggle to lift himself against the force of gravity. By
this time sweat was profusely dropping off of his face, there was no
sound except his heavy breathing; there was not a dry eye in the room.

The very last two students in the room were two young women, both
cheerleaders, and very popular. Dr. Christianson went to Linda, the
second to last, and asked, "Linda, do you want a doughnut?"

Linda said, very sadly, "No, thank you."

Professor Christianson quietly asked, "Steve, would you do ten push-ups
so that Linda can have a donut she doesn't want?" Grunting from the
effort, Steve did ten very slow pushups for Linda. Then Dr. Christianson
turned to the last girl, Susan. "Susan, do you want a donut?"

Susan, with tears flowing down her face, began to cry. "Dr. Christianson,
why can't I help him?"

Dr. Christianson, with tears of his own, said, "No, Steve has to do it
alone, I have given him this task and he is in charge of seeing that
everyone has an opportunity for a donut whether they want it or not. When
I decided to have a party this last day of class, I looked at my grade
book. Steve here is the only student with a perfect grade. Everyone else
has failed a test, skipped class, or offered me inferior work.

Steve told me that in football practice, when a player messes! up he
must do push-ups. I told Steve that none of you could come to my party
unless he paid the price by doing your push ups. He and I made a deal for
your sakes."

"Steve, would you do ten push-ups so Susan can have a donut?" As Steve
very slowly finished his last pushup, with the understanding that he had
more than accomplished all that was required of him, having done 350
pushups, his arms buckled beneath him and he fell to the floor.

Dr. Christianson turned to the room and said. "And so it was, that our
Saviour, Jesus Christ, on the cross, plead to the Father, 'into thy hands
I commend my spirit.' With the understanding that He had done everything that was required of Him, He yielded up His life. And like some of those
in this room, many of us leave the gift on the desk, uneaten."

Two students helped Steve up off the floor and to a seat, physically
exhausted, but wearing a thin smile. "Well done, good and faithful
servant," said the professor, adding "Not all sermons are preached in
words."

Turning to his class, the professor said, "My wish is that you might
understand and fully comprehend all the riches of grace and mercy that
have been given to you through the sacrifice of our Lord and Saviour
Jesus Christ. He spared not only His Begotten Son,! but gave Him up for us
all, for the whole Church, now and forever. Whether or not we choose to
accept His gift to us, the price has been paid."


"Wouldn't you be foolish and ungrateful to leave it lying on the desk?"

 

LOL Fuzzy.

Well, I thought it was an awesome story anyway.

 

I would have asked the professor why he chose to decide to put someone through that just in order to have a party.

He preached a sermon alright. Not only that Jesus as an OK dude, but that God, who framed the whole thing, if that's correct, is a serious and sadistic head case.

 

Indeed.

 

Hey at least God didn't ask anyone else to do it. He did it himself. i mean really, nonbelievers have it soooo sweet they get to live their lives in this total kick ass world for free!!!

While those of us who believe who have to slog through in a world full of pain from our free will. All pain can be over come though.

Seahorse wonderful story!!!!!

 

He killed himself to appease himself and now he sits at the right hand of himself.

 

Libby if you just admit that as truth then we can clear out some of that anger.

Hey the rules is da rules man.

 

HA HA... "anger"....for fuck's sake...you have no clue, do you?

 

I've got tons of clues, buddy!! Isn't "Fuck" a word people use when they are angry?? or at least in some extra emotional state?

 

"Fuck" is a great fucking word I use in my vocabulary ALL THE FUCKING TIME.

I can tell you're new fucker here, otherwise you'd fucking know that.

 

It doesn't make any sense. I mean, if I can do my own pushups, why must Steve do them? Why does God refuse to let me carry my own weight? The fact is, I don't see why someone else's death (or life) can somehow resolve all my wrongs. Why do I need an intermediary? Sacrifices have no place in my world view, as it just seems like a spiffy way to scapegoat.

If you say I can't carry my weight because I'm unable, then I must blame God for creating humans so weakly. My dog doesn't need a savior, but we, made in the image of God, do? What the fuck?

As an aside, the idea of a teacher forcing his beliefs down his classes throat fills me with disgust. It's an emotional ploy, sick. Fortunately this story is made up.

God doing this himself is far less impressive than a man doing it, since God can do anything at will. Humans are not so powerful.

Second, the fact that Jesus went right to heaven also weakens the case. So what, he lives as a man, dies an admittedly horrible death (extremely quick, though, for a crucifixion which usually took days), laid dead, GOT TO COME BACK TO LIFE, then go to heaven? Not only is that the weakest punishment ever for ALL of the world's sin, but he went into his death (allegedly) KNOWING he was going to heaven...knowing he WAS GOD!

If Jesus had been sent to hell in mine and everyone's place, that might have been a good sacrifice. But as it is, well, Jesus got his reward. He suffered almost trivially given the knowledge he had going into it. Shit, if I knew I'd be walking around again in a couple days, then KNEW I'd be in heaven a little later...I'd do it.

 

You cannot carry the weight on your own because the weight is death. If you were to carry the weight than you would just simply DIE, because God said the wages of sin is DEATH, but the gift of God is Eternal Life through Christ.

God didnt create us weak. He created us perfect, and simply gave us free will. He created us with the right to choose what we want to do. He doesnt force us to do good OR bad. EVerything we do is our very own choice. We should be grateful that we can at least choose. But we inherit sin, we cannot get away from it...we are born as sinners and no matter how much love and security we have as a baby, we will still act out because sin is deeply ingrained in us. God could have just let us die and pay our own debt. Most people choose that route actually, even though the donut sits uneaten on the desk. But He loved us. Even in all our weaknesses, He loved us and wanted us back.

it was a class about Christianity. Teachers teach using the best possible strategies that will be effective for learning. I thought it was brilliant and I'm sure that it stuck with everyone in the room that day, whether they took the message to heart or not.

That's why God became a man. He humbled Himself and walked a mile in our shoes. The Bible says he faced every human temptation that we face. That means even Jesus had to make choices. And He always chose GOd. He never sinned. That's why He is the pure and spotless lamb. In the old testament people took thier best lamb, and sacrificed it for thier wrongdoings. Of course to some that will sound awful, but something had to pay the debt for sin. Jesus was the ultimate sacrifice. Once and for all, paid the price in full for ALL humanity's sin. We are still left with the choice of a lifetime. Do we want it? Or do we want to pay the debt ourselves. It's a heavy debt.

Jesus WAS sent to Hell for us when He died. It was part of the price. When he rose from the dead, He didnt go up to Heaven for another 40 days, right before his disciples eyes.

 

hahahahahahaha

 

what? i dont see anything sweet about living for yourself, denying the love of the one that made you, and then moving on to an eternity without Him. Are you trying to make unbelievers feel LUCKY?

wow....is that how you feel? That walking with God is a world full of pain? Hasnt GOd set you free? Hasnt He given you the more abundant life? Sure it's hard to go against the grain, swim against the current...but the rewards are always outstanding, and when you take the truth that you have been shown, and show it to someone else, the love spreads and becomes contagious!

thanks i got it in an email today...it looked too long to read but once i started i was into it.

 

But He did go to hell!! For three days. He kicked satans ass busted down the gates of hell. Took everyone in hell at present to heaven with him. Then stole the keys to death and hell. Then he was resurected. When he comes back everyone will then live on the recreated earth with a few going to heaven. Some teaching others and some learning.

 

Oh, gosh, no one told you...well, I guess I will. We all have to die someday anyways. I'm sorry to have to be the one to tell you.

Seriously, I have to die anyways. I guess that is when my sin is taken care of, then.

You say we weren't created weak, but then say god loves us despite all our weaknesses. Huh?

Anyways, I don't believe we inherit sin. Someone else's wrongs are not my own, and a newborn baby is by no means a sinner (how repugnant a thought). Though, if I'm raised to sin, then that might do it. But then, how can you define sin? Different cultures do things different, in some, you only get one wife, in others, you can have many (adultry to the first culture). Some sins are clear (murder), but even then there's wiggle room (self defense, war, executions). Regardless, I feel it is up to the individual to become enlightened, not some guy living 2000 years ago. I also believe heaven and hell exist now (as states of mind), not in the future after I'm dead. But then, I'm also not a Christian, so obviously I'm just here (at the forum) for fun.

 

Now imagine it thus: *From some book or somesuch* "A long long time ago there was this dude named Steve or Jason or whatever, and he did 10 push ups for every single person so they could have a doughnut!" *Gasp* *omg*

Of course now there is no proof any of it actually happened, only some writings in a book, and we all know books are always filled only with fact! Oh, and of course the doughnut is more like the word of some random person telling you "Umm yeah, sure you'll umm get a doughnut sometime, yeah..."
Yeah, I'll admit I forgot where I was going about halfway through that, but fuck it.

 

I'd volunteer to go to hell for three days myself, knowing I'd be back on earth walking around, visiting friends, then on my way to heaven. Three days, compared to the eternity I'm supposedly going to get for simply (get this) not believing in this hombre Jesus. That's weak dude.

 

you are not going to hell. you are going to end up in the remedial class onthe restored earth!!! unless you want to go to hell.

 

I was trying to get a point across that if you are a non-believer you can still have a very good life. You can do good and enjoy the beauty of this still very nice earth.

My secound point was that believers have to live in a world that is suffering due mostly to the fact that it chooses to.