2c-i + 4-aco-dmt: My Own Personal Hell

I don't blame the combo for what happened (except for maybe the physical side effects), for I know and love both these chemicals dearly and they've always treated me well.

My first mistake was going ahead and dosing anyway when I wasn't feeling it. The 2 days before my birthday, I was on FIRE and had a wonderful time looking forward to the big day. I was in a great state of mind, had lots of energy and confidence, got a lot of things done that I'd been putting off, and still had time to go flea marketing and mini-golfing and enjoy some fun activities, despite getting my period on the 3rd (sorry, but I feel it's pertinent to the TR). You know how sometimes you just have a day or two where you're just in a groove and everything runs so smoothly and perfectly, and you have all the energy to do everything you want to do... I only hoped it would last until my birthday.

Alas, I woke up late on the 5th feeling lethargic and apathetic. I didn't do any of the things I planned, canceled on my friends and debated dosing all day. Despite being unusually hungry (thanks again, period) I abstained from food except for a small veggie sandwich in the afternoon in case I decided to go through with it that night. After wasting 3/4 of the day lying around and feeling blah, I decided enough was enough and I was going to salvage what was left. My bf suggested going to see Avatar in IMAX 3D, which I probably would have declined if I hadn't already seen it and knew how amazing the colors and details would look. The movie was at 10:30pm so I weighed out 30mg 2c-i and parachuted it about 8:30pm. I also weighed out 25mg 4-aco and put it in a Vcap and threw it in my coin purse for later.

We went to Walmart to kill some time before the movie since we had to pick up a few things anyway. After a half hour, I was feeling the first alerts of the classic PEA energy bubbling under my skin and the fluorescent lights became extra-harsh. I already made the return I needed to and grabbed a new pair of headphones while my bf was still browsing. I was becoming agitated and needed to move around/change scenery as per usual as the comeup increased in speed and momentum. Instead of feeling speedy and crisp, I was feeling rather sedated and cloudy, which was the first sign of an unusual trip. I rushed my bf along and we checked out and left for the movie.

It was about 9:50 when we arrived and moderate visuals were kicking in. We got our tickets and waited on a bench for 20 minutes 'til they let us in. The patterned carpet was swirling and "resonating" like ripples in water where ever someone stepped. That was an unusually prominent visual for this stage of 2c-i for me. I was still coming up fast and hard and a touch of nausea hit me, I guess I normally don't notice these things because I'm usually up and moving around until the comeup subsides and I "settle in." The theater opened and we took some seats in the middle of the last row, where my bf proceeded to act up and try to freak me out as usual when I’m tripping. We were worried it would be crowded and full of obnoxious and loud kids but we were the worst 2 there. Everything was extra hilarious and I felt like I couldn’t control the volume of my voice/laughter even though I knew I was at a reasonable level. The nausea let up and I was finally starting to feel on track. It was definitely feeling solid at 30mg and I was considering whether or not I even wanted to add the 4-aco, but I was waiting to peak anyway so I put on my ultra-cool 3D glasses and the movie began.

It was about what I expected. I wanted a light, fun, visual treat and that’s exactly what the 2c-i delivered. Around the 1 hour mark of the movie, I decided 2c-i had shown me all it had to offer and popped the 4-aco. Within 10 minutes, the 4-aco made its presence known loud and clear and instantly I knew I jumped in over my head. I calmed myself, knowing that once the short comeup was over, I’d find my groove and feel fine. After an uncomfortable, powerful surge of… something I’d never felt before exploded in my solar plexus and resonated through my extremities, I actually felt pretty good and felt the trip taking a positive turn, or so I thought. I got up to pee and felt very dissociated from my body, like my muscles were moving without effort (like walking on DXM), and when I returned that’s when things started feeling really strange. I felt like I couldn’t catch my breath and that my heart was beating irregularly. This was the first time during any trip that I couldn’t tell if I actually was having a hard time breathing, or if it was just my perception of it. I was extremely out of touch with the physical signals my body was sending and I tried hard to concentrate and regulate my breathing. I felt light-headed and dizzy and could hear my heart beating in my ears.
This was upsetting for sure, but I remained calm and continued taking slow, deep breaths. I felt a little better and got back into the movie which looked fantastic, but I noticed sound was producing a strange synesthesia that I never experienced before. Certain sounds were making my skin tingle or giving me deep shivers like nails on a chalkboard, but not because the sounds were unpleasant. At one point, I shifted in my chair and my arm must have fallen asleep because when the blood rushed back into it was so intense I almost couldn’t stand it. And didn’t stop at my arm, it flooded my whole body. The dizziness returned and I felt butterflies under every inch of my skin. It wasn’t pleasant, my skin literally felt nauseous, I don’t know how else to describe it. My skin felt like it was detaching and floating away from me. My tactile sensory perception was shot, my brain could not seem to interpret anything I touched. Everything had a strange texture, like I was feeling it for the first time. This was the first time I ever feared for my physical safety during a trip. I was becoming so uncomfortable I almost asked my bf to take me to the hospital. But I stopped myself and thought, “No, I got myself into this and if I’m going to die I’d rather take a hit for the team and not let anyone know what I took. It’s not like I took a ridiculous dose, I don’t understand why I’m having such a reaction. They can’t do anything except maybe give me a benzo and let me ride it out anyway, so it’s just as well I do it here.”

Meanwhile, the psychological shitstorm of the 4-aco was brewing. One by one, my demons reared their ugly heads and assaulted me full on. I acknowledged them, but the theater wasn’t the best place to battle it out so I told them I’d meet them later. I did my best to distract myself with the pretty colors and textures of the movie, but fighting it only worked for so long. Luckily by this point, the physical discomfort was subsiding and came in 5-10 minute waves that waned in intensity as each one passed. I honestly couldn’t tell how I looked from the outside and worried that I might be fidgeting or acting strange, but I guess I did a pretty good job at keeping myself contained because my bf never once looked over to ask if I was ok. I seemed to stabilize by the end of the movie but little did I know I was simply passing through the eye of the storm. The demons remained at bay until we got home and my bf went to bed. It was now around 1:30am and I thought by this point things would be winding down, but I was still tripping hard and knew I had a lot of work to do.

I’ve done some terrible things this past year that created a lot of emotional baggage because I can’t discuss it with anyone. There is no easy solution for the things I’ve done so like a coward I chose instead to lock them up in the deepest darkest corner of my mind where they will forever rot. There is no hiding these things from 4-aco however, so for the rest of the night I was accused, judged, chased, and haunted by all of these things. I was trapped inside my own head and knew that trying to escape was futile, as these demons are reality-based and they would simply be right there waiting for me when I got back. For hours I was tormented and my brain felt like it was sizzling. This is the only trip I’d ever pondered killing myself to end the madness, but that would be too merciful an end for me. The classic “chill out, ride it out, it’s only a drug and it will pass” approach did not work because these were not things that were being blown out of proportion by drug induced paranoia, they are real and equally horrible sober. There was no grounding myself with pleasant things I normally use as anchors during a rough trip because I did not deserve anything beautiful. I was being punished and had to face it.

My brain was growing extremely tired of processing input after the sensory overload from the movie and the psychological chaos that was finally beginning to slow down. Music and TV were just appalling, but lying silently in the dark was uncomfortable too, as I was still wired and restless. The sun would be up soon and I didn’t want to still be in this state when my bf woke up. I normally object to aborting rough trips with the aid of other chemicals but I had reached my breaking point. I don’t have any benzos so I took 25mg of melatonin, which proved to be useless anyway (10 usually knocks me out cold). I tied a bandana around my eyes to keep them shut and I lay silently in the dark, concentrated on breathing and staying calm as terrible vivid scenes played in my head. My muscles, especially neck and jaw, were more tense than they had ever been from any psychedelic (I thought acid was bad) so I took a 5/500 Vike, the only pain reliever I had. It did nothing but make me feel an alarming Salvia-like pull for 20 minutes. It occurred to me that I hadn't eaten since early the previous afternoon and physically processing some food might held my mind and body meet up somewhere in the middle.

After a small bowl of cereal and soymilk, I felt slightly better - exhausted but still having trouble finding sleep. I took 20mg more melatonin wrapped the bandana around my eyes again as the sun was coming up by this point. My final decision was to accept my fuck ups, know that I have lots and LOTS of karmic and emotional debt to pay, and there's nothing I can do about it right now so I may as well do my best to get some sleep. Slowly the psychological calamity began to quiet and I watched some interesting animated visual scenes of giant battling space stations, very 2D and reminiscent of Masters of the Universe type animation.

In closing, I want to thank you guys again for your support during my difficult trip. I know there were many factors working against me this time, but I don't know if I will ever try this combo again, simply because of the strange physical effects I was experiencing. I also wonder how much of a role my menstral cycle played in all of it...

 

Thanks for the report SB, you did a great job describing everything, I could really empathize. Hope your next psychedelic experience is more positive!

 

at least you were able to play it cool in the theaters.

how experienced are you with 2c-i and 4 aco DMT on their own?

 

What an amazing trip report. Thank you so much for sharing this. The detail is amazing.

The fact that your cycle began 2-3 days before you dosed probably factored a bit into how you felt physically and your less than ideal mental setting, but it really sounds like you might have been due for something like this. Not deserved it. No way. Just due.

You are a psychonaut extraordinaire. There is a price to be paid for this role and you got presented with a bill on your birthday. i just want to give you a gigantic :grouphug: Non psychonauts are unwilling to face (much less attempt) this work without holding hands with a psychotherapist for years and sometimes not even then . . .

Please be kind to yourself. It is very, very hard work that you did in the early a.m. hours of Monday morning to welcome you into this new quarter century of life and maturity . . .

Peace & Love,
Spicey Cat
Brrrrp & Head Bumps

 

glad you made it through sb, sounds like a rough trip. Was there any type of resolution or peaceful acceptance to the mistakes you made in the past year ? Do you feel anything worthwhile came from this experience or was it just all bad?

 

Thanks for the replies guys

Thanks for the pep talk Spicey! Also good to get a ladies' perspective on the period thing.

MMT - I've done 2c-i probably about 40 times, and this was my 4th time with 4-aco. I've had it twice by itself at 22mg and 27mg, and one other time at 10mg mixed with 150mg MDMA. The 27mg experience was intense, but nowhere near as difficult as this one.

GB - No, I didn't find any peace during the trip, it was mostly horrific but toward the end I decided that from now on I will work on repaying the karmic and emotional debt I've wracked up since there is nothing I can do to reverse those mistakes. I had a wonderful afterglow yesterday and feel pretty good today too, just feels good to be alive and appreciate life even though I feel like I'm living on borrowed grace. A sense of having used too many "get out of jail free" cards that I hope I'll be able to shake within the next few days or weeks...

 

There you go. Funny that you used the word "grace" - that's what I was thinking can happen. How straightening up can be grace. Nevermind about repaying or reversing. Just letting it go by realizing the pain caused - you've got that part down - and not doing it anymore.

Sometimes it's just a drug and sometimes it's revelation.

 

good read. rough trip. i had an emotionally heavy mushroom trip on the same day. i hadn't done mushrooms in a couple years at least, and i ate an eighth. it doesn't sound like my trip was was as difficult as yours though.

about the 2ci comeup nausea - you said that you usually don't notice the nausea because you are up doing stuff. i have kinda noticed the opposite - that if i lay still for the first hour or so after dosing (2ce) that the nausea is less noticeable than if i was walking around that whole hour. but maybe that is what i found because that is what i was looking for. i had read that advice, probably on HF.

i hope you work through your personal demons. you should try to talk to someone. if you can't talk to anyone you know, maybe try telling a stranger. my PM box is open

 

liquid - Yeah, those realizations toward the end of the trip were what made it worth it for me. After all I went through, at least coming out of that with that knowledge helped me know it wasn't all in vain.

pork - I find 2c-i to produce more unproductive nausea than 2c-e. Toward the middle/end of 2c-e I definitely experience some gastro discomfort and usually get the shits pretty bad, but I don't feel it during the comeup. I did eat a little around 2:00pm (only because at that point of the afternoon I was going to call it off completely) and I normally don't eat anything for at least 12 hours before a trip so I'm sure that contributed to the nausea - which overall wasn't that bad and lasted only about an hour. The body load and nausea used to affect me much worse when I was younger. I'm either used to it now, or my moving/keeping occupied during comeup helps. I only threw up once ever from 2c-i, I was 18 and I worked all day and couldn't wait any longer to eat so I had a cup of soup about an hour before dosing. Never had that problem again.

But thanks, I may take you up on the offer sometime

 

I found some ginger chews lying around my apartment as I was moving into the other room today SB, if you ever need some don't hesitate to ask.

 

i have usually eaten in the last 5 hours at least when i take any psychedelic. i usually give myself 2 hours minimum to digest.

 

My inbox is open as well SB

Wow, what a TR. I really enjoyed reading that and I really enjoyed how you handled the things you went through, you are built for this!

4-aco-dmt does not hesitate in piercing through all our little lies and stories and bringing up the filthiest, most evil and depraved garbage hiding in forgotten corners of our minds. I think it is one of the most promising psychotherapeutic tools in existence. I've said this before but nothing intimidates me more than this substance, not even DPT. I mean with DPT there is untold horrors to the newly initiated, but those horrors end after the peak. With 4aces, you can really have dramatically traumatic facts brought into your awareness that are salient to every day life. Yet it is also possibly the single most gentle and beautiful substance out there. Hell of a fast come up too, I always get first alerts a minute or two after dosing and feel the trip begin in earnest 10 minutes later.

Have not tried 2c-i yet but would not have thought this to be a good combo from what i know of 4aces and 2c-x. I am actually not sure I would ever mix anything with 4aces, it is such a richly complex fine wine, I fear anything added to it would muddle and pollute the experience. MAYBE mdma. Maybe.

Can you imagine LSD + 4-aco-dmt? I can't. I'm not sure I'm able to handle such a thing.

I'm happy for you because I know this will make you even stronger.

 

LOL I know you hate those things don't you! I lurrrrve the peanut ones and I totally meant to buy some the other day but I didn't feel like going all the way out to Wegmans or an organic market just for them. omnomnomnom

 

Yeah Writer, you're spot on with everything you just said! I don't think I'll be mixing 4-aco anymore. It doesn't NEED anything more IMO, just a dose increase if anything, and both times I've mixed it, it seemed to be unhappy that I wasn't giving it my undivided attention. It felt like it was struggling with and trying to cancel out the 2c-i the whole time, if that makes any sense. LSD + 4-aco seems like it might be overkill, as they are both so complete in their own ways... LSD probably a little moreso but that's just the nature of the beast.

I'm definitely grateful for having had this experience. It was certainly my most difficult trip to date, but I don't regret it in the least. The past 2 days I've felt wonderful to be alive and just enjoying the afterglow. It's crazy how an intense experience at the time feels like it's ripping you apart and doing irreversible psychological damage (at least that's how I felt.. felt like I really fucked myself up for a while there) can leave you feeling more complete and at peace than ever before. Sheer magic.

 

yea this combo scared the shit outta me too i think i did 25mg of each... i cant even remember now
i wont be trying it again either

 

I was actually planning on doing that this weekend, I wanna get more familiar with 4aco first though, as I have limited experience with it.

surprisingly 4acodmt seems to give me more physical side effects then shrooms,lsd, or dmt...It makes regular everyday pains such as stomach aches, headaches, bruises, sore joints almost immobilizing to me during the comedown...but I still go through it with a smile on my face from whatever the fuck just went down in mah brainz.

I would think lsd+4acodmt would have little recreational value compared to theraputic value......both insist on showing or changing your flaws, and dont care what you think about it.

 

Interesting... can you remember anything from it at all? Did you have any physical side effects? I'd love to compare notes as I don't know anyone else who's done the combo.

 

There are like no bad physical side effects from 4-aco-dmt up the butt......just saying.

 

i gotta ask you experienced folks: Does the 4-aces have a weird dose-response curve? i tried 13 mg and found it to be very gentle with little or no body load, very psychedelic, not too elicitive of dark material and very short acting . . . i was seriously thinking of trying more like 20 mgs next time but now you all have me wondering if i should be prepared for the no-holds barred trip of a lifetime . . .

 

I have limited experience but even with your small stature I think you'll be alright with 20 mgs. I took 30 mgs at a Tool Concert and was only getting subtle hints of being uncomfortable, slight claustrophobia from being around so many people, alot of them with black shirts and unfriendly stares. Yes it does seem to have a sharp dose/response curve though.