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Old 06-23-2010, 06:21 PM   #1
inthydreams911
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LSD vs Ketamine
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So I read the article on erowid about ketamine use, and how they say lsd and ketamine are like yin and yang, life and death, sensory overload and sensory shutdown.

Can anyone go more in depth about this? I know that lsd's ultimate goal is a state of egoloss and oneness with the universal consciousness.

What is the ultimate goal of ketamine? I heard there is no egoloss. What happens in a k hole? Do you go to the farthest reaches of mind?

I've heard of people easily losing there physical senses, and becoming conscious of there subtle body, not your awareness or soul, but like your astral form (which I guess is still a construct of the greater mind).

Is it worth trying it? Ive heard a lot of brain damage issues with it? Anyone feel wrecked from a one time use of ketamine?

If I were to try it, should I try a little dose first time, then try k hole? Or go straight for the k hole?

How close is a k hole to a breakthrough dmt, craziness wise?
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Old 06-23-2010, 06:27 PM   #2
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It can be very habit forming, pretty much the only Psyc where that is true. Long term use will lead to health issues. Do your research, but in moderation many people enjoy it.

A friend once describes his K trip as this "If you want to know what it's like to die, take some K".

It's a bit of a darker experience then LSD for many people, be ready. For a first time do not try for a K hole IMO.
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Old 06-23-2010, 07:28 PM   #3
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I no longer use ketamine but I used it far more than any other psychedelic (unless we count ecstasy) Like unfocusedanakin said its very compulsive in nature and dark, I also personally don't consider it psychedelic myself. It certainly allows you to peer into a unique way of thinking while on it but to about the level nitrous does to me, Its more of an experience type thing.

The best LSD experiences to me are the complete death/rebirth(yin/yang) process of I guess some eastern thought but I think where the comparison may stem from is LSD and most psychedelics heighten awareness and senses as where ketamine dims awareness and senses, this is most notable in the loss of motor function especially in the k hole where many can barely move. If a profound experience is what you seek then maybe do one low dose to test it and then go straight to a k hole. Eventhough its darker in nature I feel its much easier than LSD and not truly a Near Death Experience. It anasthetizes you and wraps you in a 'warm bubble' so its not scary at all and there is no sense of pain,sorrow, or acceptance which I attribute to a NDE and have experienced on LSD. There is not really chance for a 'bad trip' if you use it in a room with few distractions. Thats not to say certain people dont experience some fear on it tho. It can at its worst just become a desire to constantly go to K land as I feel it deceivingly made me feel something was real or true there.

There are physical concerns associated with ketamine which I have experienced, but LSD is not without flaw, although most of its probblems seem to be mental. Thoroughly read up on ketamine before you decide to use it. Its certainly a profound experience in the k hole but I am much happier now that I don't use it.
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Old 06-23-2010, 07:34 PM   #4
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^ word
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Old 06-23-2010, 08:30 PM   #5
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Ive done quite a bit of each, and I perfer LSD over K any day. I dont do either anymore, though I love love to get my hands on some good acid.
After a good acid trip I'd always come out feeling enlightened, with a sence of direction and accomplishment. Ive never had a BAD trip, but even trips that werent great I felt like I learned something.
K, I dont have that, I come out hazy and lost. I never really liked getting into a hole, espically a deep one. There was one time where everything just turned blue, and I couldent move, apparently I was like that for a few hours. I dont remember anything else, but I know I was very uneasy, not scared, just not rite. That was probably my worst hole, which I guess is pretty good.
The first time I did K I had no idea what it was, so I just did a bump. I remember walking back, well I should say floating, I swore I was like 3 feet off the ground, it was very enjoyable.
I had gotten myself into a few holes mostly to see what it's like, but I would much rather just do a bit and stay outa the hole.
I even tried it intramuscularly and it's a diffrent expierence then snorting it, never put myself in a hole that way though.
Ive never had any health effects from it

If your looking to use it as more of a tool I dont know that you can, I never have.
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Old 06-23-2010, 08:41 PM   #6
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^ Ah intramuscular injection k hole is the pinnacle of the ketamine experience to me. Some say iv injection but that comes and goes way too fast.

I completely agree in that I don't think its really a tool.
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Old 06-23-2010, 11:16 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inthydreams911 View Post
So I read the article on erowid about ketamine use, and how they say lsd and ketamine are like yin and yang, life and death, sensory overload and sensory shutdown.

Can anyone go more in depth about this? I know that lsd's ultimate goal is a state of egoloss and oneness with the universal consciousness.

What is the ultimate goal of ketamine? I heard there is no egoloss. What happens in a k hole? Do you go to the farthest reaches of mind?
Lol, what is "the farthest reaches of mind"? Honestly ketamine is possibly the strangest, most difficult to describe altered state of consciousness possible. At low doses it will feel as though you are no longer "in your life", but are "watching your life", as though in a movie . . further doses will increase the degree of seperation, so you will feel like you are watching a movie of someone reading a book in which an actor participates in a play of your life. There is a kind of outward funneling of awareness, a tunnel vision where your immediate physical reality is still in front of you, but a trillion miles away.

At high doses, 250mg, the K hole, you have no reference points to anything at all, and pure consciousness and the psychic dynamics which determine its interactions rule all. You will learn the laws of mind. You will see the building blocks of thought, the atomic components of cellular transmission of data; you will have your face shoved into the blueprints of awareness itself, and as you are this awareness, you will be as a skeleton of intent and meaning, your shiny mental bones stretching outwards and onwards to infinity and eternity, all insignificant machinations on display for your cool, detached, objective self to inspect and learn from. You will learn much about you, but the difficulty is in (using Mckenna's metaphor) catching the right sized fish. Much of the useful fishies you find will be far too strange and removed from ordinary states of mind to have any use outside the k hole. It is the medium sized fish you must train yourself to be open to, and this takes practice with ketamine.

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I've heard of people easily losing there physical senses, and becoming conscious of there subtle body, not your awareness or soul, but like your astral form (which I guess is still a construct of the greater mind).
I like this formulation although i disagree with some possible metaphysical implications of it. But the subjective sense is certainly of suddenly inhabiting a new corpus, or rather, of being in a state as maximally removed from inhabiting a corpus as imaginable. You become pure spirit, completely distant from the physical reality, even your own immediate physical reality (can't feel a heart beat or your own breathing, which you think you can't feel anyways when you're sober, well you can, your mind just tunes it out. But when it's literally gone, you notice, and it's scary at first! Hence the 'death' theme)

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Is it worth trying it?
Abso-fucking-lutely! Ketamine is worth trying again, and again, and again, until you learn how to use it properly.

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Ive heard a lot of brain damage issues with it? Anyone feel wrecked from a one time use of ketamine?
No, and no. I feel about as wrecked from a K hole as I do from a cannabis session.

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If I were to try it, should I try a little dose first time, then try k hole? Or go straight for the k hole?
If you've only got a bit to play with, take it all, go for the K hole first time. That's what I did with DXM and I am glad I made that decision. If you have some to play with, try these levels: 25mg, 50mg, 75mg, 150mg, 250mg.

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How close is a k hole to a breakthrough dmt, craziness wise?
Come on man, you know this, apples and oranges. It's like asking "How close is getting shot to skydiving, craziness wise?" How could I even begin to compare the two. They are both crazy. A k hole will be less about "overdosing on shock" than DMT is though.
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Old 06-23-2010, 11:30 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by inthydreams911 View Post

Can anyone go more in depth about this? I know that lsd's ultimate goal is a state of egoloss and oneness with the universal consciousness.
Don't push that Buddhist bullshit on me. That is the polar opposite of what I seek in my use of psychedelics. Sorry, I know that a lot of people appreciate that kind of thing, but I hate all these cliche generalizations about tripping and so called enlightenment.

I do drugs to take me further away from any sense of oneness, save from myself. I do it to reflect on individuality and pull myself further away from the mindset pushed on me by nature and nurture.

Sorry, back to the topic at hand.
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Old 06-23-2010, 11:41 PM   #9
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"how close is ketamine to a breakthrough Dmt experience craziness wise?"

intravenous use of ketamine is very similar to a Dmt breakthrough craziness wise, in fact they both whirl with sound on the comeup and vibrate until reality is ripped apart and then you're done as quick as you came. Unless you know someone who is has some schooling with needles though probably don't go the iv route anytime soon, I actually prefer im injection over iv eventhough its not quite as 'crazy'.

I think a more appropriate comparison to ketamine anyways is a salvia breakthrough although its a lot more comforting to me than salvia can be.
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Old 06-24-2010, 01:47 AM   #10
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Thank you Writer! Sounds way better then I thought. Defiantly gonna look more into it.

And as for SamStoned, if you took a large enough dose of lsd or dmt your ego would completely dissolve, you would be forced into awareness, into oneness.
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