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Forum Description: Discuss prescription drugs and their effects
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Old 09-22-2008, 05:18 AM   #11
Feelings Of U4ia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pandaman View Post
right.
and you have the active amino acid floating around?
you have a pill of l-lysine supplement.
it wont work.
get over it.

Vyvanse has been around for a long enough time that if it could be abused, it would of been.
+1
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Old 09-22-2008, 05:22 AM   #12
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First of all, it was a legitimate straight-up question asking if you know what you are talking about, and it was not intended to make you look bad in any way - so there is no need for your attitude.

Second, if you hadn't noticed, my original post has an edit to it that was made before you posted, which states that I added a Protease enzyme (Lactaid) into a small amount of water with the powder from a 70mg Vyvanse capsule. This interaction may cause the separation of the L-lysine from the d-amphetaime. This is how it is separated in the intestine... by the Protease enzyme.

Vyvanse can be abused. Physicians know about this. However, it is not well known HOW TO separate the two molecules so it is not abused near as much as Adderall.
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Old 09-22-2008, 05:25 AM   #13
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The addition of L-lysine to d-amphetaime is a marketing tactic used to get a company another 7 years of a patented ADHD drug. Shire is pushing doctors to prescribe Vyvanse over Adderall.
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Old 09-22-2008, 05:30 AM   #14
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Right.
They didn't do it because they're phasing out Adderall and making Vyvanse their new Flagshit ADHD product because kids can't smash a pill and suck it up their nose.

=O
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Old 09-22-2008, 05:37 AM   #15
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That was one reason for the creation of Vyvanse, another was for profit. It wasn't just for the prevention of abuse, and they didn't succeed in completely preventing it. There are ways of separating l-lysine from d-amphetamine just as there are ways of binding the two molecules to form a compound, and this thread was created to present a new idea, a new method that may work. It was not created for arguments such as those you have pushed for so far. I am just testing it out. I do not claim to be an MD. If you are going to post comments in my thread please keep them mature.
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Old 09-22-2008, 06:17 AM   #16
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Just to let you know. If you're really wanting to do this. And I guess you really are for whatever reason.
You can't use l-lysine supplements.
Going into the whole process and just telling you how I would do it seems to defeat the whole purpose for this. And the only purpose I see for this is just chem experience. Getting ~22mg d-amphetamine from 70mg vyvanse is not cost/time effective at all.

But....google using trypsin to separate the compounds.
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Old 09-22-2008, 06:21 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pandaman View Post
Just to let you know. If you're really wanting to do this. And I guess you really are for whatever reason.
You can't use l-lysine supplements.
Going into the whole process and just telling you how I would do it seems to defeat the whole purpose for this. And the only purpose I see for this is just chem experience. Getting ~22mg d-amphetamine from 70mg vyvanse is not cost/time effective at all.

But....google using trypsin to separate the compounds.
I'll check out trypsin, thanks )

I was using lactaid (protease enzyme) not l-lysine though
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Old 09-22-2008, 06:22 AM   #18
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I just don't understand why people are using pharms for stimulants, I guess. If you are going to, why not just buy adderall or ritalin, something you KNOW can be abused, instead of going through all the trouble with this? I understand you are prescribed to it, but with all the time and money you are spending on this, you could be experimenting with REAL stimulants.

Sometimes I wonder how people who take these kinds of things for a high would react to a REAL stim...

I personally don't like stims, so I might be a little biased, but honestly, just get real stims if you want to get high that much. Use the medication for your ADHD as it was directed...

Unless you are one of the many kids who knows how to fake it to get stims, if so then I really don't even have anything to say to you.
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Old 09-22-2008, 06:23 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pandaman View Post
Just to let you know. If you're really wanting to do this. And I guess you really are for whatever reason.
You can't use l-lysine supplements.
Going into the whole process and just telling you how I would do it seems to defeat the whole purpose for this. And the only purpose I see for this is just chem experience. Getting ~22mg d-amphetamine from 70mg vyvanse is not cost/time effective at all.

But....google using trypsin to separate the compounds.
Or just tell your doctor to switch you to adderall or ritalin if you are so desperate to get high.
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Old 09-22-2008, 06:43 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Feelings Of U4ia View Post
Or just tell your doctor to switch you to adderall or ritalin if you are so desperate to get high.
Ok, try not to jump to conclusions. I do not use my ADHD medication to get high. I do not know how to make myself more clear to you.

There were many people here interested in separating the two molecules, for example;

You

If you don't remember, you posted this a few hours ago on the first page of my thread:


Quote:
Originally Posted by Feelings Of U4ia View Post
I don't know anything about chemistry, but I don't see how ingesting L-Lysine can cut off the L-Lysine that bonds to d-amphetamine? Adding more of the same doesn't seem like it would cancel it out, but again I don't know the first thing about chemistry.

I hope someone who has some experience can help, because I am interested in this also, even though I don't particularly care for amphetamines.
I am researching ways to separate the two molecules for a reason. If the d-amphetamine is separated and mixed in water, it can be very accurately measured into different doses of d-amphetaime, which will act more quickly with a shorter duration if not binded with L-lysine. Thus, it can be taken during the early afternoon and still give you the necessary concentration for work and/or school, while also allowing your body to go to sleep at a reasonable time because the duration is much shorter.

When Vyvanse is taken orally, the compound of L-lysine and d-amphetaime is carried in the blood to brain cells, but the molecule d-amphetaime cannot access the brain cells because the L-lysine molecule is too large to pass through. Therefore, if the d-amphetaime is separated prior to injestion, it does not need to pass through the intestines before it can be absorbed as pure d-amphetaime and passed into the brain cells to help manage ADHD symptoms.

From eveningpsychiatrist.com:

"Hereís how it works. In the lab they took the dextroamphetamine molecule and stuck it onto a protein molecule. You swallow the capsule with the compound inside and it is absorbed from your intestine into your bloodstream and goes to your brain. However, the amphetamine molecule canít get into your brain cells to help your concentration because the protein molecule is too big to get through the door into your brain cells. Enzymes in the body cleave the amphetamine from the protein. I use the following analogy to help my patients understand. The situation is like a waiting line outside a nightclub. The Vyvanse compounds of dextroamphetamine and attached protein molecules are like people with large backpacks that are too big for the small doors into the club. The people need the assistance of the bouncers at the door to help remove their backpacks and grant permission to enter the club. The bouncers activity is similar to the enzymeís action. They allow the patrons to enter at a regulated rate. The longer the line of patrons, or Vyvanse, the later in the day the last amphetamine enters the brain cells. There is a limited number of these enzymes in your body so they put a ceiling on the rate of entry and the concentration level of amphetamine in your brain cells. Hence, you canít overdose or abuse the amphetamine to get high concentrations of amphetamine into your brain.

The longer duration action of Vyvanse is also related to this rate limited enzyme action. If we raise the dose of Vyvanse, we lengthen the waiting line of Vyvanse-protein molecules waiting to be cleaved to enter the brain. We can adjust up the dose so that you can have consistent focus from morning to bedtime. We adjust the one time morning dose of Vyvanse in this fashion. Pull the capsule apart and dump the ingredients into a measuring cup of water. Stir the solution and the Vyvanse compound dissolves in the water. Remember that the protein is only cleaved from the amphetamine by enzymes inside the body. After you have calculated the duration of hours that a particular dose of Vyvanse lasts, you drink the amount of solution proportionate to the number of hours you want the Vyvanse concentration to last. If you want it to last longer than your capsule dose, you swallow your capsule plus the measured solution. If you are going to have a short day or forget to take your Vyvanse until later in the day, you just take the proportionate fraction of your dose in solution form. If you find out later in the day one day that youíre going to need to concentrate longer that day than what you had dosed for that morning, you can take an additional partial fraction of a capsule dose at that time. You may then save the remaining aliquot of solution in the refrigerator for ingestion the next day."


Therefore, if I was able to separate the compound PRIOR to injestion (which is what this thread is all about, the SUBJECT of this thread), I would be able to accurately measure a dose of a freely floating d-amphetamine molecule in water. This may be injested with respect to the dose needed with a much quicker onset, as well as a shorter duration, which may be desired over in some situations. Sometimes I may need the 10 hour release for school from AM to early evenings, but sometimes I need a quick action ADHD medication that won't keep me up at night if I take it in the afternoon. Don't jump to conclusions and think that everyone who posts here is looking to get high. That isn't right, it is immature and close-minded.


How is this difficult to comprehend???
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