10,000 Clergy members endorse evolution

http://www.uwosh.edu/colleges/cols/religion_science_collaboration.htm

It's a short statement, but well said.

 

Timothy 4:3-4 Paul says, "For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths. I would say Paul nailed that one. According to the scriptures another sign of Christ return is the great falling away from Biblical truth, this would have to happen at the same time the Jews are returning to Israel.

 

Jesus never once told his followers , "read the torah" or "convince people of the literal accuracy of the creation story" or "teach them about Jewish history" or anything like that.

What he told them to do was "Love god, Love your nieghbor, and preach the good news of the remission of sins".

That was the only mission he gave them.

 

anyway, How is Genisis doctrine?

If you read it literally, and believe it--it's history.
If you read it literally and disbelieve it, it's myth.

Doctrine is a system of laws and teachings. the only way you can get either of those out of genisis is to read it alogorically (which Paul did btw), otherwise it's just shit that happened that may or may not mean anything or have any value other than historical.

 

The questions I have for Campbell, JDFU and others who so adamantly oppose evolution are -

What do you know about evolution?

Do you know what evolution actually teaches?

Do you understand what the theory of natural selection actually, explicitly says well enough so that (Ideological interests notwithstanding) you could explain it to others?

Are you sure that what you reject is actually the theory of evolution and not some unfounded approximation that fits your theology?

If so, or if not, what concepts, explicitly stated within the theory (theories?) of evolution, do you not accept, and why?

I would hope you would respect these honest questions with honest, well-considered responses.

Thank You

Peace and Love

 

This is intelligent and reasonable...maybe the difference between a Christian and a Funndamentalist?

Within the community of Christian believers there are areas of dispute and disagreement, including the proper way to interpret Holy Scripture. While virtually all Christians take the Bible seriously and hold it to be authoritative in matters of faith and practice, .... a core component of human knowledge. We ask that science remain science and that religion remain religion, two very different, but complementary, forms of truth.

 

This statement, after reading it, I can absolutely 100% support.

Yes, I do believe that Yahweh (and Allah, and Krishna, and Zeus) should be taught to others as they wish -- just not in a science class.

It'd be like telling someone to create a diagram of a complex sentence, in a geometry class, and then telling them that if they fail, they're going to burn in Hell for all eternity.

 

I think the reason most fundies are anti-evolution is because "Created in his likeness" and they think that beliving in evolution will make God a monkey because we evolved from such.

I simply don't belive in evolution because I think we are de-evolving. We are caught up in "simplicty""convience" and "can i turn on my light/tv with out getting off the couch" yeah we're really making steps in the right direction! OH and lets not forgot all the racisim and hate, there goes "well our mind are evolving so we won't need physical strength"! BAH! who cares where we came from? Isn't it more important to spread love and joy?

 

Sure, because the arctangent of the absolute value of the quantity negative x to the third power plus x squared, divided by the fourth root of x, is "simple."

Convenience is evolutionary. We gained more conveniences as we evolved ... fire ... tools ... shelter ... agriculture ... computers ...

And, "can I turn on my light/tv without getting off the couch" is efficiency. In this case, efficiency happens to be so efficient that it makes humans lazy. But so do calculators. And hey: where would we be today without calculators? We'd still be back at the arctangent of the absolute value of the quantity negative x to the third power plus x squared, divided by the fourth root of x ...

Let's also not forget that we don't have to compete over who is going to eat anymore, and we don't have to pillage for food.

Racism and hate are a part of the human condition. Without them, there would be no equality and love. Our world is dualistic like that. Sometimes, you gotta take the bad with the good.

Historians.

Yes! It is.

 

I was watching a documentary on the CBC last night (The Cross and the bones, it was good to watch, but didn't really make a point) and it was about the conservative Christians (they labeld them as evangelical, they could have been they could have not been) in Drumheller, Alberta contrasted with the evolutionist dinosaur hunters in that area (it is Canada's dinosaur capital for all those who don't know). during the interview with the main evolutionist supporter, he said somethign along these lines:

"If you look at Genesis, it is all there. It says that Earth was created and water and earth were together. Then it says that they seperated, and that all life formed in the water, then moved onto the land. However, the bible says it happened in 6 days, whereas scientists say it took billions of years. All this fight is about is numbers".

To an extent I agree with that, when you get down to it, it is only numbers, but with creationists they propose something else: God creating it, and that is where they cease to be the same. For me it doesn't matter what I believe in (on the topic of the origin of life). As Kris pointed out, it is far better to live a good life and spread love to others than fret over how we got here or who put us here.

Also, de-evolution isn't the same as evolution. Evolution is the gradual change of species over time due to natural selection. De-evolution is the apparent break-down of society.

 

Don't misread Paul. He never mentions the bible or jews. The people he talks of could be anyone, depending on what you believe.

 

Lol that post was a joke for the most part. Also I don't think Historians are as worried about human origins as much as an anthropologist lol

 

If god supposedly made only one man and one woman, how could the human race vary so much without evolution?

 

Just where people see "The first" and assume "The Only" lol. But who knows!

 

i don't think many christians deny the evolution within the human race itself, its the whole ape human link is the problem. evolution does happen, look around at all the variations
peacex

 

suggested reading relating to god and evolution: 'the future evolution of man'

 

The Book of Genisis is the first Book that gives us insight into what God is all about. If you want to really know God, you would be foolish to push Genisis out of the picture.
In 2 Timothy 3:16 it tells us, "all scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:"
Genisis is history, and is a warehouse of information. And the one thing about history, is those who forget it, are destined to repeat it. God gave the examples of Sodom, and Gamora to describe what will happen to the future end time Babylon. God speaks of a nation that will exist in the day when the Jews are returning to Israel. The people of this nation God states are proud against the Holy God of Israel.
God then tells us that this nations, and all of her cities will be destroyed by fire by northern nations. And this destruction will come in one hours time.
As America industry leaves the States for cheap labor, other countries will become stronger, and a number of them will soon have the ability to assemble nukes. Soon, America will nolonger be the only big kid on the block. Iran hates Israel, and they hate America as well. America will not have the will to stop all the nut case countries who want nukes. There will arise Northern nations with the power to destroy America and her cities in one hours time, just as the Bible declared. And that is why the Bible tells us, that future Babylons destruction, will be like the destruction of Sodom and Gamora. There is another part of that story that is important for Christians to know, and this is history worth remembering.

 

The answer to your own question is available by thinking through what you just asked.
Your gonna need to think about this for a little bit but when it hits you - pow.. theres your answer!

 

Pow Evolution Wow!

 

I was not misreading what Paul said. Paul spoke of doctrine, which comes from the Bible, just as the prophecy of the Jews returning to Israel in the latter days. The people Paul was speaking of were those who would come and teach that the accounts recorded in the Bible were untrue. Paul believed in the literal Bible, and Paul knew that others would come and claim it was not.