I Suppose This Goes Here: 2012

[grim_rebel]

http://www.2012.com.au

[MrRee]

http://www.2012.com.au (http://www.2012.com.au/)Interesting site. Thanks for the link.
But......................
I'm not at all so sure of this "divine plan" thing, because nature follows gradients of change that may or may not potentiate and express. Just because we only get to see what happens doesn't mean that's all there was to the "plan". What about the infinite number of possibilities that didn't happen? Were they "not part of the plan" or "part of the plan"? For me, the "plan" thing relies too heavily on a divine embodiment rather than naturally divine expression.
So the 2012 thing may (or may not) be a point of potential expression that, after crossing it's threshold, we change our evil ways, or maybe the solar system goes "pop". Though the Mayans and Inca show that each time such occasion arises, destruction and famine on earth result. This time by solar fire, it seems.
I think I'll take the family on a picnic & go fishing Dec 21 2012

[grim_rebel]

Fishing sounds good.

In terms of te infinite number of other possibilities, I think that has to do with the infinite number of other universes. But I do see your point.

There are just too many coinciding events happening on that date (21/12/2012). For example, a really interesting book that I would really advise anyone to read if anything, for the ability of the author to put forth a thesis and really go about proving it in a systematic and admirable manner - "The Fingerprints Of The Gods" by Graham Hancock.

In this book, Hancock puts forth fact and then analysis. Firstly, he shows us a map (I believe it is the Cook map but I could be wrong) that is existent and which he photocopied. On this map is an ancient image of Antarctica BEFORE it was covered with ice. Recent satellite heat images, which govern the next page in the book, show that the map aligns itself almost perfectly with what Antarctica would look like without ice. Given that the map is several hundred years old, how on earth could Antarctica be mapped, without the ice that has been there for thousands of years, to such an accurate degree?

Hancock goes on to show that there have been many civilizations as advanced as us, before us, and that they have all been wiped out by a re-occurent rotational shift in the earth's crust.

I'm really not as articulate as the writer is, but it really is an interesting book. The focal point is that Hancock determined the next shift to be...and this is going to surprise you...2012!

hehe... either way, I just feel as if 2012 holds more to it than any other prophecy, doomsday or not, in the past. I just can't accept that we're THAT stupid to believe this without anyone proving it wrong. But then I suppose we only have to wait and see.

So many books have talked about it though. "Ishmael" by Daniel Quinn hinted at it, "The Celestine Prophecy" acknowledged it, "The Fingerprints of the Gods" states it, and numerous other books regarding Mayan culture puts the date forth as a turning point in culture, intellect, dexterity, life, shit I don't know. But I want to.

[MrRee]

It was the Piri Reis map.
I've read Hancock's book. IMHO his style is pretentious. But some good info all the same.

[grim_rebel]

I could see where you are coming from in Hancock being a little pretentious. I know this girl who's family is actually friends with the Hancocks. She says all he does is sit in his basement, research and smoke weed.

I'm just curious to how you see the whole 2012 situation? It seems as if you've read all, if not more of the data regarding 2012 than I have, yet you have a different opinion. Age probably fills the gap; will you tell me what you think?

[MrRee]

I could see where you are coming from in Hancock being a little pretentious. I know this girl who's family is actually friends with the Hancocks. She says all he does is sit in his basement, research and smoke weed.
I'm just curious to how you see the whole 2012 situation? It seems as if you've read all, if not more of the data regarding 2012 than I have, yet you have a different opinion. Age probably fills the gap; will you tell me what you think?LOL ~ I got kicked out of Hancock's website forum for questioning the validity of his hypotheses!
There are few alternatives the "the end is nigh" scenario surrounding 2012, other than that elucidated by Terence McKenna and reviewed below. McKenna's theory is described in detail in his book "The Invisible Landscape, Mind, hallucinogens, and the I Ching" by Dennis & Terence McKenna. It is a theory that I personally find acceptable based upon the authors unbiassed sincerity in exploring consciousness and human potential (described in "The Archaic Revival" by Terence McKenna).
An Open Mind is all that anyone needs to advance their potential. A closed mind is all that is needed to retard it.

Inspired by this influence Terence McKenna was instructed in a certain transformation of numbers derived from the King Wen sequence of I Ching hexagrams. This led eventually to a rigorous mathematical description of what Terence calls the timewave, which correlates time and history with the ebb and flow of novelty, which is intrinsic to the structure of time and hence of the temporal universe. A peculiarity of this correlation is that at a certain point a singularity is reached which is the end of history-or at least is a transition to a suprahistorical order in which our ordinary conceptions of our world will be radically transformed. The best current estimate for the date of this point is December 21, 2012 CE [common era], the winter solstice of that year and also the end of the current era in the Mayan calendar.

What is most remarkable is that Mckenna only found out about the 2012 maya/inca time relevance long after he had demonstrated his timewave theory to be mathematically correct, and that the date 2012 was naturally mathematically arrived at in due proces, and not artificially calculated.
I quite like the description ~ a singularity is reached which is the end of history-or at least is a transition to a suprahistorical order in which our ordinary conceptions of our world will be radically transformed
That could mean anything fromalien knowledge dissemination to natural expansion of human understanding.
http://www.alternativeculture.com/spirit/timewave.htm
http://www.alternativeculture.com/books/observe5.htm
http://www.alternativeculture.com/books/books7.htm#maya

[grim_rebel]

The Celestine Prophecy and in some part, Daniel Quinn's "Ishmael" pointed towards a change in consciousness as well.

It's just so difficult to separate what is real from what could and could never be. I knew about McKenna's timewave, I just don't understand what is supposed to happen.

On one hand I'm reserving survival books and on the other i'm delving into economical philosophy, a great book i'm reading which i'm sure you've seen is, "The Worldly Philosophers". I feel so stupid for having argued governments and the merits of communism over capitalism or this over that, when I didn't know the real, factual basis for any of them.

Finally i'm learning, and now it is all supposed to come to an end? How can the children of tommorow be psychic? What will that leave the people of today?

How come none of this information ever gets mainstream? Especially Hancock's book, i'm sure some scientist would have taken pleasure in ripping his argument to shreds, sending the guy back into his basement to smoke a pound.

In all honesty i'm just confused. I don't know what to do.

[MrRee]

The Celestine Prophecy and in some part, Daniel Quinn's "Ishmael" pointed towards a change in consciousness as well.

It's just so difficult to separate what is real from what could and could never be. I knew about McKenna's timewave, I just don't understand what is supposed to happen.

On one hand I'm reserving survival books and on the other i'm delving into economical philosophy, a great book i'm reading which i'm sure you've seen is, "The Worldly Philosophers". I feel so stupid for having argued governments and the merits of communism over capitalism or this over that, when I didn't know the real, factual basis for any of them.

Finally i'm learning, and now it is all supposed to come to an end? How can the children of tommorow be psychic? What will that leave the people of today?

How come none of this information ever gets mainstream? Especially Hancock's book, i'm sure some scientist would have taken pleasure in ripping his argument to shreds, sending the guy back into his basement to smoke a pound.

In all honesty i'm just confused. I don't know what to do.
In the end, nothing really matters. I mean, life on this planet is not the bea all and end all of reality. It's just a compnent of it. The bottonm line is that humans are no different from any other animal in the wild when it comes to natural disasters. We are at the mercy of the elements.
A question I asked myself during the cold war years was 'is it worth surviving a nuclear holocaust?' In a holocaust, the people who die are the lucky ones. The poor bastards who survive have big problems, and there might not be any happy hollywood ending for them. So you've gotr to think at some time "what price do I pay if I survive?"
In life, it's a very good philosophy to always consider that death is like a shadow that is always following you. Truly it follows every living thing. So the question becomes "what am i doing with the gift of Life that I have now?" rather than "what will I do if I die?" or "what if something bad will happen?"
Life is a gift of moments that you can grasp or ignore. Most people look towards the next moment, then the next then the next, without ever fully appreciating or using this precious moment that we have right NOW.
Having died as a child and being given the option of "staying and resting a while or going back", I realize by my mistake of coming back that life is a very momentary thing that can disappear in a moment. Life should be lived with death in mind, so that we indeed treasure the full worth and value of every monment that we have. By doing so, one can detatch from the trivia of day-to-day life to the extebnt that life can be more fully lived and experiencedf but, more importantly, when death arrives one can easlily let go and progress as nature intends rather than cling to this realm for no other reason that it ia all that we know.
Seize the moment. Live it to the fullest.
Life is for eternal living, but for the moment, now is all that we have.

[grim_rebel]

Yes, I concur.

I knew all of this; did I give you the impression that I wasn't enjoying the infinite present?

The weird thing is I was asking about Hancock's book. Lol!

Anyways, it's good that you got that out.

[cerridwen]

huh, neat site.... but for some reason I'm waiting for it to sell me something...


http://www.2012.com.au/You_God.gif