If..

[Peace]

If I deny your existence, does that mean you're not real?

[the dauer]

Yes.

[kindwoman]

Only in your eyes I do not exist, not in my own or others.

[darrellkitchen]

If I deny your existence, does that mean you're not real?Interesting thoughts going on in your head there, Peace. Have you given any thought as to how denying our existence would mean we are not real?

Darrell

[TrippinBTM]

No. Your mental hallucinations do not create reality for anyone but yourself.

[Common Sense]

No. Absolutely not.

[Hikaru Zero]

If you just say that I don't exist ... but you can still percieve me and my actions ... then I still exist, even if it's only as raw data that is being fed to your brain through a Matrix-like device.

If you say I don't exist, and then just kind of ... stop percieving me, then I MAY not exist anymore; it depends on whether or not I existed in some kind of tangible world to begin with; if not, then, I don't exist anymore. But if I do, then you're just hallucinogenic now.

[Kharakov]

If you say I don't exist, and then just kind of ... stop percieving me, then I MAY not exist anymore; it depends on whether or not I existed in some kind of tangible world to begin with; if not, then, I don't exist anymore. But if I do, then you're just hallucinogenic now.
I'm willing to take bets that you exist. I'll give 10:1 odds. Paypal.

[Sebbi]

No... You're just in denial.

[Hikaru Zero]

I'm willing to take bets that you exist. I'll give 10:1 odds. Paypal.

Haha, I wouldn't be willing to take that bet. ;)

[Kharakov]

Haha, I wouldn't be willing to take that bet. ;)
lol. I figured the odds were against me that you would. :)

[Hikaru Zero]

lol. I figured the odds were against me that you would. :)

If I did, I'd have to be a real asshole, because that is a horrible bet. =P

[Colours]

how do you know anything else ever happens though? if a tree falls in the forest and no one is around does it make a sound? no, it never happend!

[Colours]

i mean do you think billions of things are going on at the same time?? theyre not its all in our head yeah how 'bout that

[Hikaru Zero]

how do you know anything else ever happens though? if a tree falls in the forest and no one is around does it make a sound? no, it never happend!

The tragic flaw of that idea though ... let's break down the sentence.

If (a conditional)

A tree falls (a condition)
Noone is around to hear it (another condition)

Does it make a sound? (a question)

The sentence, by virtue of its structure, requires that a tree must fall, in order for the question "does it make a sound?" to be answered.

The definition of a tree falling requires a tree, and the action of falling, which is accompanied by sound.

Even if nobody is around to hear it, the tree falling is accompanied by a sound (and you can't just say "well the tree never really fell" because the condition REQUIRES that a tree falls). Maybe the tree doesn't make a sound that is audible to any humans, and it doesn't make a sound that MATTERS, but there is still sound by definition.

[barefoot hippie]

if i close my eyes i cant see you
does that mean you dont exsist?
exsistance is much more than a matter of seeing, hearing, touching, tasting smelling
existance is much more than one persons perceptions

[thumontico]

An infant lacks object permanence, ie he doesn't realize that when you put your hands in front of your face, your face does not cease to exist.

Whether a falling object makes a sound is never reliant on whether there is someone there to percieve the sound. Simply because you are not certain does not automatically mean the other extreme must be correct.

The same is with your God. Although it is probable that He does not exist, since there is a possibility that He does exist, he must. The same is with the tree. "Since we cannot be certain that the tree made a noise we must assume that it did not."

One's desire for meaning, need for the comfort of a higher power, and ultimately ego will lead one to disreguard probability in exchange for emotional contentment.

Solipsism has many problems.

[Kharakov]

Maybe the tree doesn't make a sound that is audible to any humans, and it doesn't make a sound that MATTERS, but there is still sound by definition.
I think there is still a smatter of matter when the tree falls. Matter matters.

[Kharakov]

One's desire for meaning, need for the comfort of a higher power, and ultimately ego will lead one to disreguard probability in exchange for emotional contentment.
Thank God for that. Probabilities are probably about 80% accurate anyway.

[Colours]

fine if someone sees a tree standing then leaves then comes back the next morning and its lying on the ground, did the tree ever fall.

[Hikaru Zero]

fine if someone sees a tree standing then leaves then comes back the next morning and its lying on the ground, did the tree ever fall.

Depends on your definition of fall. Did it hit the ground? Maybe not. It could have been cut down and caught by a machine, and then layed down. But it still moved, yes.

[Kione]

Your mind makes absolutly no difference between actually seeing the tree standing and remembering that the tree once stood. If there is no difference to your mind between a standing tree and what used to be a standing tree does it really matter that it has fallen?

[TrippinBTM]

Your mind makes absolutly no difference between actually seeing the tree standing and remembering that the tree once stood. If there is no difference to your mind between a standing tree and what used to be a standing tree does it really matter that it has fallen?
I think it matters to the tree...

[StonerBill]

i think everyone but michael missed the philosophy of the question entirely.

What is existance? well to the poster, Peace, if something exists in reality but its existance is not recognised by his mind, then.. for his purposes.. does he exist? if he denies his existance, then in his mind he will cease to exist, and what matters to him if he really does exist, if he, his mind, cant percieve so?

michael put it on a larger scale to say that whats in existance is reliant on what the whole psychic mind-pool percieves. if you dont exist to yourself, and you exist to every other mind, then you still exist. however if your existance is not percieved by any mind then what does it matter to the universe, the universe doesnt sense or think, and so, the fact that you do in fact exist means nothing and affects no one.

I personally dont agree with either of these philosophies, but im pretty sure thats the direction from which the question is being asked.

[Hikaru Zero]

StonerBill:

Maybe you missed it. ;) Hehe.

The way I see it is ...

If a tree that nobody has ever seen falls
And nobody is around to see or hear it fall,
And then if somebody is being chased through the woods and comes across the tree,
Will it still be fallen (if, by your logic, the tree never existed because nobody ever saw it).

Certainly, I don't percieve a billions and billions of planets and stars out there, but if I go looking, I will find them.

THAT is the difference between existing in actuality and existing in someone's mind.

You can, for this purpose, view "actuality" or the state of material existance, AS another mind, that if no other minds percieve something's existance, then actuality still does percieve its existance (and handles it accordingly).

Now, perhaps whether it made a sound when it fell ... perhaps that question doesn't really matter in the end, but that is not to say that a sound wasn't percieved by the "mind" of actuality.

[RavenTheDarkAngel]

Okay let's say no one else thinks you exsist and then you think you don't either, does that make you nonexistant. No. Why?

Because in order for you to think you don't exist you have to think it. And if you think, you exist.

If you continue to think you don't exist and continue to do things and continue to live, then the only thing you are doing in denying the truth. Even if you lived in a world away from all others you'd still be doing things.

In order to not exist you must do nothing. You can't think you don't exist you have to "be" the inexistance. No actions, no thinking, which is impossible. You must think if anything else, even if you think of nothing, you are still thinking.

...hope I didn't lose you.

~Raven